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Foreign troops on national soil


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#1
Maharg67

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Out of curiosity, and no other reason, I would like to know what peoples of different countries feel about having foreign soldiers on their soil. What do people see as the difference between more temporary training purposes and more permanent garrisoning, bases etc, if any?

I am partly asking this question because of the increasing number of American Marines being placed on Australian soil but would ask the same questions if the British were to be the ones being based here. For Australia, my country, has had no permanent basing of foreign troops here, except for the joint intelligence bases, since World War Two.

I am also asking this question because of certain Americans' response to activities of some Mexican soldiers on US soil that supposedly happen in response to a crisis on American soil and Mexico sending soldiers to assist. How do Americans, non Americans, Mexicans, feel about this? There is also the fact that the US Constitution forbids foreign troops on American soil but has its troops on foreign soil? What do people feel about that?

Also what of those who live in former Soviet occupied nations. How do they feel about their countries being freed of those foreign soldiers and that they were once occupied.

NO, I AM NOT SAYING THAT SOVIET FORCES BEING ON FOREIGN SOIL IS EXACTLY THE SAME AS AMERICAN OR ANY OTHER FORCES BEING ON FOREIGN SOIL.

These is a delicate subject and one that I am pondering as I shift my views on various matters. Flaming, reacting aggressively, pointing fingers, putting forward unsupported assumptions would better be replaced by thoughtful debate and quiet, respectful critiques.

I have done my best to put aside most of my old opinions so as to reassess the world, its people, so I wish to take in all opinions, including sharply opposing ones, with quiet positive acceptance. Whether I succeed in doing so is another matter altogether because I am only human.

#2
Georgiegril

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I do not pretend to speak for America or other Americans, but I would hazard that any foreign military base here would cause rioting in the streets, attacks by "patriots" against the current government...kinda sounds like Pakistan, huh. There is a strong folklore here in the US that we are "the good guys." If you buy into that completely (and of course there are many that do not), then everything we do is "good," even though if another country did the same to us it would be intolerable.

I think nationalism is the cause of a great deal of suffering, regardless of the nation. Governments are far less important than people, but unfortunately the soldiers of any nation are often required to put human beings second.

Edited by Georgiegril, 02 May 2012 - 06:50 AM.


#3
Syco21

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As a matter of opinion without regard to law, I don't have big issues with foreign troops training on U.S. soil. Military bases? Intolerable.

How do I feel about the shoe being on the other foot? No comment.

#4
myrmaad

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I sort of have to chuckle.

Why do they need bases, they use ours.

I went to an "all service tech school", the building where I was housed was large, shaped like a U and there were marines housed one floor below ours, on the other side the Navy and the Army. There was a small contingent of the Coast Guard; there were rotations of National Guard we'd pass on the way to chow or at the gym and on the track fields. And there were lots of foreign service receiving training there as well.

I'll remind you Noriega trained in the US.

Fort Benjamin Harrison.

#5
Aurielius

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I sort of have to chuckle.

Why do they need bases, they use ours.
I went to an "all service tech school", the building where I was housed was large, shaped like a U and there were marines housed one floor below ours, on the other side the Navy and the Army. There was a small contingent of the Coast Guard; there were rotations of National Guard we'd pass on the way to chow or at the gym and on the track fields. And there were lots of foreign service receiving training there as well.
Fort Benjamin Harrison.

Absolutely correct Myr. We have been training foreign troops within our territory for quite some time.The Western Hemisphere Institute for Security Cooperation, formerly named School of the Americas is a United States Department of Defense Institute located at Fort Benning near Columbus, Georgia.

@Marharg
What I am trying to determine is why having an allied fast reaction force based in your country is an offensive concept to you. It's not an occupation force, it is there by invitation, it is for the maintenance of security of Australian interests. Both our countries are members of SEATO and there is a need for joint training if the need to co operate in an actual crisis if one arises. Allied operations are the most tricky of command endeavors and require intimate knowledge of each others procedures and methodology to be effective.

This isn't the first time that you have posed this question, it's just been rephrased slightly. Given that the usual suspects will reply what different outcome do you expect?.

