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Load Order...again. Other games.


Best Answer HadToRegister , 05 April 2021 - 06:44 PM

Okay, so I've been around a while. Long enough to remember NMM and the switch to Vortex.

I've used NMM, Vortex and MO2 quite extensively, though for years I've used MO2 for Elder Scrolls and Fallout games.

 

When Valheim came out, I updated to Vortex Beta to get the extension for Valheim / BepInEx support.

And now I need to sort my load order for Valheim.

 

//Snipped CV//

 

 

 


Since I don't own Valhiem (I refuse to buy Early Access stuff) in the MODS tab, look in the dependencies column

See those weird icons?

Click on one and drag it to another icon, then a box will pop up asking you in a drop down saying "Must load before" or "Must load after"

Use that.

How do you know you have conflicting mods that Vortex isn't telling you about?

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#1
yermudr

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Okay, so I've been around a while. Long enough to remember NMM and the switch to Vortex.

I've used NMM, Vortex and MO2 quite extensively, though for years I've used MO2 for Elder Scrolls and Fallout games.

 

When Valheim came out, I updated to Vortex Beta to get the extension for Valheim / BepInEx support.

And now I need to sort my load order for Valheim.

 

But even though I am a retired Network Engineer / IT Consultant who's been around long enough to remember when the first GNU/Linux distro came out (Slackware 1.0 1993 kernel version 0.99) and can usually find my way around most any software...

 

I cannot for the life of me figure out how to manually sort load order in Vortex.

 

So naturally, I do some searching and I find that - as near as I can tell without spending all day catching up on all the discussions - the official party line from the Vortex devs is, "Don't need manual load order sorting, LOOT is built-in".

 

Yea? Really? 

Since when does LOOT support Valheim?

 

I also used to play X3 and recently decided to buy X4 from Steam.

I can install mods for X4 using Vortex.

Since when does LOOT support X4?

 

 

Now, my decades of experience in the computer world have made me painfully aware that there is always something I don't know.

So perhaps there is something I'm missing. Perhaps there is an easy way of manually sorting load order and I've just been blind and not seen it. After weeks of looking. Or perhaps there is no need to sort load order for Valheim or X4. (Yea, right.)

 

But...I'm getting mod conflicts with Valhiem and X4, and Vortex doesn't know it.

Vortex did once detect a conflict in Valheim and let me choose which loads before which. 

But most of the time it doesn't detect the conflicts and doesn't offer to let me decide which loads before the other.

And if it doesn't know about the conflict, it doesn't seem to want to let me make rules.

Just tells me, "YOU HAVE NO FILE CONFLICTS, WOW!"

 

Which is patently patronizing, curiously condescending and f'ing stupid.

 

Because I KNOW that there are conflicts.

I can disable mods and re-enable mods and narrow it down and figure out which mods are conflicting.

But I can't DO anything about it.

Vortex won't LET me.

 

I did try reinstalling the conflicting mods - first Mod A before Mod B, then Mob B before Mod A. But it didn't seem to make any difference.

 

As an old experienced troubleshooter (who is now gladly retired and allowing that skillset to rust away) I sure wish I could do some load order testing for Vaheim and X4. Sure would be nice to have some manual load order sorting capability. There is apparently no masterlist file to edit for those games. I'm not about to waste my retirement gametime figuring out that .msgpack file.

 

 

So now I'm hoping that someone will come along and say, "It's easy, just click this and do that and viola!".

That or explain to me why any game not supported by LOOT doesn't need sorting anyway...

 

 

 

 

<reminisce> 

Back in the day...

 

There used to be a job called "Systems Analyst". That job no longer really exists. Oh, it's still around, but the job description always reads the same as "Project Manager". But they aren't the same at all - apples and oranges.

 

Page 1, Paragraph 1 of the Systems Analyst textbook said this, "The job of a Systems Analyst is to find problems with the system, and to devise and implement solutions to the problems."

 

Page 1, Paragraph 2 said, "A problem is defined as any difference between how the users of the system expect the system to function, and how the system actually functions."

</reminisce>

 

 

 

 

 



#2
HadToRegister

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✓  Best Answer

Okay, so I've been around a while. Long enough to remember NMM and the switch to Vortex.

I've used NMM, Vortex and MO2 quite extensively, though for years I've used MO2 for Elder Scrolls and Fallout games.

 

When Valheim came out, I updated to Vortex Beta to get the extension for Valheim / BepInEx support.

And now I need to sort my load order for Valheim.

 

//Snipped CV//

 

 

 


Since I don't own Valhiem (I refuse to buy Early Access stuff) in the MODS tab, look in the dependencies column

See those weird icons?

Click on one and drag it to another icon, then a box will pop up asking you in a drop down saying "Must load before" or "Must load after"

Use that.

How do you know you have conflicting mods that Vortex isn't telling you about?



#3
yermudr

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in the MODS tab, look in the dependencies column

 

 

I assume you mean the mods section? The only mods tab I see is in the settings section, and it says nothing about dependencies.

But in the mods section, the columns are Status, Mod Name, Version, Installation Time, Category, Deploy Order and Actions.

 

So no I don't see those weird icons. :smile:



#4
yermudr

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How do you know you have conflicting mods that Vortex isn't telling you about?

 

Because I can disable/enable mods and make the problems go away and come back.

