311 replies to this topic

[MarkInMKUK]

I feel a mod concept expansion coming on...

Currently, there are several mods to give the Khajiit the "look" of different big-cat types, including cheetah-like and snow-leopard-type. We know from game vids that Skyrim will have at least one mostly lion/tiger-like Khajiit race, but that doesn't preclude others. A Snow Leopard, for isntance, would tend towards bigger, wider feet for cross-snow travel, while a cheetah-like one would probably go for the narrow foot with "running spikes" for high speed on harder surfaces.

Would two/three different base foot meshes, with slightly different widths/claw positions, cover all the likely range? The mod scripting (if based on Drake's original) should allow different custom feet for other custom race forms (heck, it probably allows different male and female feet within a race too).

(Note this is an idea purely for a future expansion of the concept, not something to try to add now!)

Edited by MarkInMKUK, 01 July 2011 - 04:14 AM.

[da mage]

Okay, Ive been working on my my scripts to seperate body meshes from items, after some bugtesting it seems completely possible.

Dragoonwraith has to iron out a small bug (an array size not being set in nifse corrupting the irgged meshes) but once that done my script will be able to strip body mesh parts from any mesh. On top of that, I can add stencil properties to the other nodes to fix up any gaps.


Basically, by using NifSE and OBSE functions in my script whenever the player is using a race that has a custom mesh, it will look whenever an item is changed, if it finds 'skin' on the item then it creates a new one. Here's where it get tricky. If nobody else in the cell has that item equipped (Im going to have to find a way to search small worldspaces too i think) then the mesh nifse temporary replaces the mesh on the original item, if there is then it turns a set 'dummy' item into the object to make it appear the same (this is then used until the NPC wearing the same item is no longer in the same cell). Of course it would have extra checks to run a search again when the player moves cell etc, in theory it should work.

By doing it this way it aviods changing the item ID (so scripts/quests still work with it) and should restrict the incompatibilities with it.


For you guys this might not be the best solution, as to fit within the item's current meshes you would need to have a roughly human shape, but it would let other modders really define different body types for each race more then through textures.



EDIT: I also think I'd just mention, if the copychild function works like it should on a rigged mesh, then this may also lead to being able ot have infinate slots. In brain wave, using this nifscripts technique, you do false equipping like I have on the centaurs, aka when an item (such as boots) wont fit the body mesh, you just go in and replace the boot mesh with the body mesh and pow, the item appears to the game ot be equipped, but it doesnt overlap the mesh. If this copychild works this really opens up so much more!

Edited by da mage, 01 July 2011 - 02:35 PM.

[MarkInMKUK]

<snip>

<Reads>

...

...<brain explodes>

I *THINK* that sounds like it makes sense - but I'll let Drake and Razorpony try to make sense of it. I need to go lie down in a darkened room 'til my brain recovers.

Edited by MarkInMKUK, 01 July 2011 - 03:35 PM.

[razorpony]

Candex: we have discussed this previously in fact, but new opinions are always welcome. I've already tweaked the toes a bit on my latest edit to be in a more catlike arangement with the center toes longer. I realize that typical cat claws are not dark, however I've been using a dark texture purely for contrast purposes and also because I just like the way it looks. Light claws tend to get lost in the foot texture, which is fine if you're going for total realism, but then who's to say what's 'real' in Tamriel? I feel one of Marks head explosions coming on....

Short version: if you'd like to see lighter claws with a darker contrasting fur around them then I'm sure one of us can come up with something or you could offer up a retex yourself. Everyone has their own tastes and preferences I'm sure and I think diversity is a good thing.

Mage: Sounds like what I've been trying to wrap my head around. I was planning on trying to write some NifSE scripting this week during my time off but if you have something already working that would be awesome. Does the script run on NPCs as well as the player? If you want I can email you some armor meshes to plug in and test. Let me know.

