Choices...

[Deleted2433418User]

Scene:Concord,sounds of Gunfire and shouting in the distance.. Enter,stage right:The Lone Wanderer and His/Her faithful Dog

"What´s that noise Boy?".. the Hero crouches and ambles nearer the distant sounds..

Enter stage Left,a Raider "hold on there! this here is off limits aníf´n youse gonna help dem buggers up the Museum youse gonna gets wasted,see?"

The Hero:"Easy now,i just wanted to see what the trouble was",The Raider" well then,youse better go talk with the Boss,Gristle,He will figure if´nif´youse is a goner or a looter..

Scene:Corner Building in Concord,the Hero and the Raider leader in Conversation: Gristle:"so whaddaya come sneaking here for Scavver??",The Hero answers : (multiple answers and consequences listed)

Gristle:"well,we´ve been tracking this Caravan and when we hit them the dug in at the Museum there.. you wanna help?,there´s plenty of loot"

The Hero:(multiple answers and consequences listed)

 

Scene Concord,Front of Museum,The Hero has declined to help the Raiders and is given leave to go but..

Enter scene,top center,Preston Garvey shouts :"Hey,you there,The Raiders are almost through the door,grab that Musket and help us!!"

The Hero replies:(multiple answers and consequences listed)...

 

This is just from the top of my head.. it is a way to circumvent the Non-roleplaying storyline that FO4 shackles on the player.. I have no idea if it will be,at all,possible to enter new dialog and alter the Main Quest in a manner that makes it possible to,actually,make use of the Open World scenario and still be able to ally with whatever faction you want..or not.. as of now i am writing lines and Scenarios where it would be obvious to make a choice. if any modder out there would like to help or give feedback as to if or how this could end up as an actual mod i would appreciate it ..

I can write Dialog and Background on any Character conceivable but i ,sorely,lack the Computer-skills to implement these in the game(any game actually)..

[montky]

cool stuff isalex;

I can see you're good at option-ing for open-ended narratives,

and that could come in handy.

Do you post to Cogwerks, OpenCog, deGaris MPC, code-stack-exchange, TWiT or elsewhere?

my own code-fu for FO4 is not so great, though there's many here and elsewhere who

might collaborate on such intriguing things...

 

something to keep in back of mind;

nCr, nPr, n!...

 

one way, would be to make 4 distinct paths, and have those be

a good, a bad, a neutral and a non-committal.

FO4 was quite a departure, in that,

there weren't as many choices for the character,

there was no disguise system and karma or faction-ratings etc...

so, as awesome as FO4 was, it stands out as being decidedly

'linear' compared to FO1, FO2, FO3, FONV...

vanilla FO4 was a lot like FO:tactics or FO:BoS

 

you seem to be interested in FORPG/GURPS stuff,

so you'd probably be interested in

an AIXML/AGIXML project, to have user-matched input strings for

'dialogue'.

 

Imagine, AGI, assigned to each of the characters,

I'm not talking cleverbot or elbot... something probably more limited than that.

maybe, stuff based on J Searle, h degaris, s inayatullah, chomsky-schutzenberger and on wilber...

all it's doing is matching a user-input string to a table of values,

but allowing users to have a 'chat' instead of only 4 options...

that would be awesome!

what is old is new again! "I Have No Mouth, And I Must Scream", FO1, FO2 etc,

they had a similar 'talking head' system...

 

players can stick to the script (buy the script/guide from the maker),

try their own luck and experiment etc...

 

not only is it pro-FORPG, it is also encouraging players to spell correctly etc

(passive value incentive framework).

nonplayer characters can interact with the player, to admonish them if they use nadsat, l337zor or slang

and reward them for 'grammar' etc...

 

this is what FO4 VR is ambitiously testing in the background,

what C Roberts and Star Citizen is looking at,

and what Fable 3 was looking at doing.

that, is the futures of RPG-open universe persistent sandbox games.

it would become very much like Conway, Coxeter and Bartlett thought...

 

you could even extend that to the game mechanics itself,

Imagine, instead of a 'games master',

you have an AGI agent that acts as the games-master...

 

-----

at the moment,

it looks that some parts of FO4 would not be interoperable with

a live-dynamic AGIXML routine,

though, batch-ing it and pre-doing that on a server farm might be a work around etc...

 

in the meantime, other modders could implement that

4-choices approach.

it would be awesome to have a lot more nuance in FO4 hehe.

 

I hope this was of some use to you,

and I do look forward to seeing what other folks come up with,

and for a project such as this, to be realized.

