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I'm not debating conspiracy theories, I've done it too many times in the past, it's a act of futility as evidence will be dismissed or accepted on the basis of how well it fits the theory, not on the basis of how good the evidence is. I stated a fact, this Jewish world domination nonsense is a fiction first put out by the Russians and then used by the Nazis. It's still peddled today by neo Nazis and to a lesser degree by the trendy left who dress it up as "Anti Zionism", It has no basis in fact whatsoever. Most conspiracy theories are harmless but when one vilifies a group and takes hold then things can get nasty as we know all too well, anyone unintentionally peddling that sort of thing needs to be put straight.


I don't think you're a Nazi, I just think you don't know what it is you're buying into.


I know exactly where your coming from, I agree with everything thing you've posted, but all I'm saying is what are the chances, that these men, separated by centuries of education, culture, language, and politics. Are all basically arriving at the same thing conclusion, pretty much every one on this list: http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/repute.htm. Was born before Telecommunications was even invented, some before the Printing Press as well. Most of these men also come from university educations. Most of these statements were made before Communism was even invented let alone Fascism. What? Are they all reading from the same book or something? Where is their conclusions coming from? Where is the disconnect? I'm sure if you looked around you could find even more quotes from famous people.


Then there's this guy. Unless he is a complete fraud, which is unlikely, given the community he's coming from. And I seriously doubt he's an imposter, he would have been arrested already and sent to prison. Things like this are shut down immediately, because of the information they contain. How is it one of their own is literally, ranting about it, and no ones called him out on it and put to stop to it. The accusations this guy makes are way worse then anything I have, can and will ever write here. Given his background, he is not a Nazi or even a Racist. (Because that would make no sense whatsoever.) He is a Jew himself, and I seriously doubt he doesn't realize where his information is coming from. Jews know more about this subject then anyone else, and keep very good records, and are very smart people.


So is he just spouting propaganda or did something rub him the wrong way? I'm sure if you looked around you could find more examples of this kind of thing coming from their own people.


Warning Viewer Discretion is Advised: :excl:




Edit: Finally I would like to point out something I wonder if anyone else has thought of. This is a list of every country the Jews have ever been expelled from: http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/expelled.htm. That is a drastic response, you literally had to get your soldiers to search your entire nation, looking for a certain minority group in a racially diverse country. That is exhausting and a monumental task to do requiring a lot of money as well. In a time like the Roman Empire, were moving across your nation, would have taken months maybe even years in some cases. An extremely difficult and tedious process to do, all because of simple racism? Not to mention it would have taken years to accomplish the complete removal of these people.


And another thing. I'm not 'buying' into anything, again, your calling me a Nazi or Ignorant inadvertently because of what the presupposition implys. And since you don't debate conspiracy's, the only reason, I can assume your posting here is one of two things. Either you are trying to derail this thread, or to inform me of where this material, potentiality, came from. Regardless of the fact I already know. As a consequence this thread has already been derailed slightly. If you actually read the conspiracy I posted, all the way through and multiple times, its is more about Fractional Reserve Banking then it is about any race in particular. It seems to be a conglomerate of people working together. Because if anyone knows anything about Economics and Politics, they would know that Interest, by its very nature is designed to accumulate Debt. And the Jews just happen to be involved because of their history, if you actually read what I posted the Jews are just victims in this theory.




48 B.C. Julius Caesar took back from the money changers the power to coin money and then minted coins for the benefit of all. With this new, plentiful supply of money, he established many massive construction projects and built great public works. By making money plentiful, Caesar won the love of the common people.

But the money changers hated him for it and this is why Caesar was assassinated. Immediately after his assassination came the demise of plentiful money in Rome, taxes increased, as did corruption.

Eventually the Roman money supply was reduced by 90 per cent, which resulted in the common people losing their lands and homes. But the money changers hated him for it and this is why Caesar was assassinated. Immediately after his assassination came the demise of plentiful money in Rome, taxes increased, as did corruption.

Eventually the Roman money supply was reduced by 90 per cent, which resulted in the common people losing their lands and homes.


30 A.D. Jesus Christ in the last year of his life uses physical force to throw the money changers out of the temple. This was the only time during the the life of his ministry in which he used physical force against anyone.