Edited by Aurielius, 02 May 2012 - 04:32 PM.


#6
ginnyfizz

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Yep we've had US bases on UK soil for donkey's years. By invitation. So I'd get used to it if I were you, Marharg. As Aurelius says, joint training and sharing of resources is very important. Also we find that civilians benefit from the presence of US servicemen, not just commercially but, for example, US aviators are frequently seconded to the Air/Sea rescue services and have been for many years. I vivdly remember the US Navy aviator who, thirty years ago, flew his helicopter into desperate conditions in a vain attempt to lower a winchman to try and rescue the poor souls from the wrecks of the MV Union Star and the RNLB Solomon Browne. The lifeboat and the coaster were lost with all hands, but the bravery of Lt. Smith and his lifelong respect for the lifeboatmen he tried so hard to save did much to heighten the image of US servicemen "over here".

Hasn't caused too big a problem here, although there has been a certain amount more grumbling of late (occasioned by US requests for extradition of UK citizens) about the behaviour of the VERY small minority of US servicemen who break British laws, because they are often shipped out rather than face the courts. Mostly the US servicemen are a good deal better behaved than the local yobs.

#7
csgators

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I know as an American living in America if there had been a UK or Indian or Japanese or whatever base down the road with drunken foreign troops at our bars I would have been intensely angry and insulted. It would have meant that not only could we not defend ourselves but we had given over sovereignty to another nation. I can understand it in some case (S. Korea would not be there if not for our help). But if you are serious about being independent it would be unacceptable to have a another country maintain a base on your land.

#8
Aurielius

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I know as an American living in America if there had been a UK or Indian or Japanese or whatever base down the road with drunken foreign troops at our bars I would have been intensely angry and insulted. It would have meant that not only could we not defend ourselves but we had given over sovereignty to another nation. I can understand it in some case (S. Korea would not be there if not for our help). But if you are serious about being independent it would be unacceptable to have a another country maintain a base on your land.

Thats a bit disingenuous CS , we both know where you are currently residing. Having been in a myriad of bars with drunks of all nationalities why is a foreign serviceman anymore offensive than the local redneck? They are both drunks and equally a pain in the ass.

#9
csgators

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I know as an American living in America if there had been a UK or Indian or Japanese or whatever base down the road with drunken foreign troops at our bars I would have been intensely angry and insulted. It would have meant that not only could we not defend ourselves but we had given over sovereignty to another nation. I can understand it in some case (S. Korea would not be there if not for our help). But if you are serious about being independent it would be unacceptable to have a another country maintain a base on your land.

Thats a bit disingenuous CS , we both know where you are currently residing. Having been in a myriad of bars with drunks of all nationalities why is a foreign serviceman anymore offensive than the local redneck? They are both drunks and equally a pain in the ass.


As far as I know and as far as Google can tell me there are zero military bases run by foreign governments where I live. As far as drunk serviceman go, I concede the point, fine. Having guests for training is no problem, having a permanent base means your country can't defend itself. Period. If you can't defend yourself then what are you really? A puppet? A slave? A barrier? What? I have moved away from the blood sucking, life draining slavery of America, yes. The country I live in now has bled oceans of blood to get it's Independence, they have fought off the two largest current powers in their history for the status they now have as an independent nation. That is not why I am here. My statement had nothing to do with where live now, it was about the nation I lived in before and the client states that allow themselves to be dominated by it. I do not love the government I live under right now, just as I don't love the one I lived under before. The government I love lived over 100 years ago and nothing like it exists now to my knowledge.

#10
Moveing

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Is this because russian Airborne trained in the USA to take on civil unrest?

Was big story, but those things going on since years. Watch Operation Urban Warrior. Since decades german, polish, french, belgium and other troops train in the US for civil unrest scenarios. This is one side of the coin, the other side is this forgein bases on national soil for rent. For a military force like the US Army these bases are very important to stretch their influence in the world. The US are the only remaining superpower which is able to bring a hole division in 24 hours everywhere on the globe.




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