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GCO - Guard Class Overhaul [WIP]


Indigoblade

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Makes me wonder what kind of mod I am using that is adding the female guards in my game. I thought that was vanilla ~~

 

As for the ideas, I can only think of counterarguments to some ideas that have been uttered but not of an actually useful new idea. So, I'll pass for the time being.

 

What made you contemplate upgrading the guards? Do you use them as followers in your playthroughs? Did you find it too easy to combat them when there's a bounty on your head? Is there a reason other than diversity behind this? Just curious.

 

Are you talking about my ideas for the mod or other people's ideas? Either way share your thoughts, I do not mind counterarguments.

 

Well, besides OBIS bandits outclass guards after lvl 30, I starting thinking about guards purpose in the game, both in the gameplay and their general feel.

 

They should be 4 things:

1. Deterrent to players wanting to commit crimes in towns

2. Add to general population of the town to increase immersion

3. Defenders of hostile entities that may harm the more helpless people

4. The standing military force of the Jarl

 

Guards only achieve the second purpose. The only reason I didn't go off on crime spree wasn't because I was scared of the guards, but instead it would be a huge inconvenience to deal with all the hassle of getting caught. When I did go through with it, I just slaughtered every guard like if they were weak bandits (or mid leveled bandits to be specific). Guards are literally just respawnable townsfolk with armor and an actual weapon. That's it. I expected Skyrim with a warrior culture to be a bit better armed and defended than that.

 

I feel like the 'guards' should be more like the jarl's soldiers than townguards. Organized, well trained, and well armed, especially the way the game describes guards to be. For example when doing the main quest, the steward of Whiterun stated that sending guards to Riverwood may cause border tension with one of Whiterun's neighbors. Really? In vanilla Skyrim's case, would sending 2-3 armored townsfolk to a border town would cause military tension between two territories? No. With this mod, if I am successful, would sending 2-3 highly trained military soldiers to a border town cause military tension between two territories? Of course. Right now, guards do not have that feel of dread when I first see them. I see them as townspeople, tattle-tales who likes to bore me with stories that I don't care about. I want guards to feel like guards. Someone who makes you think twice about wrecking the place, someone you have to size up if you plan on trying something fishy, someone you really need to run away from when you mess up...

 

:D ...Or maybe I am hoping that my current reputation have tons of people to download this mod and totally just decimate their towns in game to test out the mod... Oh what carnage that would bring... I mean the best way of stirring up that hornets nest is to start killing townsfolk and since there is specific guards per Hold, people will just kill EVERYWHERE just to see how the new guards are.

 

It's a bit of seriousness and a bit of pleasure fueling this project. Y'all should read what I write for game documents, those things are just filled with nonsense.

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I would say add something like mercenary guards, there people forced to be a guard, they don't have very good armor or weapons, and they wonder the roads of their hold. Such as argonians in Riften and dark elves in Windhelm. Just an idea, you can tweak it how ever you want.

As much as I love this idea (and when I mean love I mean I instantly wrote about a page what kind of diversity that might bring to the game after I read your post) it's soooooo hard to do! I mean the guard dialogue, the way factions work, how they need to ignore the usual guard duties but still combat you when you are bad... ERRRRRRR it bothers me how much I want it, but the possibilities of it going wrong is too many to be able to be worth it. Mercenary troops is a staple in any fantasy/medieval army, in many a grand strategy game I hire tons of merc troops to supplement my own forces where it is most pressing... Alright... If I EVER get to do this, they need to be Nords, Imperial, Bretons only, due to dialog restrictions. I would love to do other races, but if they are a part of the guard faction they will confront the player when they do something bad and I have no idea what kind of dialog it would say...

 

Damn... Merc guards... I want it so bad...

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when do obis bandits actually come in contact with guards? I run obis but I cannot recall a single situation where they did encounter guards.