When Jews came to Jerusalem to pay their Temple tax, they could only pay it with a special coin, the half-shekel. This was a half-ounce of pure silver, about the size of a quarter. It was the only coin at that time which was pure silver and of assured weight, without the image of a pagan Emperor, and therefore to the Jews it was the only coin acceptable to God.

Unfortunately these coins were not plentiful, the money changers had cornered the market on them, and so they raised the price of them to whatever the market could bear. They used their monopoly they had on these coins to make exorbitant profits, forcing the Jews to pay whatever these money changers demanded.

Jesus threw the money changers out as their monopoly on these coins totally violated the sanctity of God's house. These money changers called for his death days later.



It has nothing to do with Jews, it has everything to do with money. They were forcing the Jews to pay whatever these Money Changers demanded. Who ever the money changers were was irrelevant, they could be any race at any point in time, because its a style of credit, a way to acquire lots of currency fast. Apart from the beginning, It never does brings up race, as a matter of fact, all it talks about is politics and economics.




1798 Mayer Amschel Rothschild sends his son, Nathan, at the age of 21, to England with a sum of money equivalent to £20,000, to set up a money changers there. 1800 In France, the Bank of France was set up. However Napoleon decided France had to break free of the debt and he therefore never trusted this bank. He declared that when a government is dependent on bankers for money, it is the bankers and not the government leaders that are in control. He stated,


"The hand that gives is among the hand that takes. Money has no motherland, financiers are without patriotism and without decency, their sole object is gain."


1803 Now President Thomas Jefferson, President Jefferson struck a deal with Napoleon in France. The United States would give Napoleon $3,000,000 of gold in exchange for a huge chunk of territory west of the Mississippi River. This was called the Louisiana purchase.

Napoleon used this gold to put together an army. He then used this army to set off across Europe where he began to conquer everything in his path. The Bank of England quickly rose to oppose Napoleon and financed every nation in his path, as usual profiteering from war. Prussia, Austria, and then finally Russia all went heavily into debt in a futile attempt to stop Napoleon.


1807 30 year old Nathan Rothschild, head of the English branch of the family in London, personally takes charge of a plan to smuggle a much needed shipment of gold through France to Spain to finance an attack by the Duke Of Wellington on Napoleon, from there. 1811 A bill was put before Congress to renew the charter of the First Bank of the United States. The legislatures of both Pennsylvania and Virginia pass resolutions asking Congress to kill the bank. The national press openly attack the bank calling it: a great swindle; a vulture; a viper; and a cobra.

Nathan Rothschild gets in on the act and makes the following revealing statement as to who was really behind the First Bank of the United States,

When the smoke had cleared the renewal bill was cleared by a single vote in the house and was deadlocked in the Senate. At this point America's fourth President, President James Madison was in the White House. He was a staunch opponent of the bank and he sent his Vice-President, George Clinton, to break a tie in the Senate which killed the bank.

“Either the application for renewal of the charter is granted, or the United States will find itself involved in a most disastrous war.”


1812 As promised by Nathan Rothschild, because the charter for the First Bank of the United States is not renewed, thousands have to die and the British attack America. However, as the British are still busy fighting Napoleon, they are unable to mount much of an assault and the war ends in 1814 with America undefeated. 1814 Wellington's attacks from the South and other defeats eventually forced Napoleon to abdicate and Louis XVIII is crowned King. Napoleon is exiled to the tiny island of Elba, off the coast of Italy. 1815 Napoleon escapes his exile and returns to Paris. French troops were sent to capture him, but he uses his charisma to convince these soldiers to rally round him, and they subsequently hail him as their emperor once again. In March, Napoleon assembles an army which England's Duke of Wellington defeated less than 90 days later at Waterloo.

Even though the outcome is predetermined, these bankers don't like to take any sort of risk, they're too used to a monopoly. Therefore Nathan Rothschild sent a trusted courier named Rothworth to Waterloo where he stayed on the edge of the battlefield. Once the battle was decided, Rothworth took off for the Channel, and delivered the news of Wellington's victory to Nathan Rothschild a full 24 hours before Wellington's own courier.

Nathan Rothschild hurried to the London Stock market and stood in his usual position. All eyes were on him as Rothschild had a legendary communications network. Rothschild stood there looking forlorn and suddenly started selling. The other traders believed that this meant he had heard that Napoleon had won so they all started selling frantically.

