Games Crashes when using bashed patch?

[Gwyn21]

I think it's a particular mod I am not supposed to merge, and as a result it crashes on the main menu screen.

 

It actually works fine when I remove the bashed patch entirely. Albeit, with a crash to desktop every two hours or so through a play-through.

 

The mods that it merges are the following. Anyone at a glance notices which one it is, and which one I should exempt from merging into the bash patch?

 

[HeyYou]

Make sure your load order is correct, then rebuild the patch.

[Gwyn21]

Make sure your load order is correct, then rebuild the patch.

Did that already. Did nothing. I really think it's one of the mods but I am not sure which one I should exempt. I suppose I could do trial and error but that would take a long time.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Gwyn21

[Gwyn21]

Despite the large order I have it has been working fine. Is it alright if I avoid using a bashed patch if things seem relatively stable already? I was only making one for some extra stability.

[dubiousintent]

It appears you are misunderstanding the role of the "Bashed Patch".

 

If you have more than one mod that makes any change to the same record or set of records in the vanilla game, then you really need to use a "Merge Patch File" with that collection of mods. Please see the 'Third Rule: The Rule of One' and 'Merge Patch File' sections of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article. When in doubt, create a "Merge Patch" file for your overall "load order" anyway. If you add, remove, or change the sequence of plugins in your "load order", don't forget to rebuild the "merge patch" file again.

* "Merge[d] Patch" is a more generic term than "Bashed Patch", which is only produced by the Wrye Bash/Flash program. A Wrye "Bashed Patch" and a xEdit "Merged Patch" are generated from the entire "load order" list of plugins to resolve all "record level conflicts". They are roughly equivalent but use different algorithms. You can use the combination of both a "Bashed Patch" and a "Merged Patch" file (technically an "override" patch as described here), for different complimentary reasons. (What I say regarding "Wrye Bash (WB)" also applies to "Wrye Flash (WF)". "xEdit" is the generic name for "FNVEdit" which is the game specific implementation of that tool.)

While both WB and xEdit are creating essentially the same thing, the big difference is that WB automates the "record level conflict" resolution in load order sequence producing a "merged patch" file named explicitly "Bashed Patch, 0.esp". This works fine for most such conflicts where you want the last loading plugin to "win" conflicts, but to also include non-conflicting records of earlier plugins to get around "The Rule of One". The xEdit process does similar but doesn't dictate the resulting file name and lends itself to deciding those exceptions where you want an earlier loading record to "win" the conflict instead. By running WB first, and then creating an xEdit "override" patch with just the different winners (hence the difference from a "merged patch" of the entire "load order"), you are reducing the number of manual changes needed. This becomes important if you tend to modify your load order with updates to plugins frequently, as you should rebuild your "merged patch(s)" whenever you do so.

You may find the "photo gallery" tutorial Editing records in FNVEdit using ''creature alteration'' for the example to be helpful with the basic process.

Note that xEdit can "automate" the creation process in a similar manner to WB, but it doesn't (last I knew but things are constantly evolving) make use of "Bash Tags". WB also has built-in "tweaks" to game settings that it incorporates into the patch, as well as merging of "leveled lists". You can also use xEdit to give "unique" results that none of the plugins provide (in effect creating a "new patch plugin" result within the overall patch.)

There are more possibilities. Please see the wiki "Merged Plugin Guidelines for Personal Use" article for details.

 

Having laid out that background, I see two files that appear to be variations of the same: "44SLfix1/2". Make sure both are required.

 

* Move any "inactive/disabled" plugins out of the game "Data" folder. They count against the "plugin cap"(see Smaller Plugin Cap) because they get loaded by the game engine if found, and can cause "Missing Master" problems. Please see the wiki "Missing Masters" article if you get that error message.

 

If those plugins without the "mod index" numbers are "deactivated" by the "Bash Patch", then you failed to have them "ghosted" by "Wrye Bash/Flash" when you built your "Bashed Patch". Please see the wiki "Bashed Patch file with Marked Mergeables" article.

