Vortex FNIS Integration Feature - Bugged with PCEA2 (player character exclusive animations only) for FNIS by fore Installed

[fore]

 

This is my final response to fore until he is able to see reason :sad:

 

You can't imagine how happy I am. More users like you and I would definitely providing help desk. You know what your problem is? While expecting others to read your insane walls of unjustified text, you just don't read and comprehend what others have to say.

 

When I tell a user to make a certain test, then I expect him to do JUST AS I SAY, and not do something what you think is equivalent. With out telling.

 

And when I say that users MUST NOT copy files directly into the Vortex mod folders, then I expect it to be acknowledged. And what have you done? You shown a picture of a path

Vortex\skyrim\mods\<RAP>\meshes\actors\character\animations\FNIS_PCEA2\8_FeuerTin RAP Idle\mt_idle.hkx

This path is total stupid nonsense. What do you think you can achieve with it? N O T H I N G.

 

There is NO Vortex problem whatsoever. Only the mistakes of an unreasonable user.

[H0LL0FIED]

 

 

This is my final response to fore until he is able to see reason :sad:

 

You can't imagine how happy I am. More users like you and I would definitely providing help desk. You know what your problem is? While expecting others to read your insane walls of unjustified text, you just don't read and comprehend what others have to say.

 

When I tell a user to make a certain test, then I expect him to do JUST AS I SAY, and not do something what you think is equivalent. With out telling.

 

And when I say that users MUST NOT copy files directly into the Vortex mod folders, then I expect it to be acknowledged. And what have you done? You shown a picture of a path

Vortex\skyrim\mods\<RAP>\meshes\actors\character\animations\FNIS_PCEA2\8_FeuerTin RAP Idle\mt_idle.hkx

This path is total stupid nonsense. What do you think you can achieve with it? N O T H I N G.

 

There is NO Vortex problem whatsoever. Only the mistakes of an unreasonable user.

 

You aren't the only one that's happy about this decision :turned:

 

I have refused to provide you papyrus logs as I believe I do not need to provide them to you as this bug/issue is not your responsibility to fix.

I apolgoize for the final time about bothering you with regards to this topic: Your mods/tools function perfectly but Vortex Integration DOES NOT function properly with PCEA2 related animations; this includes the animations you provided with PCEA2 and any other player character exclusive animations by other animation mods that support PCEA2 functionality.

 

I have Not copied any files Directly Into Vortex Mod Folders.

I have Downloaded/Installed/Enabled animation mods Directly via Vortex and That Image was the Result and was provided as helpful INFORMATION for Vortex STAFF.

 

You say that path is total stupid nonsense but I was not the one who set up that path; that is the path used by that respective animation mod as provided by the animation mod author FeuerTin. This path Functions Correctly in-game when you directly update behaviors through the FNIS Tool Directly.

 

I Say Again For The Final Time: Vortex FNIS Integration is Bugged with regards to player character exclusive animations that rely on PCEA2! There is nothing wrong with Your Mods (PCEA2) or Tools (FNIS), I have clearly stated this and everything else above for you over and over and over and over and will do so No More as you are not a native english speaker and do not understand the vast majority of my responses.

 

Update: Edits to this post and the one before it are finished.

 

Good Bye

Edited March 13, 2019 by DeusX7

[fore]

 

Sorry for the late reply.

Regarding what you said about noobs learning the ropes on modding, I agree insofar as that modding isn't trivial, especially the moment you move past simple texture replacers and such and that users need to learn how to use them.

The problem is that they frequently don't and tools like steam workshop, bethesda.net or that other modding site that shall not be mentioned don't make this easier, they create the illusion that modding is plug&play and don't really cater for more complex mods at all.

 

One problem is that there is so much that new users need to learn, like running fnis, cleaning plugins, merging plugins, dealing with install and load order, esls vs esms, ...

The impression users get is they can either go to those other pages and get a plug&play experience or they come here and have to deal with all this complexity all at once.

 

What we try with Vortex is keep things easy until it's absolutely necessary users deal with it, e.g. we don't ask users to learn how to order their plugins, we try to automate it but provide help for when the automation fails. We're not hiding the complexity entirely, we try to expose the user to it in a "staggered" fashion so users don't have to learn all at once.

 

In that spirit, instead of telling first time users "you may see CTDs once you go over x custom animations" and expect them to remember that, I would rather not trouble a new user with that information and instead provide diagnostics once it starts becoming relevant (e.g. if (number_of_custom_animations > 5000) then notify_user("dude, you have a lot of custom animations, if you're seeing the game CTD, this may be the reason. Please press this link to learn more")).

Have users learn what they need to know as they grow their mod installation, not everything up-front.

