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JSawyer Ultimate/Original stuttering

jsawyer performance bugs stuttering

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#1
nikolaithesovietspy

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So, to start off, I had tested my other mods to see if they had any impact and I had no change in results with them.

 

Whenever I use either JSawyer Ultimate Edition or JSawyer, my game will do the following:

 

In certain outside locations (such as around the Nevada Highway Patrol Station) the game will start to stutter for about half a second every second, while stuttering the game "freezes" (does not respond to any inputs, screen is frozen and game events stop) Reloading saves prior to entering these areas stops it, but once the area is entered, the stuttering is permanent. Oddly enough, stuttering stops when I enter interior cells, so I *think* that somehow JSawyer is creating a problem with certain exterior cells, however using cell purge mods did not help either. NVSE and JIP are all up to date and all DLC properly downloaded, along with compatibility mods

 

Any feedback would be appreciated

 

Computer specs:

 

 RAM:  3537 Mb

Graphics Card: AMD Radeon 8400 (yes i know its a potato but i still get like 40 fps)

 Windows 10 (64 bit)

    Monitor Refresh Rate: 60 Hz
   Desktop Resolution: 1366 x 768
 

 

My load order: (with JSawyer Ultimate Edition)

 

  0  0     FalloutNV.esm
  1  1     DeadMoney.esm
  2  2     HonestHearts.esm
  3  3     OldWorldBlues.esm
  4  4     LonesomeRoad.esm
  5  5     GunRunnersArsenal.esm
  6  6     ClassicPack.esm
  7  7     MercenaryPack.esm
  8  8     TribalPack.esm
  9  9     CaravanPack.esm
 10  a     YUP - Base Game + All DLC.esm
 11  b     NVInteriors_Core.esm
 12  c     oHUD.esm
 13  d     NVInteriors_WastelandEditon.esm
 14  e     Project Nevada - Core.esm
 15  f     Project Nevada - Equipment.esm
 16 10     Weapons.of.the.New.Millenia.esm
 17 11     Project Nevada - Rebalance.esp
 18 12     Project Nevada - Cyberware.esp
 19 13     Project Nevada - Extra Options.esm
 20 14     YUP - NPC Fixes (Base Game + All DLC).esp
 21 15     Weapons.of.the.New.Millenia.Leveled.Lists.esp
 22 16     The Weapon Mod Menu.esp
 23 17     The Mod Configuration Menu.esp
 24 18     Mojave Raiders.esp
 25 19     Unofficial Patch Plus.esp
 26 1a     Weapons.of.the.New.Millenia.Honest.Hearts.Grunt.Patch.esp
 27 1b     TrooperOverhaul-Dragbody.esp
 28 1c     Alternative Start.esp
 29 1d     Weapons.of.the.New.Millenia.Store.esp
 30 1e     Clarity - Dark Nights.esp
 31 1f     updatedWearGlassesandMasks.esp
 32 20     M50 Sniper Rifle.esp
 33 21     NCRTrooperOverhaul.esp
 34 22     FNV NPCs Travel.esp
 35 23     NewVegasStrip&FreesideMarkers_v2.esp
 36 24     VarmintRifle22LR.esp
 37 25     CAGE 1.9.3.2.esp
 38 26     UnlimitedCompanions.esp
 39 27     Serbu.esp
 40 28     TOZ66.esp
 41 29     CouriersArmoredDusterOW.esp
 42 2a     CASM.esp
 43 2b     Ranger Merc Helms - Duffle Bag.esp
 44 2c     Toggle Aim.esp
 45 2d     Project Nevada - Old World Blues (No Cyberware).esp
 46 2e     DLC WITM - Complete.esp
 47 2f     MosinNagant.esp
 48 30     NVSE_KPD.esp
 49 31     Colt N99 10mm.esp
 50 32     Conelrad 640-1240.esp
 51 33     Black Rifle Reworked - 0.1.esp
 52 34     357retex.esp
 53 35     Zan_AutoPurge_SmartAgro_NV.esp
 54 36     Project Nevada - Cyberware Additions.esp
 55 37     Project Nevada - Rebalance Complete.esp
 56 38     Project Nevada - All DLC.esp
 57 39     Unofficial Patch Plus - Project Nevada Patch.esp
 58 3a     JSawyer Ultimate.esp
 59 3b     JSawyer Ultimate - Project Nevada Patch.esp
 