 

Anyways my "counterarguments":

 

1. Redoran guards: Make no sense. House Redoran perceive themselves as the saviours of the Dunmer people. After the erruption of Red Mountain and the Argonian invasion House Redoran proceeded to establish itself as the one guardian the Dunmer have. I do not think there is a good reason why they would use their own troops to guard Nord holds in Skyrim. MAYBE some at the Windhelm docks as a lookout for illegal immigrants. Then again, why would Ulfric allow them there.

 

2. Dual wielding guards: I'd say guards would be trained in the classic style for Nords. I guess it is debatable but I think dual wielding would not be a fitting style for someone trained to guard.

 

3. Poisoner guards: Same reason really. I do not think it is very Nord-warrior-beardman-like to use poisons. Look at how ignorant of alchemy they are "can you brew me an ale?".

 

 

As for mercs: you might be able to recycle dialogue from other occasions. You would have to check but there ought to be lines like "Hand over your gold" etc. e.g. from thieves. Not 100% guard like but given that they would be mercenaries somewhat fitting.

Edited by BigBizkit
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For Redoran Guards - my suggestion was for those on Solstheim that protect Raven Rock. DB DLC. Like Skyrim cities with guards they are pretty generic and could use similar treatment from this mod. As for adding to other Skyrim cities, Yeah, I agree they shouldn't have a major presence, I was just think it wouldn't be unheard of to see 1-2 token reps from Solstheim, for bounty hunting or whatever. My main point though is for those on Solstheim.

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when do obis bandits actually come in contact with guards? I run obis but I cannot recall a single situation where they did encounter guards.

They will encounter guards if you use the bandit patrols plugin. Plus, have you ever been to whiterun watchtower?

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when do obis bandits actually come in contact with guards? I run obis but I cannot recall a single situation where they did encounter guards.

 

Anyways my "counterarguments":

 

1. Redoran guards: Make no sense. House Redoran perceive themselves as the saviours of the Dunmer people. After the erruption of Red Mountain and the Argonian invasion House Redoran proceeded to establish itself as the one guardian the Dunmer have. I do not think there is a good reason why they would use their own troops to guard Nord holds in Skyrim. MAYBE some at the Windhelm docks as a lookout for illegal immigrants. Then again, why would Ulfric allow them there.

 

2. Dual wielding guards: I'd say guards would be trained in the classic style for Nords. I guess it is debatable but I think dual wielding would not be a fitting style for someone trained to guard.

 

3. Poisoner guards: Same reason really. I do not think it is very Nord-warrior-beardman-like to use poisons. Look at how ignorant of alchemy they are "can you brew me an ale?".

 

 

As for mercs: you might be able to recycle dialogue from other occasions. You would have to check but there ought to be lines like "Hand over your gold" etc. e.g. from thieves. Not 100% guard like but given that they would be mercenaries somewhat fitting.

Thanks for the input

 

1. If I do anything Dragonborn related I will not be adding in any Nord guards. They will all be Dark Elves and at best there will be MAYBE a regional specific guard. To be honest I never really cared for the guards in Dragonborn... They were just kinda there

 

2. I think dual wielding is an acceptable practice within Nord society, taking inspiration of old viking tales, dual axe berserker stereotypes, and just the plan fact that dual wielding is very much ignored in Skyrim, only like 2 people uses it... That always bothered me.

 

3. This one I do agree with unfortunately... I am REALLY pushing it for that one lorewise... Unfortunately to make this region specific thing work I did a bit of research of each region's flora, fauna, reputation, social standing, ect. Hjaamarch is a poor region with little of anything... it's only noticeable difference from this hold and others is that it has a really high number of deathbells... plus poisonous chaurus can attack once in awhile at night. Although you are right, alchemy is a very ignored practice in Skyrim, a poor region can easily coat their weaponry with deathbells... Still if I can find anything better to represent a poor region with a high concentration of poison... I will make that change faster than you can say it...

 

Finally about mercs... That's true... I can but checking every sound file for each race will be a pain... UGHHHHHH... LAZYNESS VS REALLY COOL FEATURE.... IT BUUUUUURNNNNSSSSSS

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