This is obviously a tall order though, as it does require us (Vortex developers) to know about the common issues and signs to watch for. hence if you do have common issues, especially when they seem to be intensified by Vortex, feel free to send us a quick message like "see issue <link> - vortex is making this worse" or "see issue <link> - vortex could do better helping to avoid/fix this".

It should be our problem, not yours, if our users don't know enough about using FNIS when going through Vortex.

 

Yes, I see your point that users seem to expect modding without any effort. The expectations have changed from the time I joined Nexus fifteen years ago. We were happy that we were able to understand the game internals and modify them. Ourselves, and even as a user only. Today's users only seem happy when the can install 255 or more mods in no time. Sigh.

 

Regarding the animation load CTD issue I was thinking of a solution like the one you propose. But generally making a warning at about 7,500 animations (around where the problem is starting) although for most users the limit is way above that? Because the warning is the only way to force the FNIS window being shown. I didn't think that this is a good idea. Because many users would have an unjustified warning all the time. Therefore in the next version I will calculate the probable break down level and make a warning then.

[HadToRegister]

 

I Say Again For The Final Time: Vortex Integration with FNIS is Bugged! There is nothing wrong with Your Mods (PCEA2) or Tools (FNIS), I have clearly stated this and everything else above for you over and over and over and over and will do so No More.

 

 

 

 

I can tell you that everything works perfectly fine with SkyRim SE and Vortex.

I turned off FNIS integration (Never used it)

Set my paths correctly in the Dashboard

I can set everything in MCM

 

If Vortex doesn't work with FNIS and it's bugged, why are you the only one reporting it?

A bug like that would have quite a large number of people in here reporting it as a bug, instead, as fore pointed out, you have weird animation paths that are wrong, (which you are completely ignoring), he's asked you to do a specific test to verify something about the claim you're making (which you have completely ignored several times now) and instead of posting any actual INFORMATION about this 'bug', you instead never post that you have tried the solutions/tests that fore has asked you to do, you REFUSED to provide papyrus logs that might help fore figure out your problem, but instead insist that it's a Vortex problem, so you won't even provide the mod author with info that could be helpful and solve your issue.

 

There's nothing more frustrating than to try and help someone that refuses to follow any of the suggestions/instructions from the person who is trying to help them.

 

Give fore the papyrus logs

 

Also, I should tell you, that using 'coc riverwood' or 'coc ANYWHERE" is a bad idea, because you miss script triggers for each area when you do that, Arthmoor could tell you more about that.

 

Are you installing animations from BOTH LE and SE?

 

What I got from your original description is is that you have to go way out of your way, using console commands in order to get this 'bug'

That's not how bugs work.

A bug should happen when you're doing ordinary things

[H0LL0FIED]

@HadToRegister

 

This is a low priority bug related to Integration - Vortex Integration with FNIS is a quality of life feature that Vortex provides to all users.

Yes, everything (fnis/pcea2/player character exclusive animation mods that support pcea2 functionality) works perfectly fine with Skyrim LE as long as FNIS Integration in Vortex is disabled.

I can set everything I want via MCM as long as I did not deploy with Vortex Integration for FNIS enabled (Quality of Life Feature provided by Vortex). Vortex Integration is a quality of life feature that when enabled is bugged with regards to player character animations that are supported through pcea2.

 

Vortex Integration works with FNIS and is Not bugged. The PCEA2 mod has roughly an 18th (fraction - 1/18) of the total downloads that FNIS has (FNIS total download count: 18 million) so I would not be surprised if no one has reported on this before now seeing as most people can't be bothered to install player character exclusive animations via installing PCEA2 to support them.

 

This problem is not related directly to fore's mods and he is not responsible for fixing anything wrong with a feature (Integration with FNIS) provided by Vortex.

 

I will not provide papyrus logs exclusively so that fore can look at them, as once more, this is not an issue for him to solve unless a Vortex Developer/Staff say otherwise. This would be in the event that Vortex Developers are unable to fix the issue/bug themselves through Vortex.

 

I use the coc command exclusively to test some mods and in this case animation mods to see if they're working. This bug can be replicated in a new game/saved game or via the coc riverwood command after MCM finishes loading (displayed in the top left corner of the game).

 

I do not own a copy of Skyrim SE, I have only installed Skyrim LE related animation replacers/mods and other mods via the Skyrim/mods directory on the Nexus or the skyrim (LE) main page on the Nexus.

 

I have already stated all of the above in prior posts. I apologize if it "WAS" hard to read at first I have since gone back and enhanced these posts.

 

 

I am currently waiting on a call from work which I expect to receive soon.

 

Thank you for understanding and for your response.

Edited March 14, 2019 by DeusX7

[H0LL0FIED]

The only one(s) not driving me up a wall right now with questions I have already answered is the Vortex Developer Tannin and some of the initial posts/questions by HadToRegister and for that I Thank Them Profusely :thumbsup:

I understand that some of you are just trying to help but some of you do not fully understand the topic/subject to which I have posted initially.

