mdingman

FYI to those who think that the Legion doesn't do anything for the wasteland, just talk to Dale Barton in the fort, examine the Legion ending, etc. before making bold claims with no evidence to back them up.

If you think WWII didn't have a good side, you obviously know nothing about history. SHOCKW4VE, an independent vegas can't defend itself by itself. Without yes man/house, there is no robot army. There is already enough division between people in new vegas. They all won't assimilate under one banner. The BoS will fight anyone, the Families won't join together, etc. New Vegas has no resources. Any recources they would obtain after the 2nd battle of Hoover Dam would be off of the bodies of dead soldiers. As for the people of NCR and the Legion coming to new vegas, why would they do that? Just because they get kicked out of the Mojave doesn't mean their faction is dead. Far from it, both the NCR and the Legion would probably return. They would retreat to their homelands and regroup. New Vegas is in it's homeland already. Honestly, if you think that the PEOPLE of New Vegas could survive a combined Legion/NCR onslaught along with the in-fighting that's sure to occur? They don't have the robot army(which couldn't survive in that situation anyways). @Marharth, we are taking the player out of the equation. Things like Kimball's assassination, the Boomers getting their B-29, Caesar's cancer would've been cured, etc. because the faction/person had plans to accomplish their goals in those instances. The NCR would be in a horrible state due to the player not being present to help them, etc.

Ok, but what about afterwards? How can Yes-Man control the Mojave, take out or assimilate the minor factions, stand up to the Legion/NCR return that is sure to come, etc. Also, you might want to try the Legion ending so you can compare all of them before passing judgement.

What you said about how democracy is better is true, I'm just saying that NCR democracy is such a massive bureacracy and so corrupt that it cannot function effectively. Also, didn't a couple of the NCR's presidents rule for something like 70 years? That sounds like a monarchy to me. It's about as legitimate as the "Republic of Dave".(remember them?) I'm saying that the Followers themselves are helpless little babies. But if the Khans form an empire wwith the Followers' help, that sounds like the Khans have been taking lessons from Caesar and have assimilated or at least are using the Followers for their own gain. And, in that case, it would be the Khans taking over New Vegas(they're a monarchy as well), which is plausible for the takeover, but I don't think they would really last in the long run. The Followers have no teeth, they have no military, so somebody else would have to act for them. Also, your take on the United States REPUBLIC is incorrect. It is in fact the lower-middle and working(I hate that term by the way) classes that have far too much power. How else do you think a socialist president was elected? Why do you think that the liberals cater to illegal immigrants(emphasis on illegal)? Why do you think that the poor support Universal Healthcare, which, if you look at it, is doomed to push the country's debt beyond the point of no return? "Men are nearly always willing to believe what they wish."-Julius Caesar. Obama tells the poor that he's going to give them MORE free stuff, and it's not going to cost them anything. He tells them he's going to tax the rich to death,(who, according to the liberals, are inherently evil because it's not possible to become rich without exploiting the poor, defenseless, proletariat), and it's going to solve all their problems. He tells them this, and he gets elected.(and look where it's gotten us. great job liberals! Note the sarcasm). Why should we cater to the rich? The top 2% pay 95% of the taxes, paying for all the poor's medicare and food stamps while they sit at home and do nothing and live off of honest taxpayers.(not all poor people, just 44,981,890 of them as of 7:44 this morning.) The rich are the ones that start companies and create jobs. By taxing them, you destroy the economy. I could go on and on about this, but it's geting off topic. Bottom line, an autocratic government with a strong leader is the best government, the problem has always been with succession. The way Caesar raises his successors, however, ensures that his goals and his leadership carries on after his death. Nobody can tell what will happen after this, but at least for the near to medium future, the Legion will stay strong leadership-wise. And, is a democracy/republic any better succession-wise? You just need to show the masses a bright-and-shiny object and they will follow you, like Obama did. A democracy/republic can be just as worse off succession wise, especially a democracy like NCR, which doesn't have term limits.

