96 replies to this topic

[grmblf]

It's been quite long since the last update so this post is basicaly to tell that I'm still working on this mod and improving it every day. It has passed throught so many stages and it has had so many forms, and I myself have considered making it in several different ways, but after balancing every possibility I think that now it is in it's way to become some day a "finished" mod. So what this means is that I'll still working on this mod, maintaning the same structure and adding improvements and new features as long as this structure/engine allow them.

Finally I desist from attempting to make other mods's spells being cast-able like chargeable spells, because that'd be a big mess that would require a lot of compatibility patches and because there's a big technical issue regarding how magic overhauls mods tweak magic and how chargeable spells makes it's calcs affects the spells. Rather I'll incorporate new chargeable spells simulating these effects and assuming their limitations (I can and will make a Force/Push spell and multiple creature summons, but I can't do new visuals), so if you have some suggestion about certain spells not involving custom-made heavy-scripted effects then please let me know and I'll try to add them.

On another department, about settings/configuration: I'll still making the 'core' version transparent, I mean that it will take the values about magicka cost and magic skill from in-game settings, like v0.26 does, so everyone could make it fits his favorite magic overhaul (or main overhaul, OOO alters magic too). But that's not so good for those that don't play another magic mod or those that think their magic mod's values don't match charging spells, so I'll release several optional plugins with different settings regarding magic schools and mostly magic effects cost, so you could even choose to overwrite the changes an overhaul mod makes to magic by loading one of this plugins after it. To continue with the last example, if you want to play OOO but want a cheaper magic then simply load the appropiate optional plugin (after OOO, of course). I'm planning to make just a few but differenciated 'setting plugins'; to start off that'd be an easy, hard, offenssive, defensive and an own one (recomended, of course). Althought it may be funny that the easy setting makes magic easier for your enemies too

Regarding the features it will have and it might have and regarding making other magic mods features compatible with this one, it's more or less the same like with spells, if I expect my chargeable spells to have some of the other mod's features better I do it myself, so I mean that it will include some of the most wanted/expected features from most popular mods, but it will include them in it's own rather than using other mods. That's not something that makes me feel really proud of the work I'll have to do, but sadly that's the only true option for this mod, because most of other magic mods work by replacing default spells, and therefor sentencing themselves to not being compatible with other mods that alter the same content and not being usable by mods like mine that in order to ignore default data uses their own spells don't mess with default spells. Anyway I've received some good suggestions both here and on the bethesda forums so now I have a decent list of decent features for a decent magic mod, IMO. This are the features I plan to add (some are taken from other mods, some came from diverse ideas and some of them are a mix of both):

- dangerous magic (75% done): charging a spell for long might hurt you, but suffering from spellcasting might make your spell stronger, althought this is a riskful option because the chances for you to loose the spell increase each milisecond. This are really small chances that might range from 5 to 30% and are calculated only twice a second and not each frame. The penalties come in four levels, being them accumulative, and starting each one a second after the last one, at a minimum of 1 second of charge. The chances of suffering from one of this 'bad effects' (and therefor making the next time the check fails you go into next level of penalty) are calculated according to your skill and governing attribute, and it will increase the longer you hold the spell. First level (fisrt time a random percent check fails) you get a little fatigued and get blurred vision. Level 2 you're injuried because of the spell and looses health, blur effect increases. There's a small chance to control the spell and revert to level 1. Level 3, the spell really hurts and all your attributes are damaged. Blur effect increases. Level 4, that's the terminal point, here either the spell is casted automatically or is lost, and either it renders us exhausted or not so the results are unpredictable, but can some way be mastered with high stats, skills and experience. But the counterpart is that every fatigue, health and attribute point consumed this way are added to the spell power like if they were magicka spent (each attribute point counts 5), but that's only useful if the spell is finally being cast : )

- spell's toll (0.05% done): it seems a good idea allowing novices to experiment with magic, althought they should be adviced not to go too far from their capabilities as that could have really bad effects. Again with default spells replaced. My thought on this was to make it part of the dangerous magic feature, so a novice casting a journeyman spell would have an increased chance of being hurt by the spell and maybe loosing the charge, but this seems quite counterproductive precisely because novices at low level and stats will need to charge for longer, and therefor the inherent fatigue loss and the chances for suffering from some penalty (increased due to low skill level), plus the weak result due to a low skill level, seems all to be quite an appropiate toll to cast beyond your skill level, so my final thought was to make every chargeable spell available at novice level. That makes it less viable and less randomized but it's still a fair deal as there are some chanced for unpredicted effects (power increased at stats cost or merely bad effects).

- spells being able to purchase (99.9% done): I had a problem with this and is that NPC shouldnt use chargeable spells (they're not smart enought to charge the spells, and therefor will use them with the last magnitude you cast each of them), but I wanted the spells being displayed in the spell purchase screen, so I've made a script that checks when you enter in a dialog with a NPC, and if that NPC has spells to sell the script checks wich kind of spells they have and adds the chargeable counterpart, and when the dialog is finished it adds back their original spells and removes the chargeable from him/her. It only replaces spells with only one effect and not being scripted, so it doesn't replace other mods's spells and it works for every NPC even from mods! And it doesn't alter a single NPC, it's all made within a script. I'm pretty happy with this solution so by now and unless s big bug arises that'll be the method.

