Pops53
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I've had time to calm down.
I agree with Chesko in what he said about Nexus. I believe that the Nexus is a business. I like that I can find free mods here, but I realize now that it is Dark0ne's business. I understand how he could rationalize accepting funds from Valve to help his business. Playing ads and having subscribers help his business. It realize that it may not have started that way in the beginning, but that's the way it is now. You don't take trips to Spain without money.
People that don't understand this are in for a disappointment.
I also realize that modding isn't going to be what it was in the past. Modding was birthed in the passion for creation, and I remember feeling that passion when I discovered mods. But...people are right...things change. Modding is also going to become an occupation, just like Contracting is an occupation. People will do it for money to improve their lives. There's going to be two types of mod environments now - one environment based on the passion for modding and the accolades and admiration (and perhaps donations) that come with that; the other environment will be based on business and personal gain.
I cant honestly say which one is actually better, or which one will be the future right now. If I had to make an educated guess tho, I would say that modding as a means of improving one's life is going to edge out modding for passion. These are just the times we live in. People need money to live, and modding will become another way to get it.
I applaud the Nexus for being a place where I could learn without cost about modding and try out passionate modders' work. I applaud all of the modders who develop these things because of their love for gaming. But I also understand that this won't always be the case.
What I am most concerned about is the disappearance of places like the Nexus and ModDB, and the disappearance of the passion and fun of modding, based on corporate profits and politics. I am an old man and I have seen it all; believe me when I tell you that these corporate entities want you you to pay....forever.
I appeal to all of you who mod and use mods to pull together here and keep that modding passion alive.
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In response to post #24608229. #24608459, #24608944, #24609039, #24609259, #24609439, #24609544, #24609824, #24609959, #24609974, #24610559, #24610884, #24610914, #24612029, #24612584, #24613009, #24613049 are all replies on the same post.Silver is Silver: you knew beforehand and you participated instead of telling Valve to push off... so you'll get what you've earned.WightMage wrote:Rifleman556 wrote: The lack of people understanding this is astounding.Dark0ne wrote: Thanks for continuing to link it to people who are reading Chesko's good bye Reddit post without seeing my response. My feelings are that writing a full blown news post on the topic would make things worse, not better, at this time. I'll do it if it's really necessary, but I think for now, my responses in that Reddit thread have helped to clarify the situation.
I'm thankful to the couple of mod authors out of the current ones on the paywall site who have selected the Nexus as a Service Provider, and I promise/pledge to them that the money raised will be going towards paying for a new forum server setup. It definitely won't cover it, not by a long shot, but it's a nice little boost to that kitty fund. So thank you to them.
Obviously Chesko wanted to lose some flak by trying to point a finger at me. That's fine, he's had a rough time. But it was hardly helpful.anonownsyou wrote: It's not hypocritical, it's just an opportunity for mod authors using the workshop to remember who their friends are, and make Valve give a little something back to those friends out of their own cut. It's very likely that if it weren't for the Nexus, those authors would not be in a position to sell their content in the first place (everyone deserves a pat on the back and some beef jerky for their work). It's really just a small courtesy to the Nexus, and if it helps even just a little bit to keep the Nexus healthy and free, then all the better. So long as it doesn't come with any kind of 'kiss our ass, love Valve' condition, then it's not blood money.Kentsui wrote:
Still, it should have been brought up in one of the articles only for the sake of transparency.Draugas wrote: Exactly anonownsyou. You put it better than I did.
I also want to thank Dark0ne for everything. Keep your chin and the hard work up.BenevolentTyrant wrote: The fact that its chump change is what makes it hurt more in my opinion. If it doesn't affect the bottom line it should've been an easy choice to turn down.mALX1 wrote: It isn't hypocritical at all, and it is smart business because no one can change the Valve-Bethesda tide rolling; and if they don't keep a foot in the door we could lose Nexus.
Nexus has been a home and haven for modders as long as I can remember. They have helped us all without advertisement; and bandwidth for this place has to be hugely expensive.
Their premium membership here is the most reasonable on the web; I was more than glad to help this site in any way I could.
I would never consider asking money for a mod I made, but if I did, would much rather the cut go to Nexus than Valve.
Just my two cents.
** Edit:
AnonOwnsYou said it better than I could.
phantompally76 wrote: I don't view it so much as hypocrisy, but rather that while you were decrying Valve's actions publicly with one hand, you had come to an understanding with them in the other to receive revenue from them, and failed to disclose that information to your own already apprehensive and outraged community of revenue generators.
Actually, having read that sentence back a few times to myself....that bloody well IS hypocrisy.
At any rate, it's your website, and it's not my place to tell you or anyone else how to conduct your affairs.
All I know is that since this bombshell dropped yesterday, I haven't downloaded any mods or logged into Skyrim at all, and I have no inclination to do so at the moment. I hope that wears off, but right now I feel like abandoning the game and the mods entirely.
I liked modding a lot better when it was a hobby rather than a business.Dark0ne wrote:The fact that its chump change is what makes it hurt more in my opinion. If it doesn't affect the bottom line it should've been an easy choice to turn down.
Obviously I had no idea what sort of money I'd be getting from it. If it was a small amount, it could go towards a server kitty. If it was a large amount, I dreamed of hiring on more programmers for NMM. Irrespective, every little helps, and I didn't want to turn down what was, and still is, a kind gesture both from Valve and the mod authors who choose the Nexus as a service provider just because some people misguidedly might think I was being two faced.