@Frakle Exactly. Thank you for proving my point. What I've been trying to say this whole time is that the followers are not the best faction because they can't control the mojave, they're completely defenseless, and i would argue that they shouldn't even be considered a "faction" in the usual sense of the word. A faction can't be the best unless they have some sort of structure, longevity, etc. The Followers are basically a charity organization. I know that's overly simplistic but that's the root of it.

Is's possible that the BoS from FO3 could become a major power seeing as how they are more open to outsiders, but it would be a long time before they cross the whole country. Yes, the Legion is uptight, but you need to be uptight to have a strong society which is necessary for the empire caesar is building.

exactly.

Ok, marharth, this is like the 5th time i've had to tell you this, but the Followers don't have the manpower, the weapons, the desire, or the resolve needed to even pose a threat to any of the major factions. The Brotherhood, on the other hand, actually there is no other hand with them. The Brotherhood and the Followers are fundamentally the same, the only difference is that the Brotherhood can put up somewhat of a fight, and the Brotherhood keeps all their tech for themselves while the Followers use it to help people. Even in an alliance, they wouldn't have the manpower to take over even if they wanted to, which the Brotherhood doesn't. They are an introverted society that cares little for the problems of the outsiders. eLucifer, the NCR is such a corrupt and backwards society(how corrupt and backwards it is myself and others have outlined in previous posts so I won't get into the details), that it can't function well in California, let alone the Mojave. Everyone you talk to about NCR(non-affiliated people that is), tells you that being under their jurisdiction is being a slave in all but name, just talk to the old guy in Primm(forgot his name) after the NCR takes control. By the way, yes, the Roman Empire did fall, all Empires fall, from the Sumerians to the present, every single empire in the history of the world has fallen once it stagnated and stopped conquering(or got it's a** kicked). Point is, every empire will fall unless(Like the British empire) it removes itself from being an empire and thus saves itself from collapse. But befor Rome fell, it was the greatest civilization the world had ever seen before(and some say since), and it has undoubtedly influenced Western society more than any other civilization in the history of the world. Theoretically, if an Empire keeps conquering, maintains it's military power, continually has a purpose, and can ensure a succession of good leaders, it will never fall. The Legion has all of these aspects so far, and Caesar has no intention of letting the Legion stagnate after his death. I know you are going to bring up Lanius, but I've addressed that point about 15 times(maybe more), so read the earlier posts. Finally, the Legion assimilates people in such a way that they lose all of their previous cultural identity and therfore identify completely with the Legion after a few generations. Just look at how many tribes(80-something I think) are now completely Legionized in one man's lifetime! And he's not dead yet! Now I just want to outline something because of what marharth said Obviously the best faction would be whichever the Courier chooses to side with, so we are removing him from the equation. Pretty much you pick a faction to gain control and then argue for the faction of your choice's viability. Obviously, some things will have to be addressed then, like the boomers wouldn't have their B-24(or B-29 i can't remember) because they would've stayed in Nellis, Caesar however, wouldn't have died from his brain tumor because he knew where to get the parts for the auto-doc and he could've just had the Legion descend on Vault 30-something(can't remember, in case you can't tell I haven't played FoNV for a while), Kimball would've been assassinated because if the player wasn't there the assassins would've succeeded(the sniper especially), and there are other instances that could just be logically figured out, just figure out what would've happened if the player didn't get involved. One final note, I'm not going to be posting for a while(I've got a busy summer), so your Legion-bashing will have to go unanswered for a while unless someone else defends them.

The Enclave was small to start with, consisting of the rich and powerful in the USA's government. They obviously increased in number over the years,but after the events of fallout 3(and the preceding games), they no longer have a president or a commander. They may have replaced them, but the replacements would be inept most likely seeing as how they would send all of their best men to take the Capitol Wasteland. However, audio logs from E-D-E reveal that there is an outpost in Chicago.(however, the recording also reveals that a researcher at ADAMS AIR FORCE BASE was sending E-D-E to the NAVARRO OUTPOST. It doesn't bode well for the Enclave that the people at Adams Air Force Base were unaware of their MAIN OUTPOST'S destruction for 40 YEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!). The Chicago outpost's Enclave members, however, have probably gone the way of the Mojave remnants, living in isolation or joining other factions.