* Don't install every optional file for a mod. Read the install instructions carefully. Optional files need to be selected on a "case by case" basis. For example: with any mod you usually only need one ESP (and possibly one ESM) "base" file depending upon whether you have all the DLCs active or not. Only if you don't have them all active do you need to install any specific DLC versions if there is an "Ultimate Edition/All/Merged DLC" version.

* "Compatibility patches" to make one mod work with another need to be placed after (as in "physically lower, higher numbered") in the "load order" than ALL of the plugins they are designed to make compatible. (This also applies to "fix" files.) ESMs should always be placed at the top (lowest numbered) positions in the "load order", followed by the related ESPs though they can be separated from their ESMs by other plugins. LOOT does a good job of determining those basic orders, but it is a "crutch". (The "Tale of Two Wastelands" site has A Guide for NOT using LOOT for those interested in learning how to manually manage their "load order" for themselves.) Getting the "load order" incorrect will cause "Missing Masters" errors as well. You can make minor adjustments to the order and tell LOOT how to remember them. It's in the on-line documentation under "Metadata".

FYI: The "pre-order packs" (aka "POPs": Caravan, Classic, Mercenary, and Tribal; available now in the "Courier's Stash" addon), are not considered "true DLC expansions" by most mods and are treated as "compatibility patches" to the base game because they just add certain unique items. So their absence should not deter you from using "All DLC Merged" plugins. Where they are included, they should come after "GunrunnersArsenal.ESM" which is a true DLC expansion. When in doubt, follow the process in the wiki "Missing Masters" article to confirm they are not "master files" for that plugin.

* Don't install compatibility patches for mods you do not have installed/active (e.g. get rid of any "TTW" patches if you aren't running TTW). The reverse also holds true: don't install mods that are not compatible with, or specific to TTW or FNC,etc., if you are playing with them.

-Dubious-

[Gwyn21]

It appears you are misunderstanding the role of the "Bashed Patch".

 

If you have more than one mod that makes any change to the same record or set of records in the vanilla game, then you really need to use a "Merge Patch File" with that collection of mods. Please see the 'Third Rule: The Rule of One' and 'Merge Patch File' sections of the wiki "FNV General Mod Use Advice" article. When in doubt, create a "Merge Patch" file for your overall "load order" anyway. If you add, remove, or change the sequence of plugins in your "load order", don't forget to rebuild the "merge patch" file again.

 

* "Merge[d] Patch" is a more generic term than "Bashed Patch", which is only produced by the Wrye Bash/Flash program. A Wrye "Bashed Patch" and a xEdit "Merged Patch" are generated from the entire "load order" list of plugins to resolve all "record level conflicts". They are roughly equivalent but use different algorithms. You can use the combination of both a "Bashed Patch" and a "Merged Patch" file (technically an "override" patch as described here), for different complimentary reasons. (What I say regarding "Wrye Bash (WB)" also applies to "Wrye Flash (WF)". "xEdit" is the generic name for "FNVEdit" which is the game specific implementation of that tool.)

 

While both WB and xEdit are creating essentially the same thing, the big difference is that WB automates the "record level conflict" resolution in load order sequence producing a "merged patch" file named explicitly "Bashed Patch, 0.esp". This works fine for most such conflicts where you want the last loading plugin to "win" conflicts, but to also include non-conflicting records of earlier plugins to get around "The Rule of One". The xEdit process does similar but doesn't dictate the resulting file name and lends itself to deciding those exceptions where you want an earlier loading record to "win" the conflict instead. By running WB first, and then creating an xEdit "override" patch with just the different winners (hence the difference from a "merged patch" of the entire "load order"), you are reducing the number of manual changes needed. This becomes important if you tend to modify your load order with updates to plugins frequently, as you should rebuild your "merged patch(s)" whenever you do so.

 

You may find the "photo gallery" tutorial Editing records in FNVEdit using ''creature alteration'' for the example to be helpful with the basic process.

