90 replies to this topic

[RighthandofSithis]

Empire is dead and Hammerfall/Skyrim rebelled against it due to selling off their allies' religions and lands to save themselves.
The choice is pretty much Cyrodil vs Skyrim and of course I pick Nords as it's their land.

I see it as much more complicated.

From what i see, it is a class war. The Nordic Aristocracy V the Imperial Aristocracy.

Of course, not all of the Nordic aristocracy is revolutionary, and so half of them supports the Empire.

[Brandy_123]

There are no moral alignments in Skyrim....

Even the Draugr aren't evil. They are protecting a lair you broke in to raid. The Draugr don't traverse the vaste openness, swarming down on hapless individuals or villages. You do. The Dragon born seems to be the birth of all the tyranny. Even Alduin came to you at Helgen. There was unrest, but no cival war until you nosed in. The Assassins guild was broken. The thieves Guild was non-existant. The mages College was holding on but your doings were the basis of all the problems with the items of MAgnus and evil spawn being released onto an already broken town. Even still, you were the cause of the Psijic order to become concerned. You unsettled and destroyed several people in your quest for daedric artifacts, committed countelss crimes from petty to murder. You robbed, slayed, killed and sacrificed the innocent. You even overthrew the hand that fed you first (Jarl Balgruuf). You either attempted to destroy the leader of the Greybeards or ended and ancient faction bound to protect you. You left a swath of dead critters in your path, often taking just its fur or nothing at all. You lead a group of ancient bloodlined companions with extremely questionable backgrounds and then you have the opportunity to back stab them all and end their reign. You over throw a town from the inside with apparent mad men and enjoy the taste of manflesh as if ambrosia. You align yourself with multiple daedra, even in opposition to protectors of humankind and of each other. You break in, perform multiple murders, and pillage an estate of an ambasador. You release prisoners without any care for the law or their guilt. You bribe guards, steal crops and rob private buisinesses utilizing the dark and shadows as your allies. You take resources from civillian dwellings, the poor, and from crafting stations. You create and use poisons and guide any of your, until now, innocent followers down your path of mayhem and destruction. You have feelings of guilt and help out a homeless farmer but slay a civillian seeking to arm himself to defend his homelands. Destruction of innocent nobles doesn't make you flinch. You kill a princess with extreme predjudice on her wedding day and slay an emporer after an enlightening and heart fealt conversation with him. You then rob his body to dawn his robes prior to his body turning cold.

You are the DragonBorn. MAybe you and Alduin are one and together the world will in fact fall.

So, is there an alignment? I would say no. Unless TRue Neutral is what you seek. But then, your not exactly neutral either.

[RighthandofSithis]

There are no moral alignments in Skyrim....

Even the Draugr aren't evil. They are protecting a lair you broke in to raid. The Draugr don't traverse the vaste openness, swarming down on hapless individuals or villages. You do. The Dragon born seems to be the birth of all the tyranny. Even Alduin came to you at Helgen. There was unrest, but no cival war until you nosed in. The Assassins guild was broken. The thieves Guild was non-existant. The mages College was holding on but your doings were the basis of all the problems with the items of MAgnus and evil spawn being released onto an already broken town. Even still, you were the cause of the Psijic order to become concerned. You unsettled and destroyed several people in your quest for daedric artifacts, committed countelss crimes from petty to murder. You robbed, slayed, killed and sacrificed the innocent. You even overthrew the hand that fed you first (Jarl Balgruuf). You either attempted to destroy the leader of the Greybeards or ended and ancient faction bound to protect you. You left a swath of dead critters in your path, often taking just its fur or nothing at all. You lead a group of ancient bloodlined companions with extremely questionable backgrounds and then you have the opportunity to back stab them all and end their reign. You over throw a town from the inside with apparent mad men and enjoy the taste of manflesh as if ambrosia. You align yourself with multiple daedra, even in opposition to protectors of humankind and of each other. You break in, perform multiple murders, and pillage an estate of an ambasador. You release prisoners without any care for the law or their guilt. You bribe guards, steal crops and rob private buisinesses utilizing the dark and shadows as your allies. You take resources from civillian dwellings, the poor, and from crafting stations. You create and use poisons and guide any of your, until now, innocent followers down your path of mayhem and destruction. You have feelings of guilt and help out a homeless farmer but slay a civillian seeking to arm himself to defend his homelands. Destruction of innocent nobles doesn't make you flinch. You kill a princess with extreme predjudice on her wedding day and slay an emporer after an enlightening and heart fealt conversation with him. You then rob his body to dawn his robes prior to his body turning cold.