[Deleted2433418User]

Thank you for that input.. I do think it would be a daunting task but,as you say,if it was possible to write a "text-input" routine and implement it in the framework,thereby making it possible to,as you say,have a conversation with NPC´s it would make the Player choices a factor in the story.. and with the possibilities of multiple paths and different approaches to different Factions and Key NPC´s it could open up the World(Game) to actual Roleplay... I will continue writing on the "Manuscript" adding lines to NPC´s and and improving on the Main Characters Dialogue with Faction Leaders and underlings.. maybe adding small notes to Raiders,Robots,Gunners and so on implying the Power-structure and various in-fighting in certain Factions.. The possibilities are endless and that is what an "Open-World" RPG should be all about..non-linear,yet with an underlying quest that may or may not be followed..

[Athanasa]

I think that, in terms of interface, we're stuck with terrible console mode '4 responses only', which could/would result in horrific amounts of chat tree nesting to get variety.

 

 

Yes

No

More

___ Reactions

______ Persuade for something

______ Threaten for something

______ Attempt non conflict resolution

___ Questions

______ About Yourself

__________ Who are you / what do you do

__________ Why are you here / where are you going

______________ Persuade: You're not telling the whole story

______ About Quest

__________ How do I get there

__________ Any advice? Hints?

__________ How did this happen?

______________ Persuade: You're not telling me everything

Bye

 

 

See? Now imagine a more complex conversation, with multiple topics. Imagine the mess from actually trying to ask Farther the appropriate questions a parent might want to ask. How many times would you have to nest another level down because you need more than 4 options?

[Deleted2433418User]

hmmm.. i see your point but.. how many times do you ask different questions to get an answer to your problems??.. as in a RL conversation with either strangers or friends,more oftne than not the conversation is a roundabout.. you start with one thing and thereby edge on to more info on what you need.. i do not think it would be a bother for Hard-core RPG fans ,maybe,for random players and Consolers but,i have the intention to make conversations matter.. the first thing that struck me upon buying and playing FO4 was.. why do i,automatically consider this or that faction enemies?.. why are there no possibility to talk your way out of encounters? why does my answers not matter ??.. that is why i have decided to try,at least,to make these flaws go away

[Athanasa]

The issue for me would be with the absolutely terrible interface because it limits you to displaying only 4 options at any one time, with one of those options always being 'bye' or 'back'. So essentially you therefore only have three open dialogue 'slots' visible on the screen at any one time.

 

See the problem now? It's horrifically user unfriendly. Imagine drilling down four tiers of menus to be able to ask your question.

[Yodhrin]

​Is that CK/engine issue though, or a UI issue? By which I mean, is it functionally impossible to have more than four responses at any given point in a conversation, or is it just a matter of finding someone capable of screwing with the interface files?

[Deleted2433418User]

I just had a friend looking at the Engine/interface.. He does know a lot about this stuff and he,bluntly,told me that i would have to write a completely new interface and then rewrite the whole game if i wanted to deviate from the hardcoded storyline.. as he put it.. "the problem lies in the way the engine opens areas and how the interface locks you to certain,predefined actions.. you can´t do what you plan unless you write a whole new game".. which,sadly,i am unable to.. i retract my suggestion and will scrap all dialogue so far written.. this is impossible...

[montky]

hello ISalex,

funny you should mention that in post #8 of this thread,

Impossible has seemingly happened and tada! now we've got another awesome mod to add to the mod awesome in FO4 hehe.

 

though I thought if you've not already come across it yet, you'd be instantly interested to hear of it.

Extended Dialogue Interface mod.

EDI. NMM Mod #27216

 

i think you might enjoy it.

 

 

 

within that framework,

it is possible to do some 'floating-point meta-variables" as you discussed previously and via NMM mail.

so say, you wanted notes and NPCs to only speak about stuff that they know...

or, you want to restore "Talking Heads" (AGIXML or similar as a chatbot-input...) so as you can actually type to an NPC!

we're almost at a point where prototyping for that could emerge.

 

 

it may also be possible, amongst other things,

to make this XDI/EDI framework interoperable with AGIXML in the backend...

for NPC voiceovers, and the such like from chatbot throughputs in an AHaH or deep neural web...

so, we could make the voiceover more complex than

say, "Charlie brown of the wasteland"/"Simlish"/"coughs, snuffles and mumbles" -

we can make the audio via voice actor asset hehe.

 

-----

Think "s1m0ne" or "The Congress" yeah?!

almost 'real-time in-game" - like, a portrait, but, a likeness of the Fallout fan,

much as Michio Kaku alluded to in "Physics of the Future"

"Mirror Mirror, on the wall... can you recreate x,y,z movie, except put me and my friends in it"

Fallout 4 VR is pretty much that.