Is Vortex worth it?

[HadToRegister]

Obviously just my opinion, but..

What I used to love about NMM was it's simplicity. It was a mod organizer which worked well.

 

What I am starting to intensely dislike about Vortex, is that it is very, very complicated. it's a monster that tries to do too much, and ends up mucking things up.

 

My list of dislikes: (It all relates to Vortex trying to do EVERYTHING).

1. I do not want my mod manager to "inspect" my ESL files for changes, as this creates an issue every time you make changes to a mod in xEdit, or even just drop a mesh replacer directly into the SSE Data file. What Vortex does is find this file, and DELETE it for you. or reverting back to an earlier saved version, making you lose all the changes you made in xEdit. What a pain!

2. LOOT is great for sorting your mods. What is not great is Vortex trying to be LOOT, yet poorly. So it does not allow manual sorting, except with great cumbersome-ness. Making manual rules, and then having Vortex not able to implement these is vexing. And I mean simple stuff, like having one armor file load before another one because you use one to override something from the other one. Unless you change the file type, you get error message after error message.

3. FNIS is great for adding new animations to SSE, but Vortex wants to manage that too, and again, poorly.

4. Vortex leaves empty "phantom" folders when you uninstall a mod, which leaves a cluttered data folder

5. Vortex installs ALL image files (e.g. photos from mod creators), and text files created by mod authors directly into the DATA folder, which gives a very cluttered folder after a while. Not sure if thse files are needed by SSE, or can be deleted at this point.

 

So I miss the good old days of using NMM to load my mods, xEdit to change things the way I like them and clean ITM records, using LOOT to get my load order sorted appropriately, and find ITM records, WITHOUT one of those programs deciding to NEGATE everything done by one of the other programs.

 

EDITED:

My verdict is the Vortex is good for people that download mods, and are happy for Vortex to manage everything. When you make changes of your own (outside Vortex), Vortex creates a layer of technical difficulty that does not need to exist.

 

 

NMM was a Mod Organizer that only Downloaded, Installed and Unzipped Mods, nothing else, which allowed you to make some of the most non-functional load order ever seen, go read the NMM support forums.

 

1. I LOVE that Vortex inspects my edited ESPs, ESPfesa, and ESLs, because then it physically writes them to the disk, meaning it's saving my changes.

I edit and customize nearly every ESP, ESPfe, ESL, ESM in my load order, currently at 299 mods, and I would hate to have all that lost because Vortex didn't save those changes after inspecting them.

I do all my editing now by running Xedit through Vortex, so once I make any changes, Vortex processes and recognizes the changes I've made.

Unless you do something foolish like pick REVERT, then you're good to go.

Also, I don't bother using Xedit to convert my ESPs to ESPfes anymore, because Vortex does it by itself now, it takes just a couple of clicks so no need to even open Xedit anymore for that

 

2. Vortex is not trying to be LOOT, Vortex is using the actual LOOT List, and LOOT Rules, written by the LOOT team, so the claim that Vortex is making mistakes sorting mods, that LOOT doesn't, is preposterous, because they're both using the same exact LOOT list and sorting rules.

If you're running into sorting problems because Vortex is refusing to let you sort something you shouldn't, it's because you're going against the LOOT RULES, and setting that Meta Data in LOOT wouldn't work either.

So in those cases, you're using Vortex incorrectly, yea, "Good Old NMM" would let you sort them incorrectly, because NMM doesn't care, it quietly lets you set up a load order that's doomed from the start.

 

3. All you need to do, is add FNIS to the dashboard, and run it ONCE after you install an animation. You can turn off the "RUN FNIS on every Deploy" as I've found it unnecessary.

I've run FNIS exactly ONCE since I installed Skyrim SE, and have experienced no problems at all. So fart every single complaint about FNIS with Vortex has involved user error, and Fore (FNIS author) himself can attest to that.