 

Which is an indescribable PITA on X4, which takes a snapshot of the entire game universe, writes it out as I think XML and then gzips it - on every save - and thus takes forever to load the game, exit the game or save/load gamesaves (like 30 seconds each time it saves/loads.) Troubleshooting mods on X4 is making me want to kill something. Or even better, a whole dev team.



#5
1ae0bfb8

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afaik you simply put mods into the specific folder in valheim and you're done, is that not correct? i dont ever recollect reading that loot is required for valheim.



#6
DoctorKaizeld

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Valheim doesn't have a load order in my experience. It was just plug n play.

#7
HadToRegister

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in the MODS tab, look in the dependencies column

 

 

I assume you mean the mods section? The only mods tab I see is in the settings section, and it says nothing about dependencies.

But in the mods section, the columns are Status, Mod Name, Version, Installation Time, Category, Deploy Order and Actions.

 

So no I don't see those weird icons. :smile:

 

 

 

Click on the gear icon in the top right of the Mods Section and put a check in the DEPENDENCIES box


Vortex-Columns.jpg

 

 

 

The Mods Tab


menu-vortex.jpg



 



#8
yermudr

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afaik you simply put mods into the specific folder in valheim and you're done, is that not correct? i dont ever recollect reading that loot is required for valheim.

 

Vortex isn't required for anything. Anyone can manually mod games.

 

I started out manually installing the mods for Valheim, but since it's a new game the mod devs were going nuts with new mods and constant testing/updating their mods. Seemed like every mod had a new version every day or two. I got tired of manually checking for updates for all the various mods I was trying out. There is a mod called Nexus Update that checks for new Valheim mods - but it requires the mod devs to support it by sticking a section into their .cfg files and not all mod devs do that.

 

So i decided to use Vortex for Valheim just so I could have the automatic update checking. (And of course, it wasn't that simple. I wrote up a little HowTo on what I had to do to switch from manual mod management to letting Vortex do it. I can provide a link if anyone is interested.)

 

 

But to take your first point last, it's not exactly that simple. You put the .dll in the BepinEx/plugins dir and the .cfg in the /config dir. Unless there are other assets (like image files) that need to be in their own subdir. But usually yes, you just extract the .zip file to the BepInEx dir and it's good to go...provided the mod dev packed it correctly in the first place.



#9
HadToRegister

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afaik you simply put mods into the specific folder in valheim and you're done, is that not correct? i dont ever recollect reading that loot is required for valheim.

 

Vortex isn't required for anything. Anyone can manually mod games.

 

I started out manually installing the mods for Valheim, but since it's a new game the mod devs were going nuts with new mods and constant testing/updating their mods. Seemed like every mod had a new version every day or two. I got tired of manually checking for updates for all the various mods I was trying out. There is a mod called Nexus Update that checks for new Valheim mods - but it requires the mod devs to support it by sticking a section into their .cfg files and not all mod devs do that.

 

So i decided to use Vortex for Valheim just so I could have the automatic update checking. (And of course, it wasn't that simple. I wrote up a little HowTo on what I had to do to switch from manual mod management to letting Vortex do it. I can provide a link if anyone is interested.)

 

 

But to take your first point last, it's not exactly that simple. You put the .dll in the BepinEx/plugins dir and the .cfg in the /config dir. Unless there are other assets (like image files) that need to be in their own subdir. But usually yes, you just extract the .zip file to the BepInEx dir and it's good to go...provided the mod dev packed it correctly in the first place.

 

 

 

I play and mod both Outward, and Subnautica, BOTH use Bepinex.

I've never had to arrange my load order, all I need to do is install the mods (85 in Subnautica) and each DLL is injected as it's own entity by Bepinex.

THe only conflicts you can get, that Vortex can't detect that no amount of editing the load order will fix is if one mod's dll affects the same exact code as another mods dll

 



#10
1ae0bfb8

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afaik you simply put mods into the specific folder in valheim and you're done, is that not correct? i dont ever recollect reading that loot is required for valheim.

 

Vortex isn't required for anything. Anyone can manually mod games.

 

I started out manually installing the mods for Valheim, but since it's a new game the mod devs were going nuts with new mods and constant testing/updating their mods. Seemed like every mod had a new version every day or two. I got tired of manually checking for updates for all the various mods I was trying out. There is a mod called Nexus Update that checks for new Valheim mods - but it requires the mod devs to support it by sticking a section into their .cfg files and not all mod devs do that.

 

So i decided to use Vortex for Valheim just so I could have the automatic update checking. (And of course, it wasn't that simple. I wrote up a little HowTo on what I had to do to switch from manual mod management to letting Vortex do it. I can provide a link if anyone is interested.)

 

 

But to take your first point last, it's not exactly that simple. You put the .dll in the BepinEx/plugins dir and the .cfg in the /config dir. Unless there are other assets (like image files) that need to be in their own subdir. But usually yes, you just extract the .zip file to the BepInEx dir and it's good to go...provided the mod dev packed it correctly in the first place.

 

You are aware that Vortex and LOOT are completely different programs that do completely different things, right? Vortex is a mod manager - that will interface with LOOT if the game being managed requires it. If the game being managed doesn't need LOOT - such as Valheim - then it's not in the picture.

 

When Valheim came out, I updated to Vortex Beta to get the extension for Valheim / BepInEx support.

And now I need to sort my load order for Valheim.

 

I cannot for the life of me figure out how to manually sort load order in Vortex.

 

You don't need to sort your load order for Valheim. The game is modded by plonking stuff in a directory and that's it. There is no sorting required?






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