You are the DragonBorn. MAybe you and Alduin are one and together the world will in fact fall.

So, is there an alignment? I would say no. Unless TRue Neutral is what you seek. But then, your not exactly neutral either.

Gameplay =/= Lore.

The Civil war was raging before the player became involved, it just didn't appear so much in the games mechanics (talk to a few veterans, such as the shopkeeper in Falkreath.

And indeed, all the guild questlines will be completed in lore, and the exact same things will happen. The Eye of Magnus will emerge, Kodlak will be cured, the DB and Thieves guild will rise anew, and of course, every DLC questline will come to pass. It will not be stated who did these things, but they will come to pass, and nothing can stop it.

[Brandy_123]

Bethesda can stop it. They often do. They can't even keep their own lore straight, time line correct, or races accounted for. THey certainly have no ability to keep artifacts constant or gameplay smooth.

[RighthandofSithis]

Bethesda can stop it. They often do. They can't even keep their own lore straight, time line correct, or races accounted for. THey certainly have no ability to keep artifacts constant or gameplay smooth.

Say you never installed KotN for Oblivion.

Does that mean Umaril never returned?

[MidbossVyers]

There are no moral alignments in Skyrim....

Even the Draugr aren't evil. They are protecting a lair you broke in to raid. The Draugr don't traverse the vaste openness, swarming down on hapless individuals or villages. You do. The Dragon born seems to be the birth of all the tyranny. Even Alduin came to you at Helgen. There was unrest, but no cival war until you nosed in. The Assassins guild was broken. The thieves Guild was non-existant. The mages College was holding on but your doings were the basis of all the problems with the items of MAgnus and evil spawn being released onto an already broken town. Even still, you were the cause of the Psijic order to become concerned. You unsettled and destroyed several people in your quest for daedric artifacts, committed countelss crimes from petty to murder. You robbed, slayed, killed and sacrificed the innocent. You even overthrew the hand that fed you first (Jarl Balgruuf). You either attempted to destroy the leader of the Greybeards or ended and ancient faction bound to protect you. You left a swath of dead critters in your path, often taking just its fur or nothing at all. You lead a group of ancient bloodlined companions with extremely questionable backgrounds and then you have the opportunity to back stab them all and end their reign. You over throw a town from the inside with apparent mad men and enjoy the taste of manflesh as if ambrosia. You align yourself with multiple daedra, even in opposition to protectors of humankind and of each other. You break in, perform multiple murders, and pillage an estate of an ambasador. You release prisoners without any care for the law or their guilt. You bribe guards, steal crops and rob private buisinesses utilizing the dark and shadows as your allies. You take resources from civillian dwellings, the poor, and from crafting stations. You create and use poisons and guide any of your, until now, innocent followers down your path of mayhem and destruction. You have feelings of guilt and help out a homeless farmer but slay a civillian seeking to arm himself to defend his homelands. Destruction of innocent nobles doesn't make you flinch. You kill a princess with extreme predjudice on her wedding day and slay an emporer after an enlightening and heart fealt conversation with him. You then rob his body to dawn his robes prior to his body turning cold.

You are the DragonBorn. MAybe you and Alduin are one and together the world will in fact fall.