 

5. They can be deleted, they're just images and read me txt files

However, if modders would start making a standard of having the images and readmes etc in a folder called readme, then all those files would end up there, and your complain about Vortex doing this is off base, considering that every other mod manager out there will extract them the same was as well, so this isn't a problem exclusive to Vortex, not by a long shot.

 

The only way Vortex will NEGATE anything you've done is if YOU choose REVERT on the screen when it comes to being notified there were file changes.

 

A lot of the issues here (Except for the 'phantom folders") boils down to user error, especially when it comes to sorting the load order, people always try and force Vortex to be NMM, and try to break the sort rules created by LOOT, plus, they don't bother to learn how to use Groups, or Sorting rules properly.

Even the Readme.txts in the data folder could easily be fixed by modders zipping up their mods, with those loose files inside a README folder.

 

If you find yourself constantly making, and using sort rules (I have about 8 to 10 in a load order of 299, although some people have ridiculously claimed they've "had to make HUNDREDS of rules), then you're doing it wrong.

 

I can download and install 200+ mods for skyrim se, install them, and then, using the LOAD BEFORE/LOAD AFTER screen can have them all sorted properly and working in about an hour, with perhaps a little fine tuning aftwerads, but no longer have to waste a day with "Good old NMM" that didn't notify me of a damn thing, so I'd have to load the game, find out the textures are wrong, quit the game, uninstall ALL the textures in NMM, and reinstall them in a different order, repeat ad nauseam.

With Vortex, if I have a texture wrong, I change LOAD BEFORE to LOAD AFTER and Vortex restores the overwritten files and overwrites the new ones.

 

 

 

 

[rmm200]

 

As a casual user, I have about 50 profiles set up spanning all the Bethesda games, Sims 3 and 4, Monster Hunter World, and Witcher 3 among others. Oh - and No Man's Sky and Kerbal Space Program.

At 50 mods per (average), that makes about 2500 mods being managed by Vortex.

It does everything I want in a mod manager. I have no problems to complain about. I like Vortex - a lot. You would actually have to force me to go back to either NMM or MO 2.

adopts codworth voice - i can only imagine the state of your data directory! it triggers my cleaning sensors like you wouldn't believe!

 

 

Lets talk about that. My Data directories contain no mod data - at all. Only Profile Hard Links for the mod set I am using. And if I click Purge in that active Profile - all those Hard Links go Poof. My Data Directory is as squeaky clean as a brand new game install. Try that with NMM or MO 2. I double dare you...

[HadToRegister]

 

 

As a casual user, I have about 50 profiles set up spanning all the Bethesda games, Sims 3 and 4, Monster Hunter World, and Witcher 3 among others. Oh - and No Man's Sky and Kerbal Space Program.

At 50 mods per (average), that makes about 2500 mods being managed by Vortex.

It does everything I want in a mod manager. I have no problems to complain about. I like Vortex - a lot. You would actually have to force me to go back to either NMM or MO 2.

adopts codworth voice - i can only imagine the state of your data directory! it triggers my cleaning sensors like you wouldn't believe!

 

 

Lets talk about that. My Data directories contain no mod data - at all. Only Profile Hard Links for the mod set I am using. And if I click Purge in that active Profile - all those Hard Links go Poof. My Data Directory is as squeaky clean as a brand new game install. Try that with NMM or MO 2. I double dare you...

 

 

 

He understands that, and was making a joke, he used to help out in these forums, if you remember

[Guest deleted34304850]

Pearls to swine!

I was making a joke about the guy who's biggest complaint, as he mentioned it twice was that it made his data directory look "untidy".

I mean come on, if that's your criticism, then you have no criticism to make.

[rmm200]

Pearls to swine!

I was making a joke about the guy who's biggest complaint, as he mentioned it twice was that it made his data directory look "untidy".

I mean come on, if that's your criticism, then you have no criticism to make.

 

I know you, I know you were joking - but I saw a chance to add some extra useful information for people like the OP who don't know it. And what I said is a big deal.

[Rattledagger]

 

My Data Directory is as squeaky clean as a brand new game install. Try that with NMM or MO 2. I double dare you...

