Pre-Culling issues with editing Interior Cell (Mechanist's Lair)

[Medizy]

Hey there! I'm kind of stumped right now and would love any help I can get. I am doing a Merchanist's Lair Clean-up/restoration/performance mod right now, I'm not deleting any references, simply marking them as 'Initially disabled' and moving the clutter away. But when I test them ingame, without any mods installed (Outside of the official DLCs), I would get pre-culling issues, where certain textures would disappear from certain distance/angles. This is most prominent of which in the locked door to the Mechanist's Lair from Robco Sells and Service Center. Which is especially strange since I didn't come close to editing anything in that area, I've only started the clean-up in areas like Isabel Cruz's sleeping area.

 

Is there some way that I can disable pre-culling for a particular cell in my ESP? Any help whatsoever would be greatly appreciated!

[VIitS]

You touched a precombined mesh, therefore your mod disables previs and precombineds. Unfortunately, under the previs Bethesda left a very sloppily done roombounds/portals setup that is disabled when previs is active, but comes back when it isn't. I don't know why they would bother with it at all if they aren't gonna even try to do it right, but that's Bethesda logic for you.

 

Only way to deal with it is to generate new previs and precombineds, and hopefully do so in a way that actually works (since that system seems to be very hit-or-miss, especially with interior cells, and most especially for that cell (which has over 27k records).

[Medizy]

You touched a precombined mesh, therefore your mod disables previs and precombineds. Unfortunately, under the previs Bethesda left a very sloppily done roombounds/portals setup that is disabled when previs is active, but comes back when it isn't. I don't know why they would bother with it at all if they aren't gonna even try to do it right, but that's Bethesda logic for you.

 

Only way to deal with it is to generate new previs and precombineds, and hopefully do so in a way that actually works (since that system seems to be very hit-or-miss, especially with interior cells, and most especially for that cell (which has over 27k records).

 

Oh wow, the area I edited didn't come anywhere close to that door. I generated Precombined visibility under the Visibility Tag but the issue hasn't been resolved. How do you generate new previs?

 

Thanks for responding by the way!

[VIitS]

It's one huge cell, so if you disable previs/precombineds at all, it's disabled for the whole thing (and any time you touch a precombined mesh, it will be completely disabled. There is no way to do a clean-up mod without doing so).

 

To generate new previs:

1) First, generate new precombineds* (as precombineds seem to be the main thing used when generating visibility)

2) Visibility -> Generate visibility for Current Cell (when you have the cell in question loaded**

 

*World -> Precombine geometry for Current Cell

**You might have to have the surrounding cells also open for exterior cells, as previs data is generated in 3x3 squares of cells (excepting interior cells, which are by themselves)

 

edit: You might also have to redo the "generate Precombined visibility" option as well, after you remake the precombineds.

 

There is no guarantee it will actually work. For Scrap Everything, shadow and Kuro made new previs/precombineds for the Lair and Vault 88 in an attempt to allow more stuff to be scrapped without causing the issues you are seeing, and it seems very hit or miss on whether or not it will work for a given mod user. If you get it working at all, I would definitely recommend packing everything in a .ba2 archive as one of the common causes (though far from the only one) of it not working right is not all the files installing properly. Shouldn't be a problem when you are the one making it, but I'm pretty sure the tool only works half the time anyway (It has definitely been broken more than once since the release of the CK, and you can never be sure they haven't re-broken it with an update).

 

 

Alternatively, if you don't want to deal with the previs system, look up some tutorials on making room-bounds/previs, and fix the mess Bethesda made of that cell. It would probably take more work, but once you got it right it would probably work more consistently, and you wouldn't have to worry about any mod incompatibilities.

[Medizy]

It's one huge cell, so if you disable previs/precombineds at all, it's disabled for the whole thing (and any time you touch a precombined mesh, it will be completely disabled. There is no way to do a clean-up mod without doing so).

 

To generate new previs:

1) First, generate new precombineds* (as precombineds seem to be the main thing used when generating visibility)

2) Visibility -> Generate visibility for Current Cell (when you have the cell in question loaded**

 

*World -> Precombine geometry for Current Cell

**You might have to have the surrounding cells also open for exterior cells, as previs data is generated in 3x3 squares of cells (excepting interior cells, which are by themselves)

 

edit: You might also have to redo the "generate Precombined visibility" option as well, after you remake the precombineds.

 

There is no guarantee it will actually work. For Scrap Everything, shadow and Kuro made new previs/precombineds for the Lair and Vault 88 in an attempt to allow more stuff to be scrapped without causing the issues you are seeing, and it seems very hit or miss on whether or not it will work for a given mod user. If you get it working at all, I would definitely recommend packing everything in a .ba2 archive as one of the common causes (though far from the only one) of it not working right is not all the files installing properly. Shouldn't be a problem when you are the one making it, but I'm pretty sure the tool only works half the time anyway (It has definitely been broken more than once since the release of the CK, and you can never be sure they haven't re-broken it with an update).

 

 

Alternatively, if you don't want to deal with the previs system, look up some tutorials on making room-bounds/previs, and fix the mess Bethesda made of that cell. It would probably take more work, but once you got it right it would probably work more consistently, and you wouldn't have to worry about any mod incompatibilities.

 

Well, I generated a Precombineds from the World Tab, then generated Visibility of it under the Visibility Tab, then packaged it into a .ba2. And when testing out I got this...

 

http://i.imgur.com/PsQNgDb.jpg

 

At least the door I had issues with was fixed. What am I doing wrong here?

[VIitS]

Not sure, that's one of the issues we had for some people with that cell. You could try checking out

on making precombineds and previs. I haven't watched it myself, but his tutorial on making custom collisions was good.

[SMB92]

Time to revive the dead.

 

I've just done Vault 88, there correct method was to generate precombined for current cell, then generate previs for current cell, then generate precombined previs for current cell. Worked without a problem, no problem placing on ground or anything. Draw call rate is much nicer than without, in some case 8 to 10000 calls less.

 

Wanted to post this here in case you are still following the thread.

[JamesWalker]

Sorry to necro this, but does anybody know how one might go about fixing persistent preculling issues here? It's a long story; in brief, I tried making a mod to remove a particular precombined object, undoubtedly did it wrong, and now when the mod is removed, all the walls and ceilings flicker in and out of transparency. It's fine with the mod installed, except the things I had scrapped using the "Scrap Everything" mod reappear. I don't know what I did.

Even if I load a save before I even installed the mod, it still happens if the mod is disabled. That I find really bizarre.

Also to note, that if I use the ini command "bUseCombinedObjects=0", the cell displays correctly, but I know my performance will take a dive in some locations as a result.

If anyone can help me understand what I did wrong and find a way to fix it, I'd be most appreciative.