The market subsequently plummeted, soon everyone was selling their consuls (British Government Bonds), but then Rothschild secretly started buying them all up through his agents on the floor, for a fraction of what they were worth only hours before. A lot of these consuls were able to be converted to Bank of England stock, which is how Rothschild took over the control of the Bank of England and therefore the British money supply.

Interestingly, 100 years later, the New York Times ran a story stating that Nathan Rothschild's grandson had attempted to secure a court order to suppress a book with this, what we would call today, "insider trading," story in it. The Rothschild family claimed the story was untrue and libelous, but the court denied the Rothschilds request and ordered the family to pay all court costs.

Nathan Rothschild openly brags that in his 17 years in England he had increased his initial £20,000 stake given to him by his father, 2500 times to £50,000,000.

Some people ask, why do bankers want war? Simple, bankers finance both sides in a war. They do this because war is the biggest debt generator of them all. A nation will borrow any amount for victory, even though the banks have already predetermined the outcome. The ultimate loser is loaned just enough money to hold out a vain hope of victory and the ultimate winner is given enough to ensure that he does win.

How do the banks ensure they will get all their money back? Easy, such loans are given on the guarantee that the victor will honor the debts of the vanquished. Never mind the thousands of troops that give their lives on the pretext it is for the honor of their respective nations, when it is actually for the profits of bankers.

In fact, during the period between the founding of the Bank of England in 1694 and Napoleon's defeat at Waterloo this year, England had been at war for 56 years, with much of the remaining time spent preparing for war. If it's a good business for bankers' profits, then why change it.




The Jews are not the Moneychangers. They are victims here. The only reason Rothschild is even mentioned, is because he created the Modern Banking System as we know it, and his family has a debatable history, you don't see this with any other Jewish family. This is because they literately gained their wealth almost out of the clear blue sky, before that they were nobody's, nobody had heard of them, nobody knew who they were. Nobody cared. Then all the sudden they all show up in history as one of the most wealthy people in the world. Which is how these theories tend to crop up, because it looks kind of suspicious.


Then there is this. Pick one then try to decide which one makes more sense, which one explains why the world is financially melting right now. Which one is not Disinformation or Misinformation. And above all which one is not riddled with propaganda from the following sides: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Participants_in_World_War_II


Here is the conspiracy version:



Here is the accepted version:



Here is the Russian & German World War II version: Which if I may was actually going on for, around, thirty years before the start of the actual war.



Here is Fractional Reserve Banking explained by what could be considered a Conspiracy Theorist:



Here is the same thing explained by a Jew, yes Henry Maklow is a Jew you can look it up if you care to:



Fractional Reserve Banking explained by the Federal Reserve itself:



And finally here is a server that contains 500+ articles on Economics, from various people of different nationality's around the world:




Then you have the website I posted at the top if anyone cares to look at that because that's certainly not normal. :ermm:

So you see the only reason why you posted here was because you happened to have a Knee-Jerk-Reaction when you saw that the theory I posted, mentioned various Jewish family names, and then I had wrote I had mentioned Jews and Banking History several times to people and was called a racist for it even though I never made any derogatory statement that anything I wrote was correct or that I condoned, approved or believed any of It. Also, it never says Jews, or any race runs the world, what it does say is different have people have used this throughout history to acquire huge amounts of currency, before the system implodes due in part to that fact, that is unstable and unsustainable over long periods of time.


Yeah that was my thinking to, to be honest I'm surprised you know about the Jews and their banking history, anytime I mention It I get called a racist even if I'm just linking articles. What I should have added was: Even though Jews admit that they have a storied history with banking due to their religious practices.


I mean its not like its a secret or even anything special. Then to which you replied. :dry:


If you recycle Nazi propaganda you should expect to be called out on it, the Jewish banking conspiracy nonsense is based on a fabrication by Russian secret police around the start of the 20th century, it was later presented as fact by the Nazis and is still peddled by anti semites today. I'm not saying you're a Nazi but should be aware of what you're posting.