I've already said that the sexism is the thing that I am most opposed to in the Legion(I said that in the last paragraph of post 55). I really don't see a point except for forced reproduction(which I find appalling by the way). Just because I sympathize with the Legion overall doesn't mean I support everything they do, it just means that I think that the pros outweigh the cons, especially when compared to other factions. I'm fine with the brutality, and I understand the slavery, but I don't agree with the sexism. So not ALL Legion apologists support that.

@FishFiend: The whole point of treating people like the Legion does is to erase their identity and their culture. Doing this gives them nothing to rally behind. And, as you can see, the slaves wouldn't have much of a chance in a revolt seeing as how they are all limping around with huge packs on their backs. The slave revolt(if there is one), won't be like the Pitt. The Legion slaves don't have auto-axes. The Legionnaries would put them down and would certainly never join them. That concept in itself is rediculous due to their loyalty(which is made clear by the fact that they have plenty of opprotunities to revolt, desert, or sabotage the Legion but they don't). As for Mr. House, he is not going to last. Even if he is able to drive the Legion and NCR out, they will return, and he will be sandwiched between forces totalling in the MILLIONS, against his mere thousands. And, last time I checked, Securitrons can't snipe. NCR has snipers, Legion has snipers(i'm using the Caesar's Legion Overhaul mod which I highly recommend as it makes things more balanced in terms of combat and overall presence.). That is how house would be defeated. the Legion and/or NCR will fight a war of attrition, which they will undoubtedly win. Even if House withdraws all of his forces to the Strip itself, he could be killed easily if somebody brinds along a howitzer and blows up the Lucky 38.(the Legion has a howitzer, although I never saw the NCR with one). In addition, what about the Boomers? They could annihilate the Strip entirely! Finally, the Legion could just charge in with Melee Weapons, keeping the Securitrons(upgaded I presume) from using their missile launchers due to friendly fire(which they can't have seeing as how they are terribly outnumbered). House isn't a "brilliant tactician". He's a schemer, yes, but he hasn't been tested in combat itself. Also, the securitrons are NOT replaceable. There is no Securitron factory, the Securitron vault is just that, a storage facility. And as for him being a "very logical person," Otto von Bismarck was a logical person, as was Admiral Yamamoto, Napoleon Bonaparte, General Cornwallis, and many others throughout history. They were military geniuses and very "logical" thinkers, yet that didn't forestall their demise. House, also, does not have the whole region rigged to his favor. The people who are supposed to be his allies, the families of the Strip, are plotting against him! That's how the Courier got shot in the head in case you don't remember. House is alone. House has no allies. House has many enemies. House is outnumbered. House is outgunned. House is vulnerable. House has no chance. Sorry about the double-post I didn't notice until after I posted

Nero(and Caligula) are exactly why I said MOSTLY good emperors. On the whole, Rome had great rulers: Augustus Caesar, who was arguably the greatest leader in all of history, Trajan, Hadrian, Marcus Aurelius, Constantine the Great, just to name a few Imperial rulers, and even before the Empire, they had leaders and generals like Cincinnatus, Julius Caesar, Scipio Africanus, and others. After a guy named Commodus(who was assassinated by his wrestling coach) came along, that's when the cycle of in-fighting, poor leadership, assassination, and stagnation began(briefly halted by some good emporers such as Constantine). So, yes, eventually the Roman Empire did fall, but while it stood it was the pinnacle of human existence. They were extremely advances and even had semi-automatic weapons(not with gunpowder obviously, but they had ballistas that held multiple bolts at once) They had technology that matches what we have today, and much of modern engineering is based off of what they accomplished. They even had Greek Fire, a weapon that we haven't even discovered how to make!(napalm is close but it's not quite the same thing). Now I know that the Romans had flaws, but we can learn a lot from them. We could solve the problem of Illegal Immigration if we implemented what they did. (If you need verification look up the Auxilia). As for those books, a quick summary would be appreciated as I have finals coming up. Personally, I agree with the belief that the government should not infringe on your rights in any way(that's why I hate the EPA, gun control, socialism, communism, and all other oppressive ideologies, laws, and organizations). I am extremely right-wing. However, drugs(AKA Chems), are the one exception in that I think that the government should intervene. I know that some consider it an infringement on their rights, but the results of drug use(especially if it was legal), are too damaging to both people and society to go unchallenged.

I'm back, sorry about the wait my life got pretty usy for a while. Thanks to all of you who responded with intelligent arguments. To all those who use fallacies or make arguments that have been previously addressed, or no argument at all(post 52), just leave. There have been so many responses since I left that I can't read them all so I'm going to just go off of the last few @ Thedragonemperor Thank you, that was my goal from the beginning, to create a topic where people could debate the merits of different factions intelligently. @ Neariox, i'm just going to ignore you. You obviously tweaked the game because what you said you did is impossible. Then you said "good or evil", are you kidding me!!! @Lt. Albrecht, i agree that our first impressions color the NCR as "good" and the Legion as "evil". But, the NCR's greatest evils are utter failure, massacre of civilians at Bitter Springs, subjugation and opression of their people, corruption, a terrible economy, and being about as inefficient as possible. I agree that Lanius is bad, and as far as the dog-trainer goes, hes crazy. But, people like Caesar and Lucius redeem them, and I might add, are much better than the cowardly, indecisive, and outright stupid bureaucrats like kimball, who one person(i can't remember who) said that they "don't know which end is his ass and which end is his head" As I have said before, the Legion rejects tech(for now) because they don't have access to much of it. Caesar knows that if they rely too much on tech when there's not enough of it to go around, the Legion will crumble. The Legion, once they gain access to the tech in the Mojave(more so if they take over California because of the Gun Runner factories), they will undoubtedly learn to replicate and implement it in their society. And, thermic lances are melee weapons, and are far more simplistic to maintatin and create than robots or other advanced tech. As for the distribution of weapons, every citizen of the Legion has one!!! We don't know if the people who are part of the Legion but not in the army have weapons because the game doesn't give us any insight into Legion lands(more unfair portrayal of the Legion). Which Roman Empire are you referring to in your last paragraph? The greatest civilization of all time thats people were actually treated well(compared to other civilizations of the time), and with no power struggle between the elite for hundreds of years due to (mostly) strong leadership, or are you talking about the post-3rd(or 4th i can't remember) century Roman Empire that was all that you describe it as because of long periods of peace and stagnation? I think the Legion is best simply because there is no better or more viable option. Sources in the game say that Legion lands have no raiders or bandits of any kind. How well has the NCR done with that? Now, I'm not saying that I agree with everything the Legion does. The sexism is what I least agree with. The slavery and brutality are not the most delicate methods to win a war and assimilate a people, but they're damned effective. I agree with their banning of chems though, and I don't know why (some)people don't agree with this. Chems only cause problems(THE FIENDS), in the game as they do in real life.

Personally, I liked the Legion ending. they rooted out the powder gangers and fiends, and everyone is generally happy. They really aren't that brutal in conquest(caesar extends his invitation to join the Legion to everyone who's worth it). The only reason the events in Nipton transpired the way they did was because the people there tried to screw over the Legion(not to mention the people there were the scum of the earth anyways), and they were trying to destroy NCR morale. To paraphrase Sun Tzu, if you aren't prepared to do what is necessary in war, then don't go to war. The Legion is prepared to do what is necessary, and in Nipton they did exactly that. Additionally, the Legion is rich, just look at the exchange rates from Denarii to caps vs. NCR money to caps. Legion money is worth 400% in caps, while NCR money is worth 40% in caps. And, if you talk to enough people, Legion lands are the safest around, and the Legion would take out all of the raiders and defend against all outside threats. Another reason they would be better is because they don't allow chems, which cause tons of problems. I never really liked NCR because they were just one huge bureaucracy, not to mention they're inefficient, poor, and corrupt. I never liked house because he is kind of sketchy, like someone you could act like your best friend and then stab you in your sleep. Furthermore, he's too vulnerable and reliant on others. As for yes man, he's even more sketchy than house, especially when, at the end, he says that he's going to change his programming to make him more "assertive" anyone else smell betrayal? One final thing that i didn't like about the 2 robot army endings is that, well, they use robots. In a post-apocalyptic wasteland, technology will break down, and there aren't any factories to make more securitrons(the vault is just a storage facility), so there just isn't any longevity in those endings.