 

Since MO never installs anything into the data-directory it will always be "squeaky clean".

 

As for anyone that "need" a clean data-directory, they can get the same in Vortex, if they goes to Vortex Extensions-tab and download "Fully Virtual Deployment". Note, running FNIS and another tool that creates new files isn't currently working, but it's possible to first use hard-link as deployment-method, run FNIS etc., and afterwards switch to USVFS deployment if you "need" clean data-directory. Also note, if you uses USVFS, Vortex can't install mods to the games root directory any longer.

[Rattledagger]

 

1. I do not want my mod manager to "inspect" my ESL files for changes, as this creates an issue every time you make changes to a mod in xEdit, or even just drop a mesh replacer directly into the SSE Data file. What Vortex does is find this file, and DELETE it for you. or reverting back to an earlier saved version, making you lose all the changes you made in xEdit. What a pain!

2. LOOT is great for sorting your mods. What is not great is Vortex trying to be LOOT, yet poorly. So it does not allow manual sorting, except with great cumbersome-ness. Making manual rules, and then having Vortex not able to implement these is vexing. And I mean simple stuff, like having one armor file load before another one because you use one to override something from the other one. Unless you change the file type, you get error message after error message.

3. FNIS is great for adding new animations to SSE, but Vortex wants to manage that too, and again, poorly.

4. Vortex leaves empty "phantom" folders when you uninstall a mod, which leaves a cluttered data folder

5. Vortex installs ALL image files (e.g. photos from mod creators), and text files created by mod authors directly into the DATA folder, which gives a very cluttered folder after a while. Not sure if thse files are needed by SSE, or can be deleted at this point.

 

 

1: If you ever accidentally deletes the wrong file, or make a bad edit, you would see the advantage of Vortex detecting any changes made to data-directory. As long as you don't pick the wrong choice you'll not lose anything you want to keep. BTW, if you're frequently making changes, I would recommend to create a new sub-directory in the "mod staging folder" and put the files here instead. You'll either need to switch to another game and back again or to re-start Vortex to detect the new sub-directory.

 

2: Despite using drag-and-drop for many years to sort my plugins in NMM, MO1 and MO2, after learning to put plugins into different Groups in Vortex I've not really missed drag-and-drop. If you "need" drag-and-drop sorting of plugins, you can use Wrye Bash for this and since Wrye Bash has been popular for many years to create the Bashed patch sorting the plugins at the same time shouldn't be much of a problem.

 

3: If you uses Vortex "integration", it's easy to use different FNIS setups per profile. If you want an example of poor FNIS "integration", try MO2 v2.2.1, where all profiles uses the same output-directory, meaning you'll need to manually change output-directory every time you switches profiles if you want MO2 to have different FNIS output-directory per profile.

 

4: Hit purge and Vortex will remove all these folders for you. Since cleaning-out empty directory will take some time and coupled with it's irrelevant for playing modded game if you have a few extra empty directories present or not, Vortex to speed-up things every time you Deploy is choosing to not delete these extra empty directories.

 

5: Vortex has no way of knowing some of the files in a mod-archive don't need to be installed, unless the mod uses FOMOD or another installer to tell Vortex which of the files should be installed.

 

As an improvement to 1 would be the option "create new mod of the changed files".

[inkleth]

In my opinion no,

 

For the UI alone (I have a litany of other frustrations but this point is my most salient so I'll digress)

 

its too busy, cluttered, dense whatever you want to call it, it's ugly and far less functional than its predeicesor.

 

the old NMM UI may not have impressed anyone at an app developers conference, but it was austere and didn't get in the way of the task at hand by needlessly obfuscating things.

[Deleted55991832User]

Short answer... NOPE, the old NMM is on Github use that.. Vortex is a bleeding mess that screws up your file, give no explanations and assume you have a degree of computer knowledge that only programmers have.. stick to NMM

[AugustaCalidia]

 

Vortex is a bleeding mess that screws up your file, give no explanations and assume you have a degree of computer knowledge that only programmers have.

 

Nuntium simulatum.