I went in to it from the get go that this was a donation to supporting the Nexus, and this in no way endebted me to supporting or advocating the use of Steam Workshop. I've been offered a hell of a lot more money over the years than what this could even potentially bring in if it took off massively, and I haven't done it yet. So for people to doubt my intentions now. Meh. Don't know me at all. Or at least, people don't read the many blog posts I've written about this very topic in the past.Arthmoor wrote: @Dark0ne:
I'd have set Nexus as a service provider for the one mod I have in the pay system now but I had a question about it that Valve didn't get around to answering until after the listing was approved. Authors can't change the payment distributions AT ALL once the listing is approved for sale.hangman04 wrote: Dark0ne, don't worry this is just the heat of moment. After 1-2 months everyone will be complaint. Worse things have happened in the gaming industry ( pay to win in mmorpgs, even the dlc system) and people were lashing and swore they would never do this or that, and by the rage one would say that the companies will go bankrupt etc etc. But the truth is that almost every "unethical" change became eventually the norm, and this (mod authors getting payed) is by far the fairest addition. It's just a matter of time. You will probably loose the people who started swearing on the forum and you had to ban them :)).Dark0ne wrote: Thanks Arthmoor, and no worries.
I saw that you weren't best pleased that I didn't make the service provider information public from the get-go on your forums. I can see your point, and I can understand the knee-jerk negative reaction coming from the way Chesko pointed at me in his Reddit thread. Obviously, if I'd been more open about it from the start then I could have managed the community response more easily.
But in the same vein, this just seemed a no brainer to me. It was sold to me on the premise of letting mod authors who are fans of the Nexus and want to support the Nexus giving a little back to the Nexus through this system, and it most definitely wasn't offered as a token of "hey, we'll offer you this if you're nice to us!". Obviously people don't know that, but the service provider blurb on the sites is pretty clear, and many people have mistaken my open talking of poor implementation of Steam's paywall system as me some how championing free modding EVERYWHERE, which most certainly hasn't been my intention. I just begrudge how badly it's been handled, rather than the over-arcing concept.
When Chesko made the Reddit thread it was already late here in the UK, and I've taken the decision to leave it a night. If it blows up or seems to be a big issue, I'll clarify the Service Provider stuff more. If it doesn't, I'll leave it be.zerolovesyuki wrote: It seems Dark0ne has already made up his mind, but I personally would like a move away from this. Saying you want modding to remain open and free is all well and good, but accepting funding from Steam's paywall service IS a direct conflict of interest.
If you can justify it to yourself that's fine, but i'm extremely dissapointed that you are supporting this, no matter how indirectly.anonownsyou wrote: You should read all the posts where it's been clearly pointed out that the only thing Dark0ne wants to remain open and free is the Nexus; there's no conflict of interest because Dark0ne openly admits to being behind modders getting something out of it, so long as the Nexus itself remains free and open.
You folks keep putting words in his mouth with this insistence that he's some sort of champion for free mods all the time everywhere, but that's simply not the case, and that's the same as stating that Dark0ne thinks modders don't deserve to be paid for their time and effort. The opposite has been repeatedly (seriously, repeatedly, there is an extensive record of this) and openly stated for some time.
Besides, there's a little poetic justice in Valve paying just a little bit towards keeping the Nexus free.Reaper0021 wrote: Robin...not that you'll see this...but take it from someone that's been around for 44 ROUGH years: RELAX!!! You've done so damn much for all of us. You've cancelled your "Spain" trip cause of this, and those of us that can comprehend what we read know/knew what this was all about. People are just in a damn hype cause of all this new 'change' headed their way, and you know how most people feel about any change at all. I'm with you 100% and Chesko....he is/was just lashing out and you were the recipient of that. Scapegoat maybe? Not sure. I support YOU Robin.WightMage wrote: Long live the Dark 0ne, he who protects the most holy Nexus, birth-mother of all that has been imagined and yet to be imagined! Long live the Robin, arch priest of the Dark 0ne, who doth maintain the Nexus with his most holy blood, sweat, and occasional cup of coffee!
Glory to the Dark 0ne, who even drowned in temptation sticks to his holy guns... of freedom for all to choose what they want out of their modding experience, whether it be paid, OR free!
So sayeth the Book of Scott.
Pops -
In response to post #24615234. #24615334, #24618949, #24619709 are all replies on the same post.I won't be moving forward and buying ANYTHING. I'll put Skyrim down for the long cold sleep before I do it. Millions for defense, not ONE penny for tribute!phantompally76 wrote:freedom613 wrote: Kudos for ya! (You didn't upset me by the way...)phantompally76 wrote: Sigh.
No sooner had I logged out that I got half a dozen text messages letting me know "SKYUI IS GOING PAYWALL ERMAGERD!!!!" effectively forcing every single one of us to buy into this horsecrap moving forward.
Unbelievable. Absolutely unbelievable.Arendella wrote: Excuse me as I vomit GG SkyUI GG
Pops -
Well, as Dark0ne says, the first shots have been fired over paid mods over in the Steam Skyrim Workshop. It hasn't been pretty. As a Skyrim mod user, I am disappointed that it has happened so quickly, but I guess it was inevitable. I hope, as this goes forward, that everyone stays civil and debates the issue and not the people, because it is the people who have made the mods and changed Skyrim for the better.
Pops
Steam and Bethesda remove paid modding from Skyrim Workshop
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