angelmendez003

Yeah I know what you mean, GUIs vs the command prompt. I'm more of a GUI person but if its cluttered with so many menus and buttons then its the same as a cmd in which if you don't know the commands then you can't navigate either way. Besides that, I'm going to see if I can correct my dialogue for the realtor. I'm going to try it this time using your method and seeing if it will fall into place. After that I can move on to the interesting part of changing the interior of the store based on which kind of shop you decide to open up.

awesome thanks :D I took a look at the mod and I see you don't use the dialogue view, I see everything done in the player dialogue section, you don't like to use the dialogue view or is it easier to use the player one? Sometimes when I'm looking for an NPC's dialogue in the dialogue view I see it completely empty.

yeahhhh it worked lol, I had to install the SKSE and it worked like a charm :D its pretty funny to see random people get up to the stall and buy things from me. This is really cool, I can see this mod coming around for sure. Can this system work in an interior cell? I have no idea how to make NPCs travel to a location? Thanks I appreciate this a lot, I'm definitely going to take a look at what you did and apply it to the shop I have set up, I'm going to see how you pars actors with different aliases and how you structure your dialogues to fire in order. Once we have the stall done and the general goods shop complete then I can try to apply this to the other professions like blacksmithing and etc.

So you made the tenants more realistic with their own routines and their allowed to do things for you, that's pretty cool to have, especially if you can have them fetch for items and such. I had a similar idea but it was for the guilds. When you complete a guild storyline you usually become the guild leader of that faction for example the dark brotherhood. I wanted to make the initiates be able to complete missions for you and fetch for items and such. now thats cool, so you want to make some sort of editor system that runs on real time, I like that idea, I'm sure people will create homes on the fly wherever they want, its hard to work with the CK but having something like that just for building things would be way easier for the players to do. I tried the mod you sent me, everything seems to work fine but for some reason I don't get any customers to force greet me, my character is a vampire and my speechcraft skill is at 20. is it because I'm a vampire or my speechcraft is too low, what is the average time they come to you?

wow all of this is really great news indeed :D I like the fact that people are able to come up to you and you can hire them but I would still like the option to find an assistant as well in case the player has a preference. At least now the player doesn't need to go hunting for employees is they don't want too. For the book thing is there a way that we can record transactions within the store for example, expesnes, income, maybe we can have the customer's name, what they bought, how many and how much gold as well as date and time. I'm not sure if that's possible but do you have any idea how that can be done? As for the item amount being bought, maybe we can have a percent of the amount of items the customer wants, for example lets say the customer wants to buy 3 apples, maybe based on the speechcraft skill we can make a percent increase from that amount so lets say our speechcraft is lvl 20 so the percent increase from those 3 apples would be 1% out of the 20 apples in stock so it will be like, 3 apples + 1% out of 20 apples = maybe 5 apples as an example. For the prices of items i was hoping to use some haggling in which the customer will choose a starting price based on the actual price value of the item. The player can then try to haggle the prices up and have multiple choices so for example lets say a customer wants to buy 5 arrows and in total they cost 50 gold so thats 10 gold each. The player can have mutiple choices in what they can choose. So lets say you have choices like 60, 70, 80, 90. The higher the price the more speechcraft level will require. and based on what the player chooses and their speechcraft skill a percentage will be made on the chance that they will be successful. If the player chooses the wrong price then they will either make little money or make a customer angry and lose reputation on them so they will be disliked. It will be more interactive for the player and they will have to go with their gut feeling in trying to make the most profit without messing up on the deal. Yeah we can have that difference between manufacturing and selling supplies. When you manufacturer something theres less items able to produce and the price for the goods is increased because of the materials used for them so their harder to sell and they sell less frequent while things like what you said on food and supplies their the easiest because their abundant so their least expensive but easier to sell. all of this sounds awesome and I'm really glad everything is coming together, right now instead of having a shop assistant already at the shop that I made outside of whiterun I'm making that NPC as like a realtor for the jarl. You talk to the NPC and she will allow you to open the shop as either a merchant, blacksmith, alchemy shop and maybe inn. Once you decide and buy the shop she will leave the area. I really like your idea for hiring assistants so I will keep that idea and allow the player to either search for an assistant or a random person will go into the shop looking to be hired. I must say that I'm having a hard time structuring the dialogue view, I have 2 branches, the first one is a greeting to the player and telling them that the jarl is selling the establishment. Then that links to a new branch where the player is able to decide on the choices of store they wish to open. The problem is that both of them show up at the same time while I want the greeting one to go first and then the second branch with all the choices appear. I even made conditions that check which stage the player is in and still doesn't work properly. Have any idea what I'm doing wrong? I'll most likely have to look this up when I have the time. All in all I am amazed at how fast you work and I never thought this mod would come together, Thanks, I know I say it all but I just have too lol. :) btw, you said your mod was my house your house, what do you do in that mod exacly?