ROFL i actually heard somewhere that the burned man was a possible follower in Van Buren, but I don't know how someone could possibly survive what he went through. Why would you want him as a follower anyways? i don't even know why Caesar made him legate, his tactics were horrible, he sucks at warfare! By the way i want to make an amendment to my perfect ending: Instead of having you kill the BoS, Caesar forcibly assimilates them into the Legion and uses their knowledge of tech to rebuild the Mojave and create factories so that the Legion doesn't have to abstain from using tech due to not having enough parts for repairing weapons(I know that you could say that repairing works fine for the character, especially with the jury rigging perk, but when you're talking about repairing/producing weapons for the entire Legion, you can't just use what you have scavenged/looted).

definately, other endings would be cool as well, i was just putting my personal favorite out there. I don't know if the Legion would support your RCR concept, interesting though it may be. the way I see it, best case scenario, the RCR ends up like the Khans and gets assimilated, worst case scenario, they end up like the Fiends. Your RCR concept still is much more plausible than people pulling for the Followers, though. I mean, COME ON!!!! The Followers couldn't control anything if they wanted to! They're a bunch of doctors sitting in Freeside who suck at fighting so they hire a bunch of mercs who also suck at fighting.(I know, i wiped them all out with mysterious magnum, 1 shot kill for everyone there, i took almost no damage, i lost 3 points of health, and i was wearing dapper gambler suit/hat with authority glasses). Even if they joined w/ the BoS, they would have nowhere near the manpower to do ANYTHING!!! The brotherhood couldn't hold Helios One, they certainly can't hold the Mojave!!! as funny it would be to see Kimball get guillotined, i don't think he's comin back from how i killed him. I basically put a pile of mini nukes on the stage(using a stealth boy of course), and then I went into the tower, killed the ranger, and sniped the mini nukes. The explosion killed everyone in the crowd(except for the frumentarius, he wasn't even scathed) and Kimball went flying OFF THE EDGE OF HOOVER DAM!!!! (on a side note, his head was still on the stage, which i found a little strange, and his leg ended up next to the Vertibird)

