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Improving arrows at a grindstone

arrows arrow grindstone damage smithing arrowheads forge billets

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#1
Notanon81

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Was having a think about a mod like this over the past couple of days. Just seems a bit strange to me that you can improve the bow itself, but not be able to refine the arrows at all on the grindstone, or bolts for that in the case of the crossbow.

 

The way I see it, to be able to improve an arrows damage capability, you'd have to have an average of both the smithing and the archery skills to determine if you can make a fine arrow, exquisite arrow and so on. The reasoning being from a lore friendly perspective is this: A skilled archer would have a better knowledge as to what would be required to refine their arrows, but would need the appropriate smithing skill to be able to carry out the refinements in question. It'd level in a similar scale to other weapons that can be refined on the grindstone, so the arrows themselves wouldn't be overly powerful.

 

How this would be carried would depend on what can be executed with scripts and the limitations of the Creation Kit. If the ammo types can be refined, then improving them at a grindstone with an ingot or individual arrowheads of the same material used for the arrow would be feasible (maybe in batches of 20 or so for the ingot, individual ones with the arrowheads route). Failing that, the other option would be to create the individual arrowheads that can be crafted at the forge, refined at the grindstone themselves (maybe using other arrowheads for relative simplicity's sake), and then combined with the base arrow or firewood and crafting feathers to create the improved arrow at way. Obviously the first method would be preferred, but got a feeling the second route might the way to go, which would necessitate creating custom arrows for each type in the editors, as well as the arrowheads and so on.

 

Was thinking about having a go at making this myself, but as I've barely scratched the surface of the Creation Kit, it might be a bit beyond my abilities at this stage. That said, will see if anyone else more capable might be willing to give it a shot first before I even consider attempting it.

 

Aside from that, any reason why it might not be able to be carried out at all?



#2
ArchangelZero7

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I would prefer this method to the mods that change the damage scaling for arrows. I love anything smithing related.



#3
enkeyz

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+1

 

(Hunter roleplayer here)

 

 

Idea: 

 

Iron arrow smithing:

 

(+50% damage): 1 Firewood, 2 Iron Ingot, 1 Hawk feather(Require lvl40 archery)

(+100% damage): 2 Firewood, 2 Iron ingot, 2 Hawk feather(req lvl60 archery)

(+150% damage): 2 Firewood, 3 Iron Ingot, 2 Hawk feather(req lvl70 archery)

 

etc...


Edited by enkeyz, 17 January 2014 - 04:54 PM.


#4
Notanon81

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Have had a bit more of a think about this during a short holiday and the idea of creating batches of 24 arrowheads to mirror the crafting of 24 arrows at a forge seems more like the way to go, as trying to improve arrows using ingots would be way too wasteful and unrealistic and improving batches of arrows in one go would be daft. Given quite a few arrows are noncraftable, such as the Dwarven Sphere Centurion Arrow and the Ancient Nord Arrow, as examples, this 

 

I've roughly worked out the types of arrowheads that would need to be created and the arrows they would improve.

 

Falmer (Chitin): Falmer

Iron: Ancient Nord, Forsworn, Iron, Rusty

Steel: Steel, Riekling Spear

Elven (Moonstone): Elven, Bloodcursed Elven, Sunhallowed Elven

Orcish (Orichalcum): Orcish

Dwarven: Dwarven, Dwarven Sphere Centurion

Glass (Malachite): Glass

Ebony: Ebony

Daedric (Ebony and Daedra Heart): Daedric

Dragonbone: Dragonbone

Nordic (Steel and Quicksilver): Nordic

Stahlrim: Stahlrim

 

Bolts would be slightly different, only creating 10 per ingot. Would only be for a Dawnguard version, understandably.

 

Steel: Steel, Exploding Steel Bolts of Fire, Ice and Shock

Dwarven: Dwarven, Exploding Dwarven Bolts of Fire, Ice and Shock

 

Another idea I had was to enhance arrows using the hawk feathers to create improved arrow fletches (maybe in batches of 48 or 72 depending on if 2 or 3 are required to improve each arrow) to improve how far an arrow could travel when shot. The argument from a lore-friendly perspective is that an expert archer would be to craft the feathers as such to be able to improve the aerodynamics of an arrow. That said, it could become a quest reward in its own right, where finding a book or completing a task enables the player to learn how to craft an enhanced arrow of each type. Would be too easy otherwise. ;)

 

Anyway, so it looks like I'd have to create individual models for the arrowheads of each type (perhaps just taking the model of the main base arrow and removing the arrow shaft and feathers). I noticed a couple of other mods have the ability to craft arrow feathers already, so maybe I might not go with this path straightaway. I could perhaps try and make a compatiblity version for this to minimise conflicts. Again, more to think about.

 

Another approach could be being able to refine the arrowheads at a grindstone using other arrowheads of the same type and then combining the improved arrowheads with the firewood to create the improved arrows directly.

 

Got a few more thoughts but will post later.



#5
Notanon81

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Ok, finally created my own mod and have it up on the Steam Community for the time-being at http://steamcommunit...140&searchtext=

 

Took the approach of using billets and fragments of the tempering materials normally used for the other weapons and armour of the same type, though using the stock models of the ingots and other materials for the time being, until I can possibly get around to creating the individual arrow and bolt heads. This one requires both Dawnguard and Dragonborn, but may make Dawnguard only and Dragonborn only versions if demand is sufficient, but nearly have a vanilla only edition ready to go up as well. Currently have it so that individual arrows are upgraded sequentially, but will add additional crafting recipes to bypass this if the player has the sufficient skill to do so and possibly allow for the upgrading of arrows and bolts in batches using the ingots and other materials.