RP

[da mage]

My script is only built to work on one NPC (or the player) at a time at the moment, so i'd have to work on it more to deveolp it to be NPC ready aswell as the player......would need to include some arrays to store stuff in.

My script will work on any mesh, its not operational at the moment (since DragoonWraith needs to fix nifse, which i think he is doing this weekend), but as soon as that works i can keep working on it to make it better.

[MarkInMKUK]

EDIT: I also think I'd just mention, if the copychild function works like it should on a rigged mesh, then this may also lead to being able ot have infinate slots.

Could those become "Named" slots - i.e, Right Pauldron, Left Pauldron, Right Glove, Left Glove, etc? I'm sure you see where I'm going with this line of thought - and many ex-Morrowind players would offer Daedric sacrifices in your name if you could pull it off...

Edited by MarkInMKUK, 02 July 2011 - 08:22 AM.

[da mage]

EDIT: I also think I'd just mention, if the copychild function works like it should on a rigged mesh, then this may also lead to being able ot have infinate slots.

Could those become "Named" slots - i.e, Right Pauldron, Left Pauldron, Right Glove, Left Glove, etc? I'm sure you see where I'm going with this line of thought - and many ex-Morrowind players would offer Daedric sacrifices in your name if you could pull it off...

It would be more like, being able to merge items together into a single slot....okay for example:
Take the ebony armor to start with, first I would have to seperate them into seperate meshes and items. Then if the cuirass has been equipped, if you then equip a pauldron (which has been set to take up no slots, something I know works) the pauldron's mesh is added to the cuirass's mesh, making it appear to the player that the pauldron has been equipped. It would not be an easy script to make it work bewteen armors (so you can have the pauldrons of orchish on leather armor etc), but as long as copychild works like it should (and if it doesnt I'll do some more bugtesting for Dragoonwraith to find the problems) then that sort of thing is possible.

Would be a fiar bit of work as for each mesh you'd have to seperate it into the seperate parts.

[MarkInMKUK]

Once the theory works, and you can merge and unmerge meshes, I think people would be happy to split up armour to suit. You might need a tag in the armour file someplace to say which bit it actually was, and which bits it contained already (you wouldn't want to equip extra pauldrons by mistake, or a glove on a shoulder), but IF it could be made to work it'd be awesome.

At this rate, by the time Skyrim arrives, you lot will have finished repairing the ommissions they made in Oblivion when compared with Morrowind...

Edited by MarkInMKUK, 02 July 2011 - 09:34 AM.

[Candex]

Razorpony: Of course diversity is a great thing. I want you to keep the texture just the way you like it, just as much as I want the 'realistic' texture for myself. I also realize that a texture detail is something not as important as getting the mod actually ready, and that there are priorities.


I guess a retexture can be added as a separate file for download (or as an option when installing maybe?), is this right? If so I'd love to see the light version. As I said, I have no trouble on offering a retex, but keep in mind I've never done that- maybe I find out that I can't do it for whatever the reason. If any of you want to do the realistic texture, then so much the better. Otherwise I'll first practice my retexturing skills at home, and once I know for sure I can do it I'll come back in my brand-new Candex-Retex costume (or come back crying, 'its impooosibleeee!'). It's something I wanted to learn anyway.

Edited by Candex, 02 July 2011 - 11:03 AM.

[MarkInMKUK]

Razorpony: Of course diversity is a great thing. I want you to keep the texture just the way you like it, just as much as I want the 'realistic' texture for myself. I also realize that a texture detail is something not as important as getting the mod actually ready, and that there are priorities.

I second the wish for an alternative texture - being owned by two cats I get up-close-and-personal with the sharp end of a paw many times each week, and the dark ones look "wrong" to me.

At one point I also suggested that some of the female "vanilla" footware could have nail (claw?) art equivalents for Khajiit and Argonians - maybe that would also be an interesting re-texture project - imagine Green velvet being replaved by Green varnish and gold detailing. The more alternatives we can DO, the more "complete" the mod can become.