So, is there an alignment? I would say no. Unless TRue Neutral is what you seek. But then, your not exactly neutral either.

If you don't kill the Emperor after that conversation, you might end up like Nameless in Hero starring Jet Li.

[Brandy_123]

LOL, We are all nameless heroes.

I did...uhm.. play KoT....... I JUST CAN"T SAY IT. I'm a closet player. I am ashamed of my armor and magical boots. KoTN (kitten of the nip?) wasn't near as bad as Sheogorath Slobbering Isle fiasco... Or the DLC's For Skyrim.

As per Merriam Webster online : Lore = a : knowledge gained through study or experience. b : traditional knowledge or belief. c: a particular body of knowledge or tradition

Seeing the FIRST definition is just random intervention between 2 (or more) things, objects, critters, people then I would have to retract my statement about lore. It seems Bethesda did get it right. An by definition, Lore can be anything repetative or not, related or relayed history or not, stories or legends or not. a concise history you can build on....... or not.

WOOT!!! Lets here it for KoTN (and Skyrim to Oblivion and Oblivion to morrowwind, and morrowwind to DAggerfall, and Daggerfall to Arena and Arena to.....

Lore - Go learn something new in the game, or new to your Dragonborn, Alternate start following denizen or active citizen. I guess I can thank RighthandofSithis and MidbossVyers for opening my eyes. I can honestly say I am Loreful good.

[Kraeten]

Usually I go with Stormcloaks. It's hard for me to imagine how a sane person would follow the weakling who would have stood by and watched you be executed unjustly. Plus I don't see the Stormcloaks using torture, and for my Nord warrior that's a big plus.

As for the Markarth situation, I might actually side with the Forsworn if they had enough sense to direct their anger at the men truly responsible for their fate but sadly they act little different from any other pack of bandit. So that leaves the Silverbloods to join.

[MidbossVyers]

Usually I go with Stormcloaks. It's hard for me to imagine how a sane person would follow the weakling who would have stood by and watched you be executed unjustly. Plus I don't see the Stormcloaks using torture, and for my Nord warrior that's a big plus.

As for the Markarth situation, I might actually side with the Forsworn if they had enough sense to direct their anger at the men truly responsible for their fate but sadly they act little different from any other pack of bandit. So that leaves the Silverbloods to join.

That has less to do with character choices, but more-so with game mechanics.

[Anime_Otaku102]

Usually I go with Stormcloaks. It's hard for me to imagine how a sane person would follow the weakling who would have stood by and watched you be executed unjustly. Plus I don't see the Stormcloaks using torture, and for my Nord warrior that's a big plus.

What? You mean Hadvar? He's a soldier, your execution was ordered, and the general didn't overturn that order. What kind of soldier would violate his oath and potentially compromise the capture of the leader of enemy forces just to defend a nobody? Loyalty is not a weakness. Hadvar was not weak for obeying his orders, nor was Ralof weak for abandoning the people of Helgen in favor of helping Ulfric escape.

I usually go with the Legion because of Tullius' orders: when a dragon showed up the first order out of Tullius' mouth was to "get the people to safety", not "don't let Ulfric escape", and it isn't until after they (presumably) get most of the people out (you only spot a few dead civilians, after all) that he finally orders his own men to retreat. On the other hand, Ulfric - the one guy in the entire place with the power of the Voice and any chance against a dragon - is out the door as soon as his gag is off. Sure, Helgen was clearly loyal to the Empire and Ulfric had no obligation to help defend them, but that just made his claims of fighting for Nords all that less authentic.

As for the Markarth situation, I might actually side with the Forsworn if they had enough sense to direct their anger at the men truly responsible for their fate but sadly they act little different from any other pack of bandit. So that leaves the Silverbloods to join.

It's hard to support the Forsworn, especially since I came across the body (and journal) of that girl who was murdered for skinny dipping. Only time I can support them is when I play psychopathic murderers who value personal grudges over the lives of others.