I don't think the Boomers CAN throw their weight around, they can harass people temporarily but they don't have nearly enough manpower or supply to actually take, let alone hold, anything. I do agree with the whole bottleneck thing though, but the concept is sort of trashed as the Legion attacks throught the intake pipes.(on a side note, why didn't the NCR shoot down the B-25 with their AA gun? And if you haven't noticed, the B-25 did nothing at all, there are still NCR in the places it bombed, it looked cool though and it was completely unexpected, at least for me.) However, I don't think the oil is important at all, since there isn't any left. That's the whole reason for the nuclear war, the US and China were fighting over what oil was left. However, i do agree that the Legion should flank, but i think it should come from the south, via cottonwood cove, seeing as how they already have a beachead established there. and as for the people accepting Legion society, if you talk to Caesar he already has plans to change the Legion to be more like the Romans in society, but this is to happen after he takes New Vegas. And, actually, most people end up being fine with the Legion's current society anyways(especially the Khans), as the narrator states in the endgame. I don't think that the Brotherhood can really do anything either, they just don't have the manpower. Even if they got support, if they tried to take over the core of the Brotherhood would split off, like the Brotherhood Outcasts in F3. And, with the exception of the East Coast Brotherhood, the locals don't like the brotherhood anyways. They're also too reliant on technology. Caesar shuns tech(at least for now) because he recognizes that if he uses tech too much, that tech will eventually fail, and there isn't enough tech to replace it. So, he leads a low-tech(but very effective) faction until he regains the ability to create and fix tech in an efficient manner. As you said, before the push east or west a lot would need to be done, but i think that the next game should be once the push has started, when the winning faction has secured their gains and mobilized for invasion, and the losing Faction has scrapped together what defenses they could.(I think the Legion would put up a much better defense). Unless you chose the house/ lone-wolf ending, then you/house secures the Mojave and prepares for an assualt, while Legion and NCR regroup and prepare for an invasion. I think that the player should come in as the s**t hits the fan, get put right in the thick of it, and make a decision. By the way, i think that the new character should have some previous loyalties, instead of coming out of nowhere with no past and basically becoming a mercenary.(for example, the player is born into the Legion and joins the army, but is wounded and maybe the BoS takes him in, and then both sides want him to fight for them, and he has to pick between the two. I know that's a horrible example that should never be used in a game but it's the best I could come up with off of the top of my head.) Having Caesar name you his successor was my intention in the first place. Basically, i would like to see the next game go like this: The Legion ending happened, and Caesar named you(the new character, not the courier, probably someone already in the Legion) his successor. Lanius assassinates Caesar in an attempt to take over the Legion right as the Legion invades California to finish off what's left of NCR. The Legion is split between the Preatorians/Centurions and all the higher-ups/officers who are loyal to the ideals of the Legion, and the normal soldiers who are loyal to whoever is running the Legion(which Lanius claims he is).The main quest would then proceed to have the player choose between: 1. taking over the Legion, crushing Lanius' faction and NCR, and turning the Legion into the Roman society that Caesar intended it to be 2. Siding with Lanius, becoming HIS successor(with the option to assassinate him and take over his faction), and turning the Legion into the vicious slaver nation that most people(incorrectly) think that it is. 3. Side with the Brotherhood(as their home is in California), and have them get rid of everyone else(this would be the hardest path since the brotherhood is outmanned, outgunned, and the player would have to find A LOT of outside help to give them a chance at success.) I didn't include an ending for NCR seeing as how they probably couldn't recover from losing so many men in the Mojave, and they are so tied down with economic and corruption problems that they wouldn't stand a chance.(they actually resemble World War I Germany as it neared defeat) -Inflation is killing their currency -They don't have the caps to pay for their soldiers(188 Trading Post Arms Dealer) -They would have horrible morale(it's bad enough in FoNV, but after Kimball is assassinated, their army is destroyed, and the Legion pushes into California itself morale would be worse) -California is being depopulated, and the NCR soldiers are increasingly young and very poorly trained -The government itself is corrupt(they give the land to rich brahmin barons while farmers have to scrape by on subsistence agriculture) (one of the people @ NCR Sharecropper farms)

My personal favorite is the Legion ending. I would really want a sequel that had you at the reigns of the legion kicking the NCR's ass(I never liked the NCR, they seemed like the typical inefficient, corrupt, and weak democracy)

ok, we're getting kinda off topic i kind of started that sorry, i just hate it when people bash the Legion when they haven't even done a Legion playthrough and know absolutely nothing about them, and @Gashjackel, if you like Mr. house, that's your preference, i just always found him kinda sketchy and easy to kill, also too reliant on others

I completely agree with post # 11. Even if the Brotherhood wanted to change and become more like what the East Coast brotherhood is, i'm not sure that they have the manpower or resources to even accomplish anything significant. They're too drained from their various wars, and the West Coast Brotherhood is surrounded by NCR, which has a less-than-cordial relationship with the BoS, and probably wouldn't appreciate the "help". As for the game ending/sequel plot discussion, It would be better if bethesda took the approach seen in the "Mass Effect" series when it comes to endings and how they affect sequels, where the events in the latter game are dependent on the actions of the imported character from the former game. To put this in FoNV terms(strictly going by main quest terms, going through all of the side quests would take far too long and probably bore you all to death), if your player sides with the Legion, in the next game that involves this area of the US(because it wouldn't work if the next game were back in the capital wasteland or elsewhere), Caesar gets rid of Lanius(an obvious move since he is the greatest threat to Legion stability), and replaces him with your character as the new Legate. The main quest will then proceed to have you invade California to invade NCR. However, if your character decided to side with NCR in FoNV, the next game has you leading NCR into Colorado and Arizona to take out the Legion(although any plan to chase the Legion through that terrain would probably end up in the NCR being successful, but at a very high cost because the Legion are so good at ambushes) for one final example, if you side with house or take the lone wolf approach, the next game finds you defending New Vegas from the NCR and/or Legion who have returned. How you completed side quests in the previous game would shift around allegiances(for example, if you had the brotherhood side with ncr, the brotherhood would support you when you went after the legion), or if you had the Khans support the Legion(or rather, left them alone because they already support the Legion), then the Legion would have greater numbers when they invade. Both of these approaches have the player in a position of strength because i would like to see the player be someone with power who has to decide how to use it instead of being a nobody-turned-superman who changes the fate of everything by being there. Anyways, that's my hope for the future, because that way, all of the future games will be exactly tailored to each individual player(of course with different characters along the way) through their choices and each game can be different for everyone.