lol thats a great idea, no need in creating lifeless assistants when you can choose who to hire yourself. You can talk to the NPCs and based on their original personalities you can decide on whether to hire them or not that's awesome right there. :) How does the inventory work, do you have like a chest container that you put all of your items in or do you have to give it to the merchant? and thats good to know, so based on what the merchant sells you can only sell that type of item, how do you pull something like that off? the only way I can think of for implementing the speech skill system would be using a lot of conditions within the quest itself like get skill level (speechcraft) >= 20 or something like that. I'm sure you would need to write some script for better results. I know how code is structured but my main problem right now is learning the language of papryatus, I have no real mental references of functions and classes that I can use to write the scripts. ahh yeah, the interesting job order function, how much time do you think a player should have and how many orders at a time a player can take from each customer? or do you think it is up to the player to decide on how many orders to take? lol It's been fun having you help me out and teaching me how to use CK, I bet if I never would have decided to post into the forums I would of ended up just making simple spells and not focus on making quests or extensive mods, life would of been boring in skyrim :D I must admit this mod started of as a real pain for me but now I see it as something that could really be fun to work in and be fun to actually play. A lot of mods are cool at first but they get boring after a while but I'm sure this one would be a game changer and I've noticed that a lot of people are requesting a mod like this in the forums. what mod are you working on btw?

Alright I understand what your saying, everything runs smoothly as what its supposed to for the merchants when you are not around. when you tell them to take a break they will go into their next phase of schedual which could be to go to the inn or go home and do other things. Based on what time you leave the stall is whether they will return to the stall or not so your not changing anything at all for the merchant's ai system. I built a store outside of white run near some of the farms, its heading towards the watch tower where you face the first dragon in the main quest. I created the inner cell and it got me thinking that I can leave the outside as is and duplicate multiple interior cells for a general goods store, blacksmith shop, alchemy shop and even an inn. I can then use location aliases that will change the outside door's teleport location so based on what the player chooses to have it will point to the appropriate cell and as for the doors inside the cell all I have to do is point it to the same outside door and it will be good to go. I'm thinking of leaving a for sale sign outside of the store so the player can just purchase the store and choose what they want to create without having to do anything for the jarl. An assistant will be waiting for the player inside and based on what the player chooses multiple dialogue aliases will be used as well for the furnishes since each store will have it's own unique upgrades. lol yeah I thought about having a portable stand as well but it would really kill the whole experience of deciding in where you want to open the store and seeing which city would be best to open up in.

lol thats some pretty good gold and to think that even thieves and muggers are willing to pay for your stuff instead of stealing it. :D that should be fixed so they will attack you instead. "stand and deliver!!!!!". I understand, without the dialogue from the merchant you can't do their quests as well so I guess that works, I just dont want the player to run by accident near the stall and then they open their shop. well unfortunately I just came to a realization that most houses that players can buy already have some crafting tables inside.... another idea crushed... well actually what we can do is probably create an outpost or something outside of town and then we can have travelers from all over the world come in the shop. I'm thinking of creating a building outside of whiterun near the other buildings so it will be nice and huge with more space that the breezehouse and that actually looks like a shop. Maybe we can make it that you can expand the shop and make it larger if they have different versions of the same kind of shop. I'll take a look into that. Other than that the results will still remain, you buy the accessories like the crafting table and such and they will appear in the house. ooooo Navmesh..... sounds scary, maybe there is no need in that, I mean I see why the developers didn't do that in the HF DLC so that can be a pass for now. right now i just want to allow players to upgrade their shop and thats all. I am going to finish the assistant quest to see the upgrading mechanics first and then I'll work on a new outpost for the player to purchase.