Who is accusing who of being what exactly. If you had read anything I posted you would have realized this is not the conspiracy that the Soviets made to demonize Jews, then which the Germans picked up, I know the one your talking about this is not Soviet Bolshevism. This one is fundamentally different in the sense that this conspiracy has more to do with the infamous Illuminati then it does anything else. Look at the names of the people it lists, predominately white, wealthy Caucasians, it only mentions a handful of Jewish people who have a questionable history. Now I'm sure this has roots in Bolshevism but if one looks, I think you'll find it mentions, white people are more in on this then anything else. And lastly have you ever wondered where to Russians got the idea for this propaganda? Why does it have this elaborate framework? It might be due to the quotes I've listed above, which they took, and twisted to suit, what ever agenda they were trying to push at the time. Which makes you wonder what our ancestors were on about, given that the Jews, who are supposedly Gods Chosen Race, would be treated this way by Christians? But allow me to ask you something else, if its a Banking Conspiracy, why is it everyone is so hung up on the Jews? Rather then the Banks that are so central to this narrative. I mean does no one wonder were Hitler, Stalin and other dictators get their ideas? Considering they themselves were of Jewish descent. Why would you turn out damaging propaganda against your own race? Did they not know their own ancestry? I find that hard to believe given the fact they were obsessed with racial superiority, or so were told. :confused:


To reiterate the point I was trying to make earlier: When is a conspiracy not a theory. I think the answer to this lies in the Human Condition. The Human Brain is in constant struggle between itself, on the left side you have a Difference Engine, computing the difference between data to arrive at a emotional conclusion. In opposition to the right side which is a Computation Engine, computing the similarities between data to arrive at a logical conclusion. The only problem is neither of these are perfectly rational on their own, the Difference Engine is too logical, seeing patterns where there are none. The Difference Engine is to emotional creating reasons or excuses when there is not any to begin with. The Mainframe, the human, person, or whatever it is has to balance these factors, otherwise you got one side ruling the other resulting in a endless loop known as Semantics which is all arguments ever consist of because there is a fine line between a debate and argument. And a extreme difference between comprehending and understanding.


I mean you summed it up perfectly even better then I could.


It's a act of futility as evidence will be dismissed or accepted on the basis of how well it fits the theory, not on the basis of how good the evidence is.


However I would contend that information can all so be dismissed if it doesn't fit with your current view of reality.


Personally I'm apathetic either way, I mean its none of my business or concern. All I'm doing is pointing out inconsistencies, and what I think the intention is implying. I mean just look at this quote, does that say its a issue of race or an issue of money?


"The hand that gives is among the hand that takes. Money has no motherland, financiers are without patriotism and without decency, their sole object is gain." -Napoleon Bonaparte


And just for reference, here's a few more from what I posted. The following quotes stems from the 1700-1800 A.D.