 

Note that xEdit can "automate" the creation process in a similar manner to WB, but it doesn't (last I knew but things are constantly evolving) make use of "Bash Tags". WB also has built-in "tweaks" to game settings that it incorporates into the patch, as well as merging of "leveled lists". You can also use xEdit to give "unique" results that none of the plugins provide (in effect creating a "new patch plugin" result within the overall patch.)

 

There are more possibilities. Please see the wiki "Merged Plugin Guidelines for Personal Use" article for details.

 

Having laid out that background, I see two files that appear to be variations of the same: "44SLfix1/2". Make sure both are required.

 

* Move any "inactive/disabled" plugins out of the game "Data" folder. They count against the "plugin cap"(see Smaller Plugin Cap) because they get loaded by the game engine if found, and can cause "Missing Master" problems. Please see the wiki "Missing Masters" article if you get that error message.

 

If those plugins without the "mod index" numbers are "deactivated" by the "Bash Patch", then you failed to have them "ghosted" by "Wrye Bash/Flash" when you built your "Bashed Patch". Please see the wiki "Bashed Patch file with Marked Mergeables" article.

 

* Don't install every optional file for a mod. Read the install instructions carefully. Optional files need to be selected on a "case by case" basis. For example: with any mod you usually only need one ESP (and possibly one ESM) "base" file depending upon whether you have all the DLCs active or not. Only if you don't have them all active do you need to install any specific DLC versions if there is an "Ultimate Edition/All/Merged DLC" version.

 

* "Compatibility patches" to make one mod work with another need to be placed after (as in "physically lower, higher numbered") in the "load order" than ALL of the plugins they are designed to make compatible. (This also applies to "fix" files.) ESMs should always be placed at the top (lowest numbered) positions in the "load order", followed by the related ESPs though they can be separated from their ESMs by other plugins. LOOT does a good job of determining those basic orders, but it is a "crutch". (The "Tale of Two Wastelands" site has A Guide for NOT using LOOT for those interested in learning how to manually manage their "load order" for themselves.) Getting the "load order" incorrect will cause "Missing Masters" errors as well. You can make minor adjustments to the order and tell LOOT how to remember them. It's in the on-line documentation under "Metadata".

 

FYI: The "pre-order packs" (aka "POPs": Caravan, Classic, Mercenary, and Tribal; available now in the "Courier's Stash" addon), are not considered "true DLC expansions" by most mods and are treated as "compatibility patches" to the base game because they just add certain unique items. So their absence should not deter you from using "All DLC Merged" plugins. Where they are included, they should come after "GunrunnersArsenal.ESM" which is a true DLC expansion. When in doubt, follow the process in the wiki "Missing Masters" article to confirm they are not "master files" for that plugin.

 

* Don't install compatibility patches for mods you do not have installed/active (e.g. get rid of any "TTW" patches if you aren't running TTW). The reverse also holds true: don't install mods that are not compatible with, or specific to TTW or FNC,etc., if you are playing with them.

 

-Dubious-

It seems that I am just really bad at making merged and bashed patches.

 

Well, I removed a couple heavy mods and rearranged some things. It seems to be working fine without it, and now I can even make it past the two hour mark. Despite having like 400 mods and 255 plugins (I'm aware that's a lot but it's been pretty smooth sailing despite that), and all the files have been cleaned and ordered properly. I'm afraid I might screw it up if I try to change it again by attempting another bashed patch via Wrye Bash.

 

All the mods seems to be working fine now that I tested them in the game, and I don't notice any weird texture glitches. So, all the texture mods are working as described.

[dubiousintent]

Red flag: "all the files have been cleaned". That is really not recommended for this game. First, it will definitely cause problems if you clean the main game and DLC files. Second, only the mod author should clean their own files, as they are the ones who know if that ITM is really required or not. Most are well aware of such issues these days. Only if you cannot contact the mod author of an old mod should you attempt it yourself, being aware that "success" may still leave things broken. Be sure to keep backups.

 

-Dubious-

[Gwyn21]

Figured out what the problem was. The Death Claw Hunter Fix was already applied by another mod, and when I merged it that's what caused the immediate crashes from the title screen.