ok so your the new owner of the stall while the previous merchant is your new assistant, well if you think about it, after hours like 8pm when shops usually close there aren't much people outside either way so it doesn't make sense to keep the shop open but if you still want to have it that way then it doesn't really matter to me. I like the idea and i'm sure it will work. maybe instead of talking to the merchant directly you can use the triggerobject to say something like, "take over the store" or " I'm leaving or something" and the merchant if present will say something out loud like "ok ill be back later" or something like that without directly talking to the player but out loud like most NPCs do when you get near them. right now I'm testing the upgrading process in the breeze home at whiterun, I got the dialogues ready and the house assistant made I just need to research on how to enable and disable objects and it should work. I am also going to research to see if you can move furniture around in the house like in oblivion cuz that will allow customization for the player.

lol wow that is pretty cool, I have never ever seen that in all of skyrim before lol, thats really cool I like it, so maybe we can make it that the stalls are rent-able and when your done with it the original merchants return to what they are doing and when you want to rent them again you can speak to the owner again. I never thought about having empty stalls, that would of been a bad idea having them empty and I do know that there is a woman there that is approached by imperials in a scene so if she was gone for good then that quest might have been broken. This also allows us to keep the quests available to the player and not break them, dam your really good at this!! All of this is possible with aliases correct? wow their more useful then I thought they were. :)

lol its all good I understand, ever since I graduated from high school I only have like 3 friends and no one really understands video games so yeah I'm kind of the same. I still go out and party like regular people but since no one that I know personally are into video games its like playing basketball by yourself all the time. Awesome I thought you were doing the mod for me so I was scared that you would do everything and I wouldn't get the chance to learn it. All of this is overwhelming but from past modding tools and games I understand most of what your saying. I have to admit that out of all of the modding tools this one is the most complex one. I'm sure by looking at what you have done so far I should be able to understand how you did it but for now this is what I picture how it works. So as a test you just have the NPCs give you gold and approach you. To my understanding an alias is like a variable or class that you can use to have pre-set functions that whatever it is tied to like an NPC, the NPC will follow that function of the alias correct? So how you used it is that you have a condition and if the object follows that condition it is placed within the alias so it can do the function. For example, like what you stated, as long as the NPC that is near the player is not a creature it will follow the alias that requires the NPC to force greet the player. By force greeting the player you allow the NPCs to walk to the player. lol I thought I would have to use like a travel script in order for that to work. My only question is........ what if the player buys a shop? the player will be in doors, how would that script function work if the player will not be near NPCs to trigger the force greet script? As for the triggerbox method, I think thats awesome, you pretty much made a timer that checks to see if the quest is still running correct? if the player leaves his position then it automatically stops, is it because the player is in like a scene mode where he cant move like for example chopping wood ect? I'm not too sure about this method I might have to take a look at this to understand it. I really do like the triggerbox idea you have to start with the quest, maybe we can do the same and place it in the player's house with the merchant's book on top of it. I see that I'm getting closer and closer to understanding this CK, I am really good using game maker, warcraft 3 world editor and such but like I said this CK is something I have no relation with so if i can master this modding tool then I think I can do anything lol :D After doing a few mods and getting tired of skyrim I'm thinking of moving more into the 3D world and try out unity. I've never made a game before but I know a lot of how games are coded and made for 2D games but I've never stepped up for the 3D world, its going to be a bumpy ride but I'm sure I'll get it eventually. :) I'm going to keep playing the game and write down the quests that I find useful for this mode to dissect them later in the CK. I'm going to buy the house in whiterun and see what I can actually do in a regular house and not a homestead. Can you move furniture around in skyrim? I know oblivion allowed you to do that or is everything fixed? I'm dying to see how you made your basic dialogue system so I can go from there and see what I can come up with. I do know that once I get this merchant quest down packed I'll be doing other professions as well. I'll release the merchant part when its done and then update it with the rest afterwards, its getting the first one done that takes the longest but once its done the rest should be easier to do since its almost the same thing. Thanks again