"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes the laws." -Mayer Amschel Rothschild.
"The Bank hath benefit of interest on all monies which it creates out of nothing.” -William Paterson.
"This institution, having no principle but that of avarice, will never be varied in its objective...to engross all the wealth, power and influence of the state." -William Findlay.
"That is simple. In the Colonies we issue our own money. It is called Colonial Scrip. We issue it in proper proportion to the demands of trade and industry to make the products pass easily from the producers to the consumers. In this manner creating for ourselves our own paper money, we control its purchasing power, and we have no interest to pay no one." -Benjamin Franklin.
"In one year, the conditions were so reversed that the era of prosperity ended, and a depression set in, to such an extent that the streets of the colonies were filled with the unemployed...The colonies would gladly have borne the little tax on tea and other matters had it not been that England took away from the colonies their money which created unemployment and dissatisfaction. The viability of the colonists to get power to issue their own money permanently out of the hands of King George III and the international bankers was the prime reason for the revolutionary war." -Benjamin Franklin.
"The rich will strive to establish their dominion and enslave the rest. They always did. They always will...They will have the same effect here as elsewhere, if we do not, by the power of government, keep them in their proper spheres." -Thomas Jefferson.
"If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and the corporations which grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered." -Thomas Jefferson.
"I wish it were possible to obtain a single amendment to our constitution taking from the Federal Government their power of borrowing." -Thomas Jefferson.
"The division of the United States into federations of equal force was decided long before the Civil War by the high financial powers of Europe, these bankers were afraid that the United States if they remained as one block and as one nation, would attain economic and financial independence which would upset their financial domination over the world." -Otto Von Bismarck.
"Why Lincoln, that is easy, just get Congress to pass a bill authorizing the printing of full legal tender treasury notes...and pay your soldiers with them and go ahead and win your war with them also. The people or anyone else will not have any choice in the matter, if you make them full legal tender. They will have the full sanction of the government and be just as good as any money, as Congress is given that express right by the Constitution." -Colonel Taylor.
"The Government should create, issue and circulate all the currency and credit needed to satisfy the spending power of the Government and the buying power of consumers. The privilege of creating and issuing money is not only the supreme prerogative of Government, but it is in the Government's greatest creative opportunity. By the adoption of these principles...the taxpayers will be saved immense sums of interest. Money will cease to be master and become the servant of humanity. If that mischievous financial policy, which had its origin in the North American Republic, should become indurated down to a fixture, then that government will furnish its own money without cost. It will pay off debts and be without a debt. It will have all the money necessary to carry on its commerce. It will become prosperous beyond precedent in the history of civilized governments of the world. The brains and the wealth of all countries will go to North America. That government must be destroyed or it will destroy every monarchy on the globe." -Times of London.
"In numerous years following the war, the Federal Government ran a heavy surplus. It could not however pay off its debt, retire its securities, because to do so meant there would be no bonds to back the national bank notes. To pay off the debt was to destroy the money supply." -Tsar Alexander II.
"The money power preys upon the nations in times of peace and conspires against it in times of adversity. It is more despotic than monarchy, more insolent than autocracy, more selfish than bureaucracy. My agency in promoting the passage of the National Banking Act was the greatest financial mistake in my life. It has built up a monopoly which affects every interest in the country." -Abraham Lincoln.
"Abraham Lincoln, the murdered emancipator of the slaves, was assassinated through the machinations of a group representative of the International Bankers, who feared the United States President's National Credit ambitions. There was only one group in the world at that time who had any reason to desire the death of Lincoln. They were the men opposed to his national currency program and who had fought him throughout the whole Civil War on his policy of Greenback currency." -Gerald G. McGeer.
"They were the men interested in the establishment of the Gold Standard and the right of the bankers to manage the currency and credit of every nation in the world. With Lincoln out of the way they were able to proceed with that plan and did proceed with it in the United States. Within 8 years after Lincoln's assassination, silver was demonetized and the Gold Standard system set up in the United States."-Gerald G. McGeer.
"The hard times which occurred after the Civil War could have been avoided if the Greenback legislation had continued as President Lincoln had intended. Instead there were a series of money panics, what we call recessions, which put pressure on Congress to enact legislation to place the banking system under centralized control. Eventually the Federal Reserve Act was passed on December 23rd 1913." -Gerald G. McGeer.




Here's a few more modern quotations that contain what could be considered strange content.




"The modern banking system manufactures money out of nothing. The process is perhaps the most astounding piece of sleight of hand that was ever invented. Banking was conceived in iniquity and born in sin. Bankers own the Earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create money, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough money to buy it back again... Take this great power away from them and all great fortunes like mine will disappear, and they ought to disappear, for then this would be a better and happier world to live in. But if you want to continue to be slaves of the banks and pay the cost of your own slavery, then let bankers continue to create money and control credit." -Sir Josiah Stamp.
"The powers of financial capitalism had (a) far reaching (plan), nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences." - Carroll Quigley.
"We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled governments in the civilized world - no longer a government of free opinion, no longer a government by ...a vote of the majority, but a government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men.

Some of the biggest men in the United States, in the field of commerce and manufacture, are afraid of something. They know there is a power somewhere so organized, so subtle, so watchful, so interlocked, so complete, so pervasive, that they had better not speak above their breath when they speak in condemnation of it." -Woodrow Wilson.

