Mohamed2001 Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 (edited) Hi, Didn't see one about the civil war, so I made this. Sorry if this was made before and locked for some reason. It's quite an interesting debate topic. Well, as long as NATO/RU fanboys don't ruin it. Major highlights that happened quite recently: - Chechen Islamic Jihadists are apparently pulling out of Syria to go to Ukraine. Rumors also say ISIS might join but cannot confirm this. - Ukrainian VDV (that is Airborne units for you Western people) have recently received "NEW" (aka Model 1984s) T-80BV MBTs by Kharkov. Pictures will be posted later. They are outfit with 'Kontakt-1' ERA (which, btw was obsolete in the 80s, it is also only useful vs Shaped Charges, unlike Kontakt-V, which is also outdated, but useful vs APFSDS/APDS projectiles), and have VDV markings applied on them. They have not seen any combat yet as far as I know. - It seems that modern Anti tank guns are running low on supply for both sides. Ukrainians were found using Model 1942 ZiS-3 Field guns, Model 1944 BS-3 AT guns, Model 1952 D-48 AT guns, instead of the traditional T-12/MT-12 AT guns. - A big one; T-90A MBT (Russia only) was spotted in Ukraine. It seems the rebels are getting some Russian support. Later, pictures of the same 2 T-90A MBTs were posted, and they looked worn/battle hardened. SHTORA-1 (soft kill Active Protection) was spotted in ready to use configuration, track guards were removed, dust was everywhere, Thermal sleeve on the gun was fading, and the side ERA modules are removed except 1. Source and pictures will be posted later. - Rumors of T-72B3 (modernized T-72B, Russia/CIS only) in Ukraine are over the internet. That's it for now, I'll post more later. Tired now, sorry. Also, PLEASE, no extreme fanboys. Edited September 15, 2015 by Mohamed2001 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Well, rumor has it that Russia is sending in troops as well as equipment. Not sure how much truth there is to that....... In all reality, this is turning into a proxy war between NATO, and Russia...... The US is sending in A-10s....... which should make the Rebels/Russians a tad nervous..... They are extremely good at taking out tanks....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurielius Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 If we eliminate NATO and Russian advocates in this debate, who is left with a dog in this hunt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Ukrainians? :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurielius Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 Ukrainians? :DYup..that crowd of Ukrainians that debate here might crush us in the rush to post.... :ermm: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohamed2001 Posted September 15, 2015 Author Share Posted September 15, 2015 (edited) Well, rumor has it that Russia is sending in troops as well as equipment. Not sure how much truth there is to that....... In all reality, this is turning into a proxy war between NATO, and Russia...... The US is sending in A-10s....... which should make the Rebels/Russians a tad nervous..... They are extremely good at taking out tanks....... Meh, the A-10 is overrated. I think the SU-25 is overall a better platform. Though the primary cannon it has is not as good as the GAU-8, but the cannon it has is also practical, unlike the extremely huge GAU-8. The penetration of the GAU-8 is not really useful much when you have all those ATGMs and bombs. If we eliminate NATO and Russian advocates in this debate, who is left with a dog in this hunt? You can support a side, just.. don't over do it. Examples of over doing it: "UKRAINE ARE A BUNCH OF NEO NAZIS. THEY HELPED NAZI GERMANY IN WW2" "RUSSIA IS AGGRESSIVE. THEY WANT TO TAKE OVER THE WORLD. WE SHOULD NUKE THEM ALL" etc. --- Sources @ OP claims: - T-90A here - Worn T-90A here - Ukrainian VDV T-80BV Training here (notice the VDV emblem) - Azov Battalion using 1944 BS-3 Field gun here - Ukrainian refurbished T-80BV from July 15 2015 here, before being sent to VDV unit Edited September 15, 2015 by Mohamed2001 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RGMage2 Posted September 15, 2015 Share Posted September 15, 2015 A lot of what goes on with this war I find bewildering, though I guess I could say the same for most of the east west conflicts around the world. I get the imperative for the Russians. It's on their border, there are historical connections between Russia and Ukraine that go back generations. They have legitimate security concerns with NATO on their borders. I don't think anyone should be surprised that they would be meddling, it's not so different from what America would do if the situation were reversed. What doesn't make sense is the west's response. The rush to recognize the new government after a democratically elected government was violently overthrown. That's not what we would normally do, it was out of character. Our reluctance to endorse Federalization for Ukraine is also unfathomable. Not only does it seem to be a common sense solution to a deeply polarized nation, it is also our very own system of government. My own country would have split apart long ago if we did not have a federal system with strong provincial governments. We also are officially a bilingual nation, yet we don't speak up in support for official bilingualism for Ukraine, where if you can believe what you read it seems there are as many people if not more who speak Russian as there are who speak Ukrainian. We seem to be more interested in saber rattling rather than calming things down. Are we really willing to start WW3 over this, or are we only going to fight to the last Ukrainian? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyYou Posted September 16, 2015 Share Posted September 16, 2015 Well, rumor has it that Russia is sending in troops as well as equipment. Not sure how much truth there is to that....... In all reality, this is turning into a proxy war between NATO, and Russia...... The US is sending in A-10s....... which should make the Rebels/Russians a tad nervous..... They are extremely good at taking out tanks....... Meh, the A-10 is overrated. I think the SU-25 is overall a better platform. Though the primary cannon it has is not as good as the GAU-8, but the cannon it has is also practical, unlike the extremely huge GAU-8. The penetration of the GAU-8 is not really useful much when you have all those ATGMs and bombs. If we eliminate NATO and Russian advocates in this debate, who is left with a dog in this hunt? You can support a side, just.. don't over do it. Examples of over doing it: "UKRAINE ARE A BUNCH OF NEO NAZIS. THEY HELPED NAZI GERMANY IN WW2" "RUSSIA IS AGGRESSIVE. THEY WANT TO TAKE OVER THE WORLD. WE SHOULD NUKE THEM ALL" etc. --- Sources @ OP claims: - T-90A here - Worn T-90A here - Ukrainian VDV T-80BV Training here (notice the VDV emblem) - Azov Battalion using 1944 BS-3 Field gun here - Ukrainian refurbished T-80BV from July 15 2015 here, before being sent to VDV unit Close Air Support disagrees with you. Bigger, meaner, and safer to fly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mohamed2001 Posted September 16, 2015 Author Share Posted September 16, 2015 Well, rumor has it that Russia is sending in troops as well as equipment. Not sure how much truth there is to that....... In all reality, this is turning into a proxy war between NATO, and Russia...... The US is sending in A-10s....... which should make the Rebels/Russians a tad nervous..... They are extremely good at taking out tanks....... Meh, the A-10 is overrated. I think the SU-25 is overall a better platform. Though the primary cannon it has is not as good as the GAU-8, but the cannon it has is also practical, unlike the extremely huge GAU-8. The penetration of the GAU-8 is not really useful much when you have all those ATGMs and bombs. If we eliminate NATO and Russian advocates in this debate, who is left with a dog in this hunt? You can support a side, just.. don't over do it. Examples of over doing it: "UKRAINE ARE A BUNCH OF NEO NAZIS. THEY HELPED NAZI GERMANY IN WW2" "RUSSIA IS AGGRESSIVE. THEY WANT TO TAKE OVER THE WORLD. WE SHOULD NUKE THEM ALL" etc. --- Sources @ OP claims: - T-90A here - Worn T-90A here - Ukrainian VDV T-80BV Training here (notice the VDV emblem) - Azov Battalion using 1944 BS-3 Field gun here - Ukrainian refurbished T-80BV from July 15 2015 here, before being sent to VDV unit Close Air Support disagrees with you. Bigger, meaner, and safer to fly. Based on the Northtrop A-9? ehh.. That picture has some valid points, but some are a bit odd. How is the SU-25 based on the YA-9? The only part I find kind of similar is the engine position. Some armament options are missing for both aircraft as well. Though the safety part is not relevant much since most modern AA systems can easily destroy both. Not bad in the Middle East though I guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aurielius Posted September 16, 2015 Share Posted September 16, 2015 *Post Deleted*I decided that I really don't have a dog in this hunt. My apologies gentlemen, carry on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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