Yeah you are absolutely right on that, after a few hours of playing HF I became a thane and converted my assistant to a housecorl, instead of me spending time on building the house manually I tell her to do the modifications for me so it got me thinking that the building system is very similar to the dark brotherhood system. I suspect that it is a simple enable/disable function on objects and when you purchase an upgrade the objects are enabled so that's simple to do I hope. So what your saying about the quest alias is that you can leave it blank and then assign objects to it through code? I didn't know that was possible, it makes things much easier to code that way :D we can use location aliases as what you mentioned and put the actors into that alias so they know where to go and allow the quest to stay at that location, amazing!!!! just amazing!!!! lol :D Wow that is great news so you figured out how its done, maybe we can use the stall as like a beginner stall that is cheaper for the players. it is not a requirement to start there first but it allows the player to earn money to then buy a more stabled establishment. I was looking around whiterun since it seems like everyone loves to do their mods there lol and I noticed a house that is abandoned that I'm sure the player can buy from the jarl, was this the place that you recommended me to do the quest at in the first place? I was thinking of making a new building but I see there is no room at all to place the shop within the city so that abandoned house is our only option. I have to say this is some cool stuff we are working on, to have people walk up to you so you can sell items is really cool and rare in games. The only game that I know that has this system was harvest moon a wonderful life for the gamecube. Well you have the most impotant aspects done which is to make the NPCs come up to you and have a dialogue system running. Now that is left to do is somehow make the NPCs look at your inventory and choose randomly on an item they wish to buy. How often do people come up to you to start the conversation and do you think we can use the speechcraft skill level to make a percentage chance of people coming up to you? if not then I don't think there will be a problem in leaving that out, it works for the most part and thats just what we need. :D lol btw speaking of refusing to make a deal, we can make persuasive topics so we can use our speechcraft skills to try and convince them to buy in our prices like in some dialogue cases, that would be a great edition as well. I see that you have done a lot of work with the mod and have practically most of the necessities done, I wish to help too you know lol :D is there anything you need me to do or try out? I can probably make a test on how to upgrade the shop and see how it works with an npc. If we get this done do we need to do it again on the main mod file or do we just create another one from scratch or what do we do? how do 2 people work on the same mod? I have a skype if your interested in an instant message than using the forum that is like 3 pages now, my name is Angel Mendez. like always thanks for helping me,

hey sloppy sorry for the long delay, I was thinking about what you said earlier with all of the questions you have presented to me, it was hard for me to imagine how all of that could be achieved in my skill level. My initial thought after purchasing the shop was to make the shop keeper stick around at a bar or something so people could still do their quests but that seems to be harder when you have to manipulate the ai packages like what you said. As for the other parts of your questions it will be answered throughout my explanation. I didn't think you would have gone through the trouble to fix my mod, I'm sorry if it was a pain and extensive work but I think with the dialogue system you have made we can use it for something I have been strongly considering. For the past few days like I mentioned before I was thinking of using the hearthfire mod so players can build and develop their shop/house and build the mod upon on that. I think this way we can focus more on the quest aspect than the actual mechanics since we will be taking advantage over a system that has already been made which is the house building system. For the past few days I've been playing around with the hearthfire plugin and done some research about it. People had some mixed views about it, some say that yeah it made a lot of items and the professions such as wood cutting, mining ect more useful but it didn't really have much customization into it. after playing around a bit with hearthfire and building my own homestead it did seem a little bit too limited and after your done with everything there's not much to do. I'm still not done with the DLC but I do know that I can somehow hire assistants, bards, a carriage and so forth. I think at this point we can have some interesting additions into this DLC that can spice things up and make the homestead enjoyable. This is where you come in. I did like your ideas of making grinding quests that will allow the player to gather materials so they can go back to their shop and resupply the shop assistant with items to sell for the shop while your away, I also did like the implications on getting requests from people by a courier system so you can supply with their needs. I think this would do great with the homestead, we can have a courier give the player a request letter and a due date and the player can either give it to them personally or give it to the carriage for transport. With the quest design you have made for the dialogue system we can do the same thing, since there is a time frame in which you have to fulfill an order, having a loop system that only runs when you have completed an order would be great because I wouldn't want the players to have multiple requests going on and not finishing them on time. I think it would be best to have a limit whether its 3 jobs or just 1, that will depend on what quests we make and how much supplies/items is needed to produce. As for the overall mechanics, in the beginning i was thinking about making the player the official shopkeeper. I wasn't a fan of having an assistant take care of the shop while your away gathering the items because it would be the same as any other quests you find all over skyrim right? I was hoping to make it that the player stays at the shop and does the actual selling of items as the customers come in and talk to the player. But I think now with your idea of having assistants in a homestead it would be great and it gives the player the opportunity to go and and do regular quests and gathering materials for their shops at the same time so its funner that way. But I would still like to have that option somehow take direct control over the shop and let the customers come to player, depends on how things goes from here maybe there's still a chance for that. I noticed in the hearthfire DLC that they have some materials that you can mine and gather from close to the homestead so perhaps we can hire some helping hands to gather materials for us at a daily price or something, after mining for a few minutes it does get tedious and boring lol :D as for the other things, it seems like in the wiki pages it mentions that bandits and all sorts of interlopers attack your homestead so that covers the other aspects that I wanted in the first place :D I've noticed that almost everything that I wanted to implement in my mod has already been made and I think we should take advantage over this because there is no point in reinventing the wheel. I hope you don't take this the wrong way or anything like that, its pretty much the same mod but moved over to the hearthfire DLC system. I appreciate your help with the dialogue system you've made and I'm surely going to implement it as a base for the quest system. What am I going to do now? well the best way to learn more about something is to play around with it, so I'll be taking another day to play with the DLC and seeing how you can get assistants into the homestead and see how I can start my quest up, I know there is a way to set up a quest to allow the courier to give you a message here is a video link of how this guy did it. I actually followed the tutorial and got it to work for a simple test mod I was doing to learn how the questing system worked in the CK but it seems I still got a long way to learn everything lol. https://youtu.be/iustaHoHnEE The only problem is that I'm not sure a courier will go to the player's homestead since he seems to only approach the player in towns. We might have to make our own courier or something to go directly to the homestead. As always thanks for everything and lmk if your interested in anything you would like to do for the mod, I know your like an expert on this and if you see something that might need improving or you just want to do let me know. When I do start working on the mod my first step would be to do the quest startup and then from there see how I can structure it using your method. I'm also going to run the mod file that you sent to me again so I can see it in action. Cheers,