- multiple creatures summoning (-1% un-un-done): that has been requested a few times. While ago I received a message from a user that offered me his multi-summoning script so I didn't really take an in-depth look at this matter, but as I see this user doesn't show up I guess I'll have to read one of those tutorials on the wiki Anyway that's a feature I really want, so somehow that will be done.

There's a lot of more features I'd want to see here, but being realistic, and considering how feasible they are and the efford they take compared to the gameplay result, I think this are the big features it has to have. Then there's the thing about certain spells, but that's almost covered (now there's about 80 different chargeable spells), but anyway suggestions about both certain features and/or spells are welcome.

[documn]

- dangerous magic (75% done):
- spell's toll (0.05% done):
- spells being able to purchase (99.9% done):
- multiple creatures summoning (-1% un-un-done):

Dangerous Magic and Spell's Toll: Are these going to be optional?

Purchase spells: Is this what you were asking about when you were trying to detect the NPC you're talking to?

Multiple Creature Summoning: Do you have an idea for controlling how many creatures to summon, and how long they will last? Because I do, if you're interested.

[alividlife]

Hi grmblf I commented and endorsed your file over at tesnexus

amazing stuff no doubt about it..
working out your calculations is important

but I really do feel you should implement a quest structure?
Robok mentioned the arcane university, and I agree...
Seemed kinda empty but beautiful, it could use more quest related things.

Soo, I mean.. I may be able to voice act for you if you need to make a character .. but I dunno.. that's all up to you, I have a decent home recording studio with all the mics pre-amps and stuff, but!
I SUCK AT MODDING! lol
But I can make CLEAN sounds pretty easily.
I would do it, if you write out what you want it to say and have an idea or are even into the idea...

Regardless...
I know you have your thoughts on how this should be implemented and I will agree with you nonetheless, but it would be cool to have a character in the arcane university that hands a character a book, with all the different types of "Charging Diamonds/orbs/whatever" but then have it very loose..
Like the Health Charging spells could be found right after Kvatch.. in Kvatch.. or something? or even right out-side the sewer in a vanilla new game?
Some could be under waterfalls in the Chorrol Highlands? ..
something very immersive, that allows people to play the game, but also enjoy the adventure of finding them?

Make it a battle to get those level 100 charge summons.. Just pick the harder of the Ayeleid structures out in the wastes of Cyrodil (Sancre Tancre for example).. Dungeons of Vampires for some absorbs.. or whatever...?

Just thoughts.

I mean, even on the other hand, I am enjoying having all the spells at once... Read my post on texnexus i guess

as far as bugs

I have had only 2 occasions of casting, and then entering certain cells, then saving, then finding the save data was corrupt, but since I play FCOM-- F5 is keyed after every kill lol-- I would never claim it was your mod or any other of the 150 mods I am using (and I do love OBSE mods the best)
FCOM really does tear up your game and spit it back out at you.

Regardless,
Chargeable spells is the bomb.

keep up the good work!

[REFALKEN]

good news.. keep working
I'll tell you mor after tryiin the next version...

[grmblf]

@ documn:
good you pointed that out as I didn't make it clear. The "dangerous" stuff will be optional via an ini'd variable (enabled by default), but the "toll" thing I think it will be included with the mod. In fact I named it toll but there's no toll at all, simply spells will all be able at novice level. It will be highly recommended to enable the 'dangerous' feature precisely to add some extra risk when casting powerful spells (because novices will need to charge for long if they want a higher level spell to actualy make something), so in all one thing balances the other. But if someone wants to "cheat" around this and make they obtain only net benefit they could choose to do so.

Yeah, that's why I was asking a way to track conversations, and I could make it thanks to your advice it's very elegant because the player doesn't notice anything, and NPCs only have chargeable spells as long as they're speaking with you

Multi-summons: I tell you my idea but don't hesitate sharing your opinions, if there's something that could improve it I'll take it. I was thinking of stablishing a limit time (maybe 60 seconds?) so if you summon a creature for longer that extra time up to the maximum would be another creature, and so on. But this would make multi summons happen only with creatures of a (very) lower level than yours (ie, for the time you can summon a daedroth probably you can summon 3 skeletons). Anyway I haven't started yet with this so suggestions and advices are much appreciated, either on playability and technical stuff.