You can get into lucky 38 if you get past the securitrons that are guarding it. And, really, he could have just liedd when he said he had no intention to kill you. When everyone else is gone, you are the greatest threat, and house isn't about to have his plan spoiled.

i never really liked house. He just seemed kinda sketchy, like once he controlled everything, he would have victor kill you in your sleep. Also, he was just too easy to kill. the securitrons really never had that much HP(1 shot from mysterious magnum kills them on hard difficulty), and all it really takes to kill House is someone with a stealthboy. you don't even need a weapon. I mean, who leaves the computer that can end his life UNGUARDED? YOU DON"T EVEN HAVE TO HACK INTO IT!!! he's too arogant, he thinks nobody can beat him when in reality it's all too easy

ok, seriously? the brotherhood has nowhere near the manpower to take over. As the battle of Helios 1 showed us, the brotherhood cannot hold against superior numbers. i would want an ending where you basically stick to the alliances from the beginning (i.e. Legion+Khans+Fiends+Omertas+White Gloves+Boomers) and side with the legion while they kick everyone else's asses. after the legion assimilates every1 else and the game ends, Caesar has you replace lanius then a DLC or a whole new game has you leading the Legion into California to finish off NCR and @ Dasim4, the "old" refers to the Roman Empire, which, if you know anything about history whatsoever, was the most successful and greatest empire ever, and we owe most of western society to it. The Romans had an excellent quality of life, but before they became great they had to sieze control of the surrounding area. That meant destroying the Gauls, the Samnites, the Greeks, and the Carthaginians. Caesar is doing the same thing, destroying his competition so that he can found a society free from the threat of invasion, in so doing ensuring it's success.(by the way he tells you about this, he tells you what he's going to do, you just have to talk to him) on a side note, FoNV itself does not acurrately portray the Legion, because as post #31 told us, we haven't seen any of them, we've just seen their military camp. Also, for those who doubt the longevity of the Legion, for now it's dedicated to a man, but Caesar is smart. He knows he's not going to be around forever, and thus will try, once NCR is finished off, to dedicate them to the idea of the Legion, the emulation of the Roman Empire. And FYI, the roman empire didn't go to h-ll after 150 years as was previously posted here, it went to h-ll around the 4th century that's several hundred years And if you know anything about Roman history, the emporers were fine(there were a few wackos like Nero, but they were overall decent), right up until Marcus Aurelius died, and then the Praetorian became corrupt, it wasn't the emporers being bad for the most part, it was that they got assassinated before they could do anything. This stopped during Constantine's reign and a string of successful emporers followed, but then Diocletian(a complete moron) decided to split the empire into east and west to make it easier to manage. The problem was that the economy was in the east, so the west went bankrupt and then the barbarians walked in and took over. Additionally, there are contengencies that can be taken to ensure that a ruler isn't insane or an idiot, like the tests that the ancient Chinese made their aspiring government officials take. The Romans didn't do that though, they went by lineage, not by merit. That doesn't mean that Caesar won't do something different. He knows how the romans fell, and he's smart. Anyways, how is the NCR different? they say that they're a democracy, but whatever the president says, goes, and their presidents are basically rulers for life(not really, but they ususally rule for decades), they're just elected. They can go crazy or be stupid, they just have to win the election.

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I'd like to see you prove a faction that is better, but take i t to the other topic. And I got the model of the bomber wrong. sorry. don't get so worked up, just chill out.