ahhh I've tried putting the quest into the story manager like instructed but still nothing showed up. I even took the trouble in starting a new game file and still no luck. Can you send me the file back because for some reason it doesn't work for me. This is what i did: I created a new branch and added the quest node into it. I made the sm branch have the condition of the getinfaction. I tried to set it to run as a subject and as a target but nothing happens either way. I ran the game with the conditions on for the dialogue views but nothing, then i deleted all of the conditions in the quest and left only the SM with the condition but all failed. This quest is designed that you will be able to "buy" a stand or store building of any NPC that's in the JobMerchantFaction. So for example, in whiterun outside you see merchants selling their items in stands, you can "buy" their stand, or go into a shop and "buy" the shop. Now the reason why I say "buy" with quotation marks is because your not really buying the shop, all your doing is giving gold to the NPC and switching all the NPC's owned items and cells so it can become yours. I'm not sure if there is going to be any conflict with the NPC's actual house and ownership but what I know is that most of them live in their shops either way. As for what you have mentioned about the book in my quest, The book applies to all shops no matter where you buy your shop, the only thing I really need to do is create a container check script so that if the player has the book already then there is no need to give the player another one. I was thinking of placing a quest marker for each player owned cell so the player can see the exact location of all the shops they currently owned. Besides that I understand its going to take a lot of conditioning and tweaking to get the transitions of the stage correct. My main concern is figuring out how to allow NPCs to go into the shop and ask the player for a random item that they have in their current inventory, since this is a general merchant shop there is no specific items you need to sell or produce for the customer. If I can get this done then I'll do the same for the other professions like blacksmithing which will require job orders and it must be done at a specific time frame. When you mentioned about your alchemy shop idea it got me to wonder that if all of this does not work then I can try to make this mod easier by making a simple spell or something that can activate the quest I'm making but to allow the user to build his own shop with the hearthfire plugin. I think this approach would be 10x easier and will allow the player to customize the shop and actually grow it. Lol I might actually do this instead of all of this trouble, what do you think I should do? We can make this mod as a team because im sure its going to take a lot of work and a lot of things that I have no idea on how to do. The only thing im really good at right now is to use the quest manager and a few easy scripts and conditions. :D

well I generated the file with the steam method but the file shows that its 0 ks so I'm assuming it was a failure. Now its weird because the quest was working fine but now is when it doesn't work. It could be something that i did by mistake so I would like your opinion on that, if everything seems fine then I will try the command prompt method. Yeah the mod is very small and I think I only used one script fragment which is just for the adding and removing of gold and a book I created. You can find this book at the AAA delete when done Jeremy room which is like the first interior room I think. The book's id is PMStoreManualMerchant quest's id is PMProfessionMod Here is the zip file and I really do appreciate you helping me out, if there was a recommendation button or like button I would totally click it. :smile: