25 replies to this topic

[JackTrenton]

I'd like to see it added as an aid item that would give you good karma, it would stay in your inventory allowing you good karma whenever you wanted it. Maybe a demonic bible or something for evil karma.

I always thought it was odd that religion plays such a part in this game but there are no religious texts to read.

[Heyy_Adrian]

Religion is only a minor role. In the whole game, there's only the atom church worshipers and Saint Monica's Church. And the Revelation 21:6 Bible verse.

There's The Children of the Atom and the Catholic Church in Rivet City. You donate to them both for good Karma (unlimited even). For negative karma just simply take what's not yours. I don't really understand why you would request for something like this though, but I have nothing against it either.

[apaosha]

Alternatively, a copy of Thus Spoke Zarathustra could give you a permanent +5 to Int .....

[JackTrenton]

It isn't crammed down your throat, but pretty much everything at the end involved that verse. It's more of a character realism thing, it's obvious James is a Christian man and would probably try to raise his child that way.

It's also instant karma on the go, for when you're out in the wasteland and not anywhere near a church donation place.

[Callighan]

I agree with this idea... but only if Nietzsche is included.

[Lt Albrecht]

Yeah, if this is done it just needs to be a book called something like 'right and wrong: how can you tell?' and have a note added to your pipboy that's a contents

-1 Contents
-2 What ARE right and wrong?
-3 Nietzsche
-4 Kant
-5 St Thomas Aquinas
-6 etc

Just for flavour. Also for mentioning Kant and Nitzsche.

[evilneko]

Let's make it a bit more interesting.

Add a script that gives karma proportional to your current karma--positive, if your currently good, and negative if you're currently bad--though the amount of karma given should be extremely small, 3 points at max.

The item would probably have to be a consumable as far as the game is concerned, and thus replaced after each use. To prevent rapid re-use, use something like the script used to replace your command radios in the personal vertibird mod, but only have it run a few times a day.

[apaosha]

Ah, but consider that since the concepts of right and wrong are inherently subjective to the creator of values (i.e. you or me), the script would have to take into account that the player might find reading the Bible, or Nietzsche, or Kant morally repugnant, depending upon perspective.

Furthermore, one might find that the arbitrary assignment of positive and negative Karma to certain actions objectionable in itself.

For example, killing Roy Phillips and his gang - even though they reveal themselves to be just as bad if not worse than the Tenpenny Residents they murder ... is considered evil? Why? Because they threw the accusation of bigotry first? That accusation is simply an excuse for for Roy's hatred of smoothskins, which no doubt stems from his hatred of his own condition.
That whole situation pissed me off ...

I would be irritated if I found a bible that the game told me made me a better person for reading it - since I, personally, hold the opposite view. Were this mod ever made, I wouldn't download it.

The entire Karma system is flawed, in my opinion. Too arbitrary, too artificial. You can nuke megaton and still end up as a Messiah if you give enough purified water to beggars ....
All it is is a meter that you can swing whichever way you want, according to your whim.

It would have been a better system had certain actions prevented your karma from moving away from a certain alignment. If you nuke megaton, for example, your karma should never rise above neutral. (According to the game's sense of right and wrong, anyway.)

[RozenDoll]

i agree with apaosha. the karma system is pretty much *manure*. i dont know how i kept neutral the first runthrough, but currently im constantly on "very good", just for the fact that i complete the side quests. the only way of keeping bad karma appears to kill anyone you come across. if you dont want that the only (legit) option is to steal pretty much anything, which again makes people go hostile on you (and you have to kill them anyway)

a positive karma giving bible item would just put a glass of water in the sea.

[bben46]

As this is a proposal for a mod, if it is made you are free to either use it or not, as you perceive your game. For some it would be a welcome addition, for others not so much. Demanding that the maker change their mod to suit your taste is probably not the right way to go. However a suggestion is not out of line. But it is optional. Perhaps you could make a book of your choice to be used in a similar manner? To either add or subtract karma. Their are many possible books to choose from, both religious and philosophy. Some could add while others subtract.

However saying it should not be made as the OP suggested because it is against your personal preference is not a valid argument. That is saying my opinion is automatically right and you are automatically wrong because I say so.