@ alividfire:
Hey thanks man, and thanks for your offering, I'll consider it when (if ever) I start the quest modding, but by now I'm still working on the spells. Anyway, if this mod ever has some quest they won't be that kind of quests. That's ok for special spells that make something special, but that's not the case with Chargeable Spells, in fact in next version they will "replace" (only apparently) all default spells, so there won't be "normal" spells and "chargeable" spells, chargeables spells will be the "normal" ones. Rather I was thinking something more like quests to obtain knowledge and practice in the art of charging your spells, quests that won't give you a specific spell but rather a little improvement to your charging/casting technique. I also think that magic could be something a little more "secret"/valuable/hard to reach, and not as easy as entering the shop and buying some spells, but sincerely such big thing is not in my scope by now.

Level 100 charge summons?? There aren't such spells! There's ONLY ONE version of each spell, and their "level" is determined by YOUR skill level and the amount of magicka you put in that spell. No more you'll have 100 spells or more in your spell list, no more you'll carry useless spells

[documn]

For multiple summons, I had a couple ideas. Each has its own advantages and disadvantages.

#1
- the charge determines how much total summoned time your creatures will share
- modifier taps determine how many creatures to summon.

For example, say you're summoning zombies. You hold down charge long enough to get 100 seconds of zombie time. If you do not tap your modifier key, you summon one zombie for 100 seconds. If you tap once while you're charging, you get two zombies for 50 seconds each. Et cetera.

#2
- charge determines how much total summoned time your creatures will share
- Player taps how many creatures to summon during the first second of charge with cast key

If the player wants one zombie, he presses and holds cast. If he wants two zombies, he double-taps the cast key, and holds it down after the second tap. Etc.

This method keeps the modifier untouched which eliminates some potential problems. For example, if a player wants to summon one clannfear for 100 seconds, I assume he's gotta charge for a while. In the meantime, he may want to block some incoming attacks, but every time he blocks he adds another clannfear.

[forgerofsouls]

Well, sorry for the absence. Been busy with getting a new apartment and getting ready to move in to it (this 10th). But as far as compatability issues with other magic overhauls goes, there is none as far as I can tell with OOO (Oscuro's Oblivion Overhaul) and Midas's Magic. After casting and casting and casting I didn't run into anything significant to report. (And with Midas's Magic, we know that truely is a lot of casting). Your spells worked as intended without disrupting OOO or MM, and normal magic and MM spells do not disrupt your spells. So beyond the little hotkey problem, I saw nothing else to report.

But yeah, I see the work that would be difficult to pull off in making other magic mods chargeable. That would be a large headache. To large imo.

[grmblf]

Hey forger sry mate I didn't see your post, good luck with your new home! Also it's good to hear this one is compatible with other mods, by now I think I'm having as many compatibility as incompatibility reports

As for this mod, I have to test more in-depth two details I've added and I'm releasing the first pre-final and non-beta version expect it for this weekend. It tweaks calculations a bit and also it adds a few new features, nothing completely different but highly improved.

[grmblf]

A NEW VERSION OF Chargeable Spells IS AVAILABLE TO DOWNLOAD!

Get it HERE.

A month and a week after the first release, at time to celebrate the 500 downloads, an almost final version of Chargeable Spells mod is here, and it comes full of hot new stuff. I say it's almost final because it needs some wide public testing to confirm that the issues it presents are only those already known and reported. And here is when you come into the scene, so a big to those of you who take a moment to give some feedback to improve this mod.


Here's the changelog for this new version:

- Added: spells available to purchase, even from NPC from mods.
- Added: spells list auto-updater feature (you get the chargeable version of the spells you have).
- Added: a whole new penalties system with rewards.
- Added: so many missing chargeable spells (absorb/drain/damage/fortify attributes and stats).
- Added: a few default sounds.
- Added: an .ini file with a few customizable options.
- Changed: chargeable spells now can be cast at novice level (this feature may be disabled).
- Changed: lasting spells with magnitude last for double of time.
- Changed: visuals now correspond to the spell you're charging.
- Changed: casting failure sounds correspond to the element or school of the spell you're charging.
- Fixed: being staggered, knocked or silenced renders the PC unable to charge.
- Fixed: increased AoE for the alt. mode has now a cap and it's related to the percentage of magicka spent and not directly to the amount magicka as an absolute value.
- Fixed: fatigue loss now ranges in a smaller interval, being it now smaller than it was for novices, and bigger than it was for highly skilled mages.

Check it out and let me know how it works for you and what do you think about it. Now it works ok for me and I'm really enjoying playing it but there's so many people with very different setups so there will be things I cound't foresee, so do not hesitate posting all your issues with this mod, as well as your thoughts and suggestions, that's always welcome.


grmblf

[grmblf]

Chargeable Spells has been updated to v0.361

Spells purchase system and the spell converter feature have been rewritten into a more optimized and bug-free code, and a lot of settings have been made customizable via ini file, so now it can be better adjusted to everyone's taste.

I think it's the first time in this mod's short existence that there's no bug on sight! yay! Seriously, it's working pretty fine, I just need some more people to confirm it's performing properly and I'll tag it as "finished", althought I'll still adding new spells and features in future releases.

Compatibility with Supreme Magicka and Midas Magic has been confirmed.