 


#2
dubiousintent

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Here's your problem: RAM:  3537 Mb and a GPU without dedicated VRAM.  With less than 3.5GB of RAM, you are pretty much stuck at the game default allocation of 2GB.  The 4GB patch will let you get the most you can use, but not much.  Every version of Windows has increased the size of the footprint it retains in memory.  But without dedicated VRAM, your video card has to use system RAM instead.  So that reduces what is available to the game as well.

 

Image size matters.  A 4096 x 4096 image with 16 bit color resolution is 32 MB of data. If your screen is displaying 100 different models with textures that size, that's 3.2 GB of data just for the textures. Since a 32 bit program can only address up to 4 GB of data in total, you can see how trying to display a lot of high resolution models is going to run the game out of memory very quickly.  (Thank you for the perspective madmongo.)  Without VRAM, that all has to be rendered in the system RAM.

Another thing to consider is that larger images take longer to pass through the video pipeline.  When such larger sizes were not considered in the game design (and they weren't at the time), bottlenecks are to be expected.
 

Re: Stuttering or "micro-stutters".  All visual stuttering problems are caused by the video stream having to wait for the "art assets" required to render the display OR the game writing something to disk (such as a save game file or logging). Mostly these are due to the hard disk drive being orders of magnitude slower than VRAM, with System RAM (e.g. "ENBoost") and "solid state drives" (SSDs) being in between. There are internal design choices that cannot be overcome. The following are "mitigations" that have been found to help some people.

Please see the following entries under the 'Solutions to Performance problems' section in the wiki Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide if you haven't already.
* 'Issue: "Full screen mode" exhibits CTDs and stutters or micro-stutters'
* 'Issue: Lag or "micro stutters" even with "New Vegas Stutter Remover" installed'
* 'Issue: Win10 Screen tearing in "Borderless Windowed Mode"'
* 'Issue: CTD without warning, "Out of Memory error", or stops responding after the Main Menu' for other settings that can indirectly affect micro-stutter.
* There are also some NVSR configuration suggestions under the 'Issue: Game in slow motion' and entries.
* The 'Issue: What's with these Solid Green billboard signs in the distance (LOD)?' entry under the 'Solutions to Mesh (Red "!" icon) or Texture (solid color) problems' section can also help if your problems started after you installed VWD/LOD texture packages.
* If you are using CASM or some similar "auto-save" mod to manage your save game files (recommended), try increasing the "time between saves" set in the "save frequency"; and reducing the number of occasions it saves to the minimum (e.g. disable most "Autosave Events" in CASM) and see how that impacts the game seeming to freeze temporarily.
* If you have "NVSE logging" enabled (see the 'Checklist Item #4' entry in the wiki "Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide), disable it until actually needed.

Reading from or writing to disk for any reason is the slowest thing the game does.

As you can see, there are a number of things that can underlie your problem.  If one of these doesn't fix it, I would be interested to hear about any eventual solution that does.
 

The end result is you need to treat your system more like an XBox console.  Some mods are going to be too much in some areas for it, because they assume you have more graphics memory than a console.  You might try using the "low quality" game graphics setting.  That will reduce the strain on the video pipeline.

 

* Do not use an "Auto-purge" mod for game play.  (That was old advice from before we knew better.)  They are designed for debugging by mod creator's only, according to the author of the JIP extensions to NVSE.  See the 'Issue: CTD without warning, "Out of Memory error", or stops responding after the Main Menu', "Cause-2", "Solution-3" entry in the wiki "Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide for the game settings that do the same job.
 

* You really need to use a "Merge Patch File" with that collection of mods.  Please see the 'Third Rule: The Rule of One' and 'Merge Patch File' sections of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article.
 

