ah that I didn't do. HA I just tried and the launcher crashed. So i used the oblivion exe to start, then closed and went into launcher again, it detected video hardware, then i loaded with obse shortcut and game crashes when i load a save. I think I'm stuck with my current ini. I remember something somewhere (may archiveinvalidation invalidated. it was recent) editing the ini and asking me if i wanted to continue. this was definitely after the problems started. arg so confusing. sux carrying around a torch with pixelated fire. I fixed my load order. so any ideas which of my mods would have changed this? I always read instructions carefully etc. On a sidenote, I recently tried to get REAVWD working, and that failed miserably. And i really wanted that beautiful distant detail. I would install with bain (what a mission to figure that out), in this order: REAVWD 1.8 (not currently installed) REAVWD ELsweyr (not installed) REAVWD Shivering Isles (still installed but dont know if its working) REAVWD qtp3 texture pack (not installed) Then i ran tes4lodgen and that did its thing. a few errors came up but thats because of elsweyr heightmaps and trees and totally expected. When i loaded my game, i saw no noticeable difference (so i checked streamline in case that was stopping the detail but it wasn't) and the imperial city had disappeared. I could still see the darker blue silhouette in the sky but the city was lacking all the models. Im not sure if the actual load order of REAVWD was right, i assumed it would follow naturally from the install order. in any case, that shouldn't make the city disappear. i am running better cities but that should just mean the distant lod models won't match up with whats really in there, which i don't care about. correct? I just checked the load order of REAVWD in wryebash and its a little wonky, but REAVWD is before the QTP3 texture pack and elswyer and SI won't affect REAVWD. I also made sure not to use the city plugin esps because the instructions say they are optional and conflict with Better Cities. I am still getting used to all this. But I learn fast. Thanks for your help so far. p.s. the problems may have started after I installed UOP. I did that recently after most of my mods were installed because i wasn't aware of it when i did my reinstall of oblivion. I also put on the qtp3 patch for UOP and then reinstalled QTP3. i did everything i could to make sure i didn't get any conflicts. but maybe i missed something. Is there a particle effect (or whatever fire and magic is) update or mod that makes it better looking that i can just install over it and maybe that will fix my problem? or half of it at least.