I have no issues using the Tool FNIS or PCEA2 with Vortex Integration Disabled in order to see my player character exclusive animation(s) mods in-game.

Vortex Integration is a quality of life feature provided by Vortex that needs a little bug fixing.

 

I apologize again for any lack of clarity in any of my posts and for their initial lack of organization - They have been updated and enhanced since then.

Edited March 14, 2019 by DeusX7

[H0LL0FIED]

I wish I had thought to do this sooner, oh well tough, but you know what they say... a picture says a thousand words... so here's 3 important ones with relevant text:

 

Vortex FNIS Integration (Quality of Life feature provided by Vortex for Users) is DISABLED in the image below - This means I ran the FNIS Tool with my 2 installed player character exclusive animations and ran the game via the SKSE Executable:

 

This is my Vortex Updating the FNIS Animations after Enabling Vortex FNIS Integration (Quality of Life feature provided by Vortex for Users) - This means that I enabled Vortex FNIS Integration>Deployed my mods:

 

Vortex FNIS Integration (Quality of Life feature provided by Vortex for Users) is ENABLED in the image below - This means that I enabled Vortex FNIS Integration>Deployed my mods>Sorted them WITH BOTH of my selected player character exclusive animations installed and then ran the game through the SKSE executable:

 

There's more I want to say but I have to go to work so this image will have to do:

OH and yes I refreshed the animations in MCM>FNIS PCEA2 before taking these pictures.

Update: Resized the pictures above

Edited March 14, 2019 by DeusX7

[fore]

 

 

 

 

.... that is the path used by that respective animation mod as provided by the animation mod author FeuerTin.

 

 

Ok, another bending of truth in order to justify misleading responses.

 

The mod Realistic Animation Project - Idles 1.1 76862 contains a lot of hkx files. But none that is called mt_idle.hkx, none that is located in meshes, and especially none that is trying to directly modify PCEA2.

 

In my opinion should users be BANNED from Nexus when they intentionally lie at people who are faithfully trying to help.

[HadToRegister]

@HadToRegister

 

 

Yes, everything (fnis/pcea2/player character exclusive animation mods that support pcea2 functionality) works perfectly fine with Skyrim LE as long as FNIS Integration in Vortex is disabled.

 

OK, I think I'm getting it now, this entire discussion "bug" is based on semantics only, and is not a bug.

The "ToDo" list applet on which is basically "Easy Mode" labels the "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" as FNIS INTEGRATION", and for whatever reason, you think that by turning off the "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" which you consider "FNIS INTEGRATION" is somehow a bug and somehow (to you) proves Vortex doesn't work with FNIS.

 

You ignored my post where I stated that I have always had "Run FNIS on Deployment Event", TURNED OFF because You DO NOT NEED that option turned on, to use FNIS with Vortex.

Because it will run FNIS every single time a mod deploys, and that's not necessary if you've installed your animations and FNIS properly, and have run it ONCE.

 

"FNIS INTEGRATION" is just the "Easy Mode" way of saying "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" and does NOT turn the ability for FNIS to work with Vortex.

[H0LL0FIED]

I've resized and reduced the file size for the embedded reaction images below for Nexus use. These are used for comedic relief as I need it while proof-reading my post (preview post) and I'm sure everyone else could use the relief as well....

I resize all images I post and I apologize if any in previous posts were still too big.

 

Ok, another bending of truth in order to justify misleading responses.

The mod Realistic Animation Project - Idles 1.1 76862 contains a lot of hkx files. But none that is called mt_idle.hkx, none that is located in meshes, and especially none that is trying to directly modify PCEA2.

In my opinion should users be BANNED from Nexus when they intentionally lie at people who are faithfully trying to help.

(Image: The man in the foreground is my reaction and the man in the background is my subconscious)

• I really did not want to have to edit and post this many images (link below) but seeing as how I'm dealing with someone whose native language is not English I will.
• For me, posting these pictures means almost every response until now was a waste of time with regards to you as you do not understand my responses because of a language barrier.
• I have done nothing but respond to you politely with as much information as I can, as clear as I can. I personally do not need your help with this bug anymore as I have a way to get around it until Vortex (Integration) is patched. You provided the work around yourself and I just repackaged it for Vortex users. I've said all of this multiple times now and it has just not gotten through to you.
• I do Not appreciate being called a liar publicly, I would never intentionally lie either; and I'm going to address your statement directly below....

Just to show everyone that I didn't touch anything in RAP - Idles 1.1 :

I've removed RAP - Idles 1.1 from my Vortex completely (archive included) and Now I'm going to re-download it via Vortex in steps (screenshots) for you and Everyone else to see in the link below.