"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson.
"It was not accidental. It was a carefully contrived occurrence...The international bankers sought to bring about a condition of despair here so that they might emerge as rulers of us all." -Louis T McFadden
"The financial system...has been turned over to...the Federal Reserve Board. That board administers the finance system by authority of ...a purely profiteering group. The system is private, conducted for the sole purpose of obtaining the greatest possible profits, from the use of other people's money." -Charles A Lindbergh Sr. These International bankers and Rockefeller-Standard Oil interests control the majority of newspapers and the columns of these newspapers to club into submission or drive out of public office officials who refuse to do the bidding of the powerful corrupt cliques which compose the invisible government. The warning of Theodore Roosevelt has much timeliness today, for the real menace of our republic is this invisible government which like a giant octopus sprawls its slimy length over city, state, and nation...It seizes in its long and powerful tentacles our executive officers, our legislative bodies, our schools, our courts, our newspapers, and every agency created for the public protection... To depart from mere generalizations, let me say that at the head of this octopus are the Rockefeller-Standard Oil interest and a small group of powerful banking houses generally referred to as international bankers. This little coterie of powerful international bankers virtually run the United States Government for their own selfish purposes. They practically control both parties, write political platforms, make cats paws of party leaders, use the leading men of private organizations, and resort to every device to place in nomination for high public office only such candidates as will be amenable to the dictates of corrupt big business ...these International Bankers and Rockefeller-Standard Oil interests control the majority of newspapers and magazines in this country." -The New York Times.
"We have in this country one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board...This evil institution has impoverished...the people of the United States...and has practically bankrupted our government. It has done this through...the corrupt practices of the moneyed vultures who control it." -Louis T. McFadden.
"Practices of the unscrupulous money changers stand indicted in the court of public opinion, rejected by the hearts and minds of men...The money changers have fled from their high seats in the temple of our civilization." -President Roosevelt.
"Democracy has no more persistent and insidious foe than money power ...questions regarding Bank of England, its conduct and its objects, are not allowed by the Speaker (of the House of Commons).Through the Fed the people are losing their rights guaranteed to them by the Constitution ...common decency requires us to examine the public accounts of the government and see what kind of crimes against the public welfare have been committed...the people of these United States are being greatly wronged... Every effort has been made by the Fed to conceal its powers-but truth is-the Fed has usurped the Government...the sack of these United States by the Fed is the greatest crime in history...what King ever robbed his subject to such an extent as the Fed has robbed us...it is a monstrous thing for this great nation of people to have its destinies presided over by a traitorous government board acting in secret concert with international usurer. When the Fed was passed, the people of these United States did not perceive that a world system was being set up here ...a super state controlled by international bankers, and international industrialists acting together to enslave the world for their own pleasure." -Louis T. McFadden.
"We are grateful to the Washington Post, The New York Times, Time Magazine and other great publications whose directors have attended our meetings and respected their promises of discretion for almost forty years. It would have been impossible for us to develop our plan for the world if we had been subjected to the lights of publicity during those years. But, the world is now more sophisticated and prepared to march towards a world government. The supranational sovereignty of an intellectual elite and world bankers is surely preferable to the national auto-determination practiced in past centuries.” -David Rockefeller, Baden-Baden, Germany 1991.
"It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.” -Henry Ford
“Some even believe we (the Rockefeller family) are part of a secret cabal working against the best interests of the United States, characterizing my family and me as ‘internationalists’ and of conspiring with others around the world to build a more integrated global political and economic structure – one world, if you will. If that’s the charge, I stand guilty, and I am proud of it.” -David Rockefeller, Memoirs, page 405.




There are literally hundreds, if not thousands, of quotes from powerful people talking about the same thing, and these are only a few.

Most of these people are politicians, economists, senators and congressmen. Do all these people not know what they're talking about?

Here is a link to Wikiquote to can verify these yourself. For me, personally, the most interesting quotes are from the London Times and the New York Times, do you know how many writers, editors, and staff work at these places. If the information was, on any level, incorrect someone would have caught it before it was published and corrected it.


I have a question if the United States can print its own money why do we end up borrowing money instead?


As a matter of fact, I don't even think you read anything I had posted, you are in all actuality doing this. :blink:

Specifically numbers: 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 9, 10, 12, 14, 15, 17, 18, 19, and 23.




Posted on May 21, 2011 by WashingtonsBlog

Update: This was originally apparently written by H. Michael Sweeney.


1. Hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil. Regardless of what you know, don’t discuss it — especially if you are a public figure, news anchor, etc. If it’s not reported, it didn’t happen, and you never have to deal with the issues.


2. Become incredulous and indignant. Avoid discussing key issues and instead focus on side issues which can be used show the topic as being critical of some otherwise sacrosanct group or theme. This is also known as the “How dare you!” gambit.


3. Create rumor mongers. Avoid discussing issues by describing all charges, regardless of venue or evidence, as mere rumors and wild accusations. Other derogatory terms mutually exclusive of truth may work as well. This method works especially well with a silent press, because the only way the public can learn of the facts are through such “arguable rumors”. If you can associate the material with the Internet, use this fact to certify it a “wild rumor” which can have no basis in fact.


4. Use a straw man. Find or create a seeming element of your opponent’s argument which you can easily knock down to make yourself look good and the opponent to look bad. Either make up an issue you may safely imply exists based on your interpretation of the opponent/opponent arguments/situation, or select the weakest aspect of the weakest charges. Amplify their significance and destroy them in a way which appears to debunk all the charges, real and fabricated alike, while actually avoiding discussion of the real issues.


5. Sidetrack opponents with name calling and ridicule. This is also known as the primary attack the messenger ploy, though other methods qualify as variants of that approach. Associate opponents with unpopular titles such as “kooks”, “right-wing”, “liberal”, “left-wing”, “terrorists”, “conspiracy buffs”, “radicals”, “militia”, “racists”, “religious fanatics”, “sexual deviates”, and so forth. This makes others shrink from support out of fear of gaining the same label, and you avoid dealing with issues.


6. Hit and Run. In any public forum, make a brief attack of your opponent or the opponent position and then scamper off before an answer can be fielded, or simply ignore any answer. This works extremely well in Internet and letters-to-the-editor environments where a steady stream of new identities can be called upon without having to explain criticism reasoning — simply make an accusation or other attack, never discussing issues, and never answering any subsequent response, for that would dignify the opponent’s viewpoint.


7. Question motives. Twist or amplify any fact which could so taken to imply that the opponent operates out of a hidden personal agenda or other bias. This avoids discussing issues and forces the accuser on the defensive.


8. Invoke authority. Claim for yourself or associate yourself with authority and present your argument with enough “jargon” and “minutiae” to illustrate you are “one who knows”, and simply say it isn’t so without discussing issues or demonstrating concretely why or citing sources.


9. Play Dumb. No matter what evidence or logical argument is offered, avoid discussing issues with denial they have any credibility, make any sense, provide any proof, contain or make a point, have logic, or support a conclusion. Mix well for maximum effect.


10. Associate opponent charges with old news. A derivative of the straw man usually, in any large-scale matter of high visibility, someone will make charges early on which can be or were already easily dealt with. Where it can be foreseen, have your own side raise a straw man issue and have it dealt with early on as part of the initial contingency plans. Subsequent charges, regardless of validity or new ground uncovered, can usually them be associated with the original charge and dismissed as simply being a rehash without need to address current issues — so much the better where the opponent is or was involved with the original source.


11. Establish and rely upon fall-back positions. Using a minor matter or element of the facts, take the “high road” and “confess” with candor that some innocent mistake, in hindsight, was made — but that opponents have seized on the opportunity to blow it all out of proportion and imply greater criminalities which, “just isn’t so.” Others can reinforce this on your behalf, later. Done properly, this can garner sympathy and respect for “coming clean” and “owning up” to your mistakes without addressing more serious issues.


12. Enigmas have no solution. Drawing upon the overall umbrella of events surrounding the crime and the multitude of players and events, paint the entire affair as too complex to solve. This causes those otherwise following the matter to begin to loose interest more quickly without having to address the actual issues.


13. Alice in Wonderland Logic. Avoid discussion of the issues by reasoning backwards with an apparent deductive logic in a way that forbears any actual material fact.


14. Demand complete solutions. Avoid the issues by requiring opponents to solve the crime at hand completely, a ploy which works best for items qualifying for rule 10.


15. Fit the facts to alternate conclusions. This requires creative thinking unless the crime was planned with contingency conclusions in place.


16. Vanishing evidence and witnesses. If it does not exist, it is not fact, and you won’t have to address the issue.


17. Change the subject. Usually in connection with one of the other ploys listed here, find a way to side-track the discussion with abrasive or controversial comments in hopes of turning attention to a new, more manageable topic. This works especially well with companions who can “argue” with you over the new topic and polarize the discussion arena in order to avoid discussing more key issues.


18. Emotionalize, Antagonize, and Goad Opponents. If you can’t do anything else, chide and taunt your opponents and draw them into emotional responses which will tend to make them look foolish and overly motivated, and generally render their material somewhat less coherent. Not only will you avoid discussing the issues in the first instance, but even if their emotional response addresses the issue, you can further avoid the issues by then focusing on how “sensitive they are to criticism”.


19. Ignore proof presented, demand impossible proofs. This is perhaps a variant of the “play dumb” rule. Regardless of what material may be presented by an opponent in public forums, claim the material irrelevant and demand proof that is impossible for the opponent to come by (it may exist, but not be at his disposal, or it may be something which is known to be safely destroyed or withheld, such as a murder weapon). In order to completely avoid discussing issues may require you to categorically deny and be critical of media or books as valid sources, deny that witnesses are acceptable, or even deny that statements made by government or other authorities have any meaning or relevance.