-Dubious-



#3
nikolaithesovietspy

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Here's your problem: RAM:  3537 Mb and a GPU without dedicated VRAM.  With less than 3.5GB of RAM, you are pretty much stuck at the game default allocation of 2GB.  The 4GB patch will let you get the most you can use, but not much.  Every version of Windows has increased the size of the footprint it retains in memory.  But without dedicated VRAM, your video card has to use system RAM instead.  So that reduces what is available to the game as well.

 

Image size matters.  A 4096 x 4096 image with 16 bit color resolution is 32 MB of data. If your screen is displaying 100 different models with textures that size, that's 3.2 GB of data just for the textures. Since a 32 bit program can only address up to 4 GB of data in total, you can see how trying to display a lot of high resolution models is going to run the game out of memory very quickly.  (Thank you for the perspective madmongo.)  Without VRAM, that all has to be rendered in the system RAM.

Another thing to consider is that larger images take longer to pass through the video pipeline.  When such larger sizes were not considered in the game design (and they weren't at the time), bottlenecks are to be expected.
 

Re: Stuttering or "micro-stutters".  All visual stuttering problems are caused by the video stream having to wait for the "art assets" required to render the display OR the game writing something to disk (such as a save game file or logging). Mostly these are due to the hard disk drive being orders of magnitude slower than VRAM, with System RAM (e.g. "ENBoost") and "solid state drives" (SSDs) being in between. There are internal design choices that cannot be overcome. The following are "mitigations" that have been found to help some people.

Please see the following entries under the 'Solutions to Performance problems' section in the wiki Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide if you haven't already.
* 'Issue: "Full screen mode" exhibits CTDs and stutters or micro-stutters'
* 'Issue: Lag or "micro stutters" even with "New Vegas Stutter Remover" installed'
* 'Issue: Win10 Screen tearing in "Borderless Windowed Mode"'
* 'Issue: CTD without warning, "Out of Memory error", or stops responding after the Main Menu' for other settings that can indirectly affect micro-stutter.
* There are also some NVSR configuration suggestions under the 'Issue: Game in slow motion' and entries.
* The 'Issue: What's with these Solid Green billboard signs in the distance (LOD)?' entry under the 'Solutions to Mesh (Red "!" icon) or Texture (solid color) problems' section can also help if your problems started after you installed VWD/LOD texture packages.
* If you are using CASM or some similar "auto-save" mod to manage your save game files (recommended), try increasing the "time between saves" set in the "save frequency"; and reducing the number of occasions it saves to the minimum (e.g. disable most "Autosave Events" in CASM) and see how that impacts the game seeming to freeze temporarily.
* If you have "NVSE logging" enabled (see the 'Checklist Item #4' entry in the wiki "Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide), disable it until actually needed.

Reading from or writing to disk for any reason is the slowest thing the game does.

As you can see, there are a number of things that can underlie your problem.  If one of these doesn't fix it, I would be interested to hear about any eventual solution that does.
 

The end result is you need to treat your system more like an XBox console.  Some mods are going to be too much in some areas for it, because they assume you have more graphics memory than a console.  You might try using the "low quality" game graphics setting.  That will reduce the strain on the video pipeline.

 

* Do not use an "Auto-purge" mod for game play.  (That was old advice from before we knew better.)  They are designed for debugging by mod creator's only, according to the author of the JIP extensions to NVSE.  See the 'Issue: CTD without warning, "Out of Memory error", or stops responding after the Main Menu', "Cause-2", "Solution-3" entry in the wiki "Fallout NV Mod Conflict Troubleshooting" guide for the game settings that do the same job.
 

* You really need to use a "Merge Patch File" with that collection of mods.  Please see the 'Third Rule: The Rule of One' and 'Merge Patch File' sections of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article.
 

-Dubious-

 

 

Thanks for the help! First, I'm gonna do a clean wipe of Fallout New Vegas after backing up its files because my mod folder is a complete mess, afterwards I'll take into account what you said.







Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: jsawyer, performance, bugs, stuttering

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