 

Go to this link (Steps 0 - 10): https://imgur.com/gallery/H1Cv0J3

^Step number 10 is special and must be loaded manually (Click load 1 more image) at the bottom of the page.

 

@fore

I have not ignored you and I have responded to your inquisitions appropriately as I've seen fit.

I just wanted to make sure you were aware of this issue in the event that you get asked about it.

After understanding/reading and clicking through all the images in the link above;

• Do you believe I'm lying to you despite responding appropriately to everything you've posted thus far? I've had to humble myself many times...
• Do you believe I'm just a "naive noob" that has intentionally lied about finding bugs related to Vortex?
• Do you believe I would waste my time making this topic if I hadn't verified the bug myself beforehand?
• Do you believe I would waste my time responding to anyone here if I didn't hope for the bug to be fixed? (the bug is very much real but it is a low priority bug)
• Do you still believe I lied about modifying any files or mods up until now prior to Vortex installation and deployment?

I really did not appreciate being called a Liar after all of my responses. After all this I feel like I'm on trial (in court) with you....

If somehow you still feel I lied then by now you should be Guessing Again.... (please don't)

OK, I think I'm getting it now, this entire discussion "bug" is based on semantics only, and is not a bug.

The "ToDo" list applet on which is basically "Easy Mode" labels the "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" as FNIS INTEGRATION", and for whatever reason, you think that by turning off the "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" which you consider "FNIS INTEGRATION" is somehow a bug and somehow (to you) proves Vortex doesn't work with FNIS.

You ignored my post where I stated that I have always had "Run FNIS on Deployment Event", TURNED OFF because You DO NOT NEED that option turned on, to use FNIS with Vortex.
Because it will run FNIS every single time a mod deploys, and that's not necessary if you've installed your animations and FNIS properly, and have run it ONCE.

"FNIS INTEGRATION" is just the "Easy Mode" way of saying "Run FNIS on Deployment Event" and does NOT turn the ability for FNIS to work with Vortex.

Click the link above in this post (if you haven't already); read everything above/below and understand it before you post again please.

Your use of the English language is a little harder to understand/follow now; is your native language not English either?

• PCEA2 is an extension for the FNIS Tool so everyone can have player character exclusive animations....
• Vortex Developers added a feature that integrates the FNIS Tool into Vortex if you follow the appropriate steps: "Target" and "Start In" directories via editing the FNIS Tool next to Skyrim in the Dashboard menu/tab of Vortex.
• Following the above allows you to enable Integration with FNIS.
• FNIS Integration or Vortex FNIS Integration (what I've been calling it over and over) allows you to update your animations without actually running the FNIS Tool; this is done immediately after post deployment processes.
• Vortex Integration is a quality of life feature provided by Vortex Developers and it works perfectly if you are not using player character exclusive animations.
• If you try to use player character exclusive animations with the FNIS PCEA2 extension enabled and with Vortex FNIS Integration Enabled it will NOT deploy the player character exclusive animations properly.
• This is a problem with Vortex and how it's integration feature handles animation mods that are supported by PCEA2 and I do not know if this extends to PCEA2 itself; Vortex Developers will have to figure that out.
• This bug is a problem for Vortex; and Vortex Developers are responsible for fixing it if they can. Fore is not responsible for this bug and is not responsible for fixing it.
• Fore's Tools/Mods (FNIS/PCEA2) work just fine with player character exclusive animations installed and enabled via Vortex so long as Vortex FNIS Integration (quality of life feature) is Disabled.

Again, the FNIS Tool has roughly 18 million total downloads. There are roughly 800,000 total downloads for PCEA2, take a guess as to how many actually installed the tool/extension/mod through Vortex... I wonder how many of those downloads were repeat downloads. I would not be surprised if I was the only one that has picked up on this Vortex Integration bug... again this bug is Low Priority as it is exclusive to only one Tool Extension/Mod/Whatever you want to call it.

 

Furthermore, I didn't ignore your post... I responded to it appropriately and completely.

If you weren't able to follow my prior response maybe try going back and reading again seeing as you've selectively quoted part of what I responded back to me and do not appear to have processed my response as a whole (hence your apparent misunderstandings).

 

@Vortex Developers:

• I hate to bother you but can any Vortex Developer that has replicated the bug via my provided steps; please take a second when time allows to acknowledge that the bug exists so these two can locate their heads.
• Good luck, I hope you're able to patch the bug easily as I would very much like to use Vortex FNIS Integration since I'm very very lazy and do not want to open the tool if I don't have to when updating animations (player character exclusive animations included; obviously). :thumbsup:

I may appear online at any time in the coming days for a little while but I will not be looking at this topic as I will be very busy until Sunday.

I'm going to sleep as I have a very busy day tomorrow and in the days to come (I've tried to keep this post compact).

Sincerely, H0LL0FIED... :sleep:

Edited March 14, 2019 by DeusX7