20. False evidence. Whenever possible, introduce new facts or clues designed and manufactured to conflict with opponent presentations as useful tools to neutralize sensitive issues or impede resolution. This works best when the crime was designed with contingencies for the purpose, and the facts cannot be easily separated from the fabrications.


21. Call a Grand Jury, Special Prosecutor, or other empowered investigative body. Subvert the (process) to your benefit and effectively neutralize all sensitive issues without open discussion. Once convened, the evidence and testimony are required to be secret when properly handled. For instance, if you own the prosecuting attorney, it can insure a Grand Jury hears no useful evidence and that the evidence is sealed an unavailable to subsequent investigators. Once a favorable verdict (usually, this technique is applied to find the guilty innocent, but it can also be used to obtain charges when seeking to frame a victim) is achieved, the matter can be considered officially closed.


22. Manufacture a new truth. Create your own expert(s), group(s), author(s), leader(s) or influence existing ones willing to forge new ground via scientific, investigative, or social research or testimony which concludes favorably. In this way, if you must actually address issues, you can do so authoritatively.


23. Create bigger distractions. If the above does not seem to be working to distract from sensitive issues, or to prevent unwanted media coverage of unstoppable events such as trials, create bigger news stories (or treat them as such) to distract the multitudes.


24. Silence critics. If the above methods do not prevail, consider removing opponents from circulation by some definitive solution so that the need to address issues is removed entirely. This can be by their death, arrest and detention, blackmail or destruction of their character by release of blackmail information, or merely by proper intimidation with blackmail or other threats.


25. Vanish. If you are a key holder of secrets or otherwise overly illuminated and you think the heat is getting too hot, to avoid the issues, vacate the kitchen.




Edited by Hardwaremaster
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Ok if you are going to give a big wall of quoted text then at least put it ALL in spoiler tags so our eyes don't bleed..lol

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Sounds interesting, Hardwaremaster, and I have seen such theories before. They are related to the kind of conspiracies that may sound fantastic but which are quite practical; if you have the power, the ruthlessness, the cunning, the brilliance, to do something to create more wealth for yourself, then why not even if it causes suffering for others? The big question is as follows; is it linked as one conspiracy or just many plans of economic manipulation that just happen to have links, often distant links, with each other.


Machiavelli wrote of conspiracies but in the sense that they were just one way for political, social, economic factions to make gains for themselves at the expense of others.


Its when conspiracies enter the realms of such as world government, racial hatred, weather manipulation, flying saucers and ancient secret cities that the level of discussion need go to different levels.

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look at all those words.

It looks even worse on my phone.

Ok if you are going to give a big wall of quoted text then at least put it ALL in spoiler tags so our eyes don't bleed..lol

Maybe its a .... gulp..... conspiracy! :ohmy:


I must admit I haven't checked back for a weak or two. Imagine my surprise when most of the comments are talking about how the text is to large, never mentioning once if they read the complete thing or not. Also I will admit as well that it could have been more compact, which I will might be able to fix later, but, I also forgot about: Rule Number One of the Internet: the more you write the more people skim. People tend to have no attention spans anymore and Its slightly annoying because of it. Most people wont read anything larger then a certain amount of characters, they see anything larger and their brains shutdown in response.


Sounds interesting, Hardwaremaster, and I have seen such theories before. They are related to the kind of conspiracies that may sound fantastic but which are quite practical; if you have the power, the ruthlessness, the cunning, the brilliance, to do something to create more wealth for yourself, then why not even if it causes suffering for others? The big question is as follows; is it linked as one conspiracy or just many plans of economic manipulation that just happen to have links, often distant links, with each other.


Machiavelli wrote of conspiracies but in the sense that they were just one way for political, social, economic factions to make gains for themselves at the expense of others.


Its when conspiracies enter the realms of such as world government, racial hatred, weather manipulation, flying saucers and ancient secret cities that the level of discussion need go to different levels.


Well at least you had the decency to comment with some Interesting Information and points unlike some people who shall remain nameless. :dry: That was another point I was trying to make, is it all separate agendas that look connected, or is it an actual agenda that connects to everything else. Reading the quotes I posted above I'm not sure Its really either of them. :sweat:

Edited by Hardwaremaster
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