#6
indipindi

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Oh i like that Idea!

would definitely try it ....but how about a Nexuslink?



#7
Notanon81

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It'll come soon. I'm currently working on V0.2 with the additional crafting recipes for fine to exquisite, superior to flawless, etc. Once that's done and I've created a zip file to chuck it into, I'll whack it up here. :)



#8
Notanon81

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Now up on the Nexus at: http://www.nexusmods...im/mods/51899/?

 

Mods, in light of this now being on the Nexus, please relocate this topic to the Skyrim Mod Talk forum.


Edited by Notanon81, 08 March 2014 - 08:11 AM.


#9
eddyg86

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I find it disgusting that the player can upgrade things - whereas not a SINGLE npc has any item of any upgrade value what-so-ever. I find it hard to fathom that people comment here regarding roleplay, where the immersion/roleplay is shattered by the unrealistic quality of the Player character being the only one who has upgraded a single thing via those grindstones and workbenches.

To me, this mod is unessential compared to the fact that the mod i've requested twice and to other people and has been complete ignored, which is, to have the Various Upgrade qualities (fine to legendary) applied both randomly and specifically throughout the world. Items, for example, from Jurgen Greymane, should be of a higher upgrade quality both in his store and in the hands of the Companions, for example, than anything that even a level 50 blacksmithing Player-character can upgrade to.

It kind of offends me, for example, that, my level 22 khajjit who is a fairly crappy blacksmith, at only level 16 or so, can take an iron dagger, and add a SUBSTANTIAL ammount of damage to it, but no other weapon in the world, even those found in the stores of the 'finest smiths of the land' has been sharpened in the Slightest bit.. Does this make sense?

I agree, however. The vanilla arrows and bolts could do with at least a damage haul (i used tes5edit to create a mod as soon as I got into de-conflicting my mods, it add x3 damage to all arrows and bolts from all the dlcs and mods i have, which adds to difficulty and realism, and also stops most cases of 'walking pin cushions' throughout the entire skyrim world, hah, dead in their tracks.)

But how can you people seriously look over the fact that the Dovarkiin is the ONLY person in the world who has made an item more powerful than it's default values? And that even the most humble of main characters can upgrade a steel sword to a higher damage than ANYTHING sold by the Companions Skyforge Smith? That 'bracket' (fine, heroic, legendary, for example) upgrade quality ought to be applied, both randomly, and specifically in locations, throughout most items in the entire world. It doesn't make much sense that the first smithing quest tells you to 'sharpen' your iron dagger, yet that same smith doesn't have a single upgraded/sharpened item in his entire shop. And it'd be awesome if, for Roleplay reasons, or because your skill is too low, you could pay some of the NPC's to sharpen/'fit' your weapons/armor up to their skill level, and have these items for sale, pre-sharpened!

I vote one "Random upgrade/ aka ''this blade is a little dull, i think it needs some sharpening..." mod, and say, you oughta just get an arrow damage overhaul for the entire world, which is easy pie to do yourself and if not i think one exists for all vanilla and DLC arrows which if you PM me i can help you add custom arrow types (from other mods) into, and also makes your enemies more of a challenge too, and better hunters.


Edited by eddyg86, 02 May 2014 - 05:47 AM.


#10
Notanon81

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Thanks, will consider it. I'm currently investigating using scripting to accommodate for other mods, whereby the script checks the arrow to be tempered (checking for VendorItemArrow) and what it is made of (checking for WeapMaterialIron, WeapMaterialSteel, etc) and its current tempering state via GetItemHealthPercent() and alters the tempering strength at the cost of one billet per arrow via SetItemHealthPercent() if the archery skill is high enough and the relevant smithing perks are enabled. From what I've looked at with the Creation Kit, the DLCs change the vanilla arrows that can be made in Dawnguard to include the WeapMaterial**** criteria needed, but would need to manually add the Falmer, Forsworn and Draugr and Nord Hero arrows to work around it and all the other arrows for a vanilla only or non-Dawnguard version. If I can pull that off, I might not need to add other arrows to the mod and can in turn simplify my mod by stripping out the crafting recipes and fine, exquisite, etc duplicates of the vanilla and DLC arrows and bolts and not have to worry about addtional levels above legendary due to potions and enchantments that would raise the archery skill high enough to effect it. If I can't or I give up, I'll PM you and add the additional levels and crafting recipes accordingly.

 

Either way, I agree on the craziness of enemies and other NPCs not having levelled equipment. Only thing I can think of would be a script that checks the player for playing level and other stats, then assigns any NPC with a levelled item such as a sword or decent armour a random maximum item tempering level to what they have equipped, which can change as the player levels up. Either that or manually adding fine, exquisite, etc. versions of levelled items to the existing list, which would be a nightmare (making all the tempered versions of each arrow and bolt and the accompanying recipes was a pain in the arse, I'll say that right now.). Hence a script would be much preferable if it can be pulled off, as it could also accompany additional mods without needing to manually patch them.


Edited by Notanon81, 02 May 2014 - 06:54 AM.






Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: arrows, arrow, grindstone, damage, smithing, arrowheads, forge, billets

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