Crim, The Red Thunder Posted September 21, 2004 Share Posted September 21, 2004 I play a VERY honor-bound character. (Im not above stealing, but i can count on one hand the times i have run from a gaurd... this coming from the guy with 500+ speed, who can outrun AND outfly a cliffracer...) I also play a "Fair-to-all" character. I dont treat people of one sort any different then i do for the others. I escort Pemenie back to her town, find out shes a bandit (i already knew, but still) and then promptly slew her. But i wont get in an unprovoked fight without it being vital to a quest. (A few of the threads of the webspinner come to mind)... As a result, i am a member of just about every guild... the legion, the imperial cult, the tribunal temple, mages guild, fighters guild, theives guild, etc... and house telvanni. I recently decided to go back and clear out some of the early quests i hadnt done yet. A telvanni quest for an artifact ring (think black... i dont want to say the name... its spoily...) is giving me problems. To get the ring, i have to duel a morag tong member, and he wont challenge me because i ALSO belong to the morag tong... Is there any peaceful way around this quest? I dont want to be expelled from the morag tong, and i cant come up with any way to stop this, unless he challenges me to a duel... and even then, i dont think im allowed to kill him... A little help please? If its any help, my character CAN slay him in a single blow (no i dont have a cheating weapon...) but my security skill kinds stinks... (27... i think... i never had to train it thanks to a open-100 level lock amulet.) so i dont think i could steal it... even with 100% chameleon... PLEASE help me find a peaceful solution... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac Posted September 21, 2004 Share Posted September 21, 2004 For the Telvanni Ring quest...unfortunately, no, there is no pacifist solution for you, unless you suddenly become Grandmaster of the Morag Tong, in which case he will simply hand over the ring. Just kill him and pretend it didn't happen if you really want- you can't progress unless you do that quest, so I'd put your game-morals aside for a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crim, The Red Thunder Posted September 21, 2004 Author Share Posted September 21, 2004 But if i kill him, i lose access to the morag tong guild, due to expulsion for killing a guild member... dont i? (My understanding is that i am PERMANENTLY expelled for violating the rules, and with the morag tong, they will put hits out on me... the dark brotherhood is bad enough, not to mention the daedra from 'Infernal contract'... So i really dont need anyone else to get peeved at me...) and for that matter, i want to challenge 'severa magia' and she wont appear until you get the quest for her from the morag tong (or i really WOULD have hunted her down by now... when i golden saint dies in 1-2 hits, daedra arent a threat...) also, i am VERY far into the telvanni house... i have already become master Aryon's mouth, and i have done many other quests... however, i became a mouth before finishing aryons quest (the one for going to tel-fyr... ughh... hate isolated... telvanni towers... even if i AM a hermit myself...) and i PROBABLY cant become archmagister of the telvanni house... since i cant (to my knowledge) complete the chores for master aryons mouth, since she isnt there anymore... (and i dont know how to spawn her with the console...) I think im about 2 ranks below archmagister, and there are plenty of other chores, i just sorta wanted to find the peaceful solution. (Also, my 'house' mod (a BALANCED house mod... and more useful then the basic house...) has a museum, so its a big deal for me to collect all the unique items in the game... and to get the ones back that i have given to the mouths, i have to reach archmagister...) I guess i have to finish that 'threads of the webspinner' first... oh well... here goes another wasted week... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 If he attacks you first, you are not expelled for violence. Either magically or verbally entice him into attacking you. Being expelled from the Morag Tong does not mean that you will be marked with a writ. That's ingame lore- it never actually happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crim, The Red Thunder Posted September 22, 2004 Author Share Posted September 22, 2004 Thanks! Does that little piece of info hold true for all guilds? (In other words, if im 'expelled' for breaking the rules, i can walts through a sea of 'ex-guild members' to the head of the guild, and be reinstated without fear? (Like i said, my character is 'honor-bound'... a weird type of honor, but honor nonetheless... and i LOATHE people who write walkthrus which say: "Steal this. If you're caught, kill the gaurds, they arent important to the main quest"... hence the reason im writing a COMPLETE guide for people who dont want to be evil serial killers, but want to do all the quests... But i digress) Anyway, i dont suppose there's a solution for my other telvanni quest problem? The one about Divayth Fyr's reply, and how master Aryon's mouth is NOT in the council chamber? can she be found elsewhere? (Distance isnt an issue... boots of the apostle + Boots of blinding speed + Cuirass of the saviors hide = Go anywhere, fear nothing.)For this, i dont mind cheating and using a console window, if there is no other option... next time ill finish those chores before becoming a mouth... The black jinx is now mine, BTW... i didnt realize you werent penalized for casting a frenzy spell on non-hostile npcs... the threads of the webspinner just got a WHOLE lot easier... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmac Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 Well...there are certain limits to reinstatement. Some guilds/factions are more forgiving that others. But approaching a chapter steward will set you on the path of reinstatement. I'm not too sure about the missing mouth...sounds like a scripting area. I'd reccoment a reinstall to see if that clears it up. Also disable any mods that you think could potentially affect this situation. The Mouth should be on his mushroom pedestal in the Telvanni Council Chamber. The only reason a Mouth would disappear is if you killed their patron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malchik Posted September 22, 2004 Share Posted September 22, 2004 cmac, you are sleeping at your post. Crim, Master Aryon's mouth has disappeared because YOU have taken over the position! You even said it in an earlier post. YOU are master Aryon's mouth. The other guy has retired. You can bring him back (anywhere you like) using the console if you want but why would you? BTW, the Frenzy Humanoid is a very useful spell if you do join the Morag Tong and for certain rather dubious quests in Tribunal! (Not that your honorable character would undertake them...?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crim, The Red Thunder Posted September 22, 2004 Author Share Posted September 22, 2004 I know WHY hes disappearred (i knew that... not before i became mouth, but i did after, and mods wouldnt have affected it.) What i DONT know is HOW to bring him back with the console. As for why i would do this? Because i never finished the quests for that mouth, and hes the only one i can turn in the 'response from Divayth Fyr' to. (Not to mention, the other quests which come AFTER that one...) Archmagister is important!!!!!! I want to reach archmagister of the "house of hermits" , so i can have a complete collection of unique items (i HATE giving up artifacts... but they can USUALLY be gotten back, through a roundabout, circuitous path... As for cmac, can you warn me WHICH factions will not let me return? and just how 'serious' are the rules for various factions... in other words, are their factions that wont reinstate me? (Sneaking isnt a problem with permanent invisibilty [kisses his exquisite ring] hehehe...) and if i kill a faction member (in cold blood) but NOONE sees or hears it, am i kicked out? Or if i steal from someone, and im not caught (By anyone) then, am i still kicked out? Maybe i should return the master alchemy equipment from the storage room in caldera... i definitely dont want to lose out on the mages guild... And a rumour i heard, can grandmasters be kicked out of their guilds? Edit: The reason i wondered if there was another place to find him was because of his comment of 'i have research i would like to do'... and telvanni do their research in wizard towers, or isolated places, so i wondered if i could wander off to some far-off daedric/dwemer ruin, or a velothi dome, or cave somewhere... like i said, i treat noone any better, so i want to do all the quests... (except slaves who dont matter, if it's part of a quest... like theranas skirt... notice that therana wanted a 'khajjit fur skirt', and the slave that died is a khajitt... hmmmmm... sorry... my minds wandering...) Edit: and why wouldnt my character undertake them... like i said, it's a weird kind of honor... its a dedication to everyone, whether they're good (basic quest giver) bad (dagoth quests, criminal quests (the one in fort moonmoth is an example... you have to serial kill an entire building...), or quests where an innocent must die) or some shade of gray inbetween (people like the theives guild... where you must break laws, but they have good intentions... like the early quest from sugarlips to get the three dwemer artifacts...)Although, it is kinda bad to attack a certain gold/silver god so i can complete my collection of souls... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malchik Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 If you check the pinned thread in Spoilers - An answer to all those easy questions etc. you will find I added a post about getting expelled from factions, being reinstated etc. Yes Grandmasters can be expelled and they cannot always get reinstated as the one who can do so is no longer in the game. The command is placeatpc"Galos Mathendis" 1,20,3. But you don't have to do all the quests to reach the level of Archmagister. Also, if you aren't getting anywhere, you can use console commands to raise rank. There is reference to an old bug, not present in the European version I have, where you might not get the chance to become Archmagister if you chose the immediately lower rank. I understand that this was fixed in the official patch, check out you have it. You can also join both other great houses and rise to the top by doing their quests. (You can only get one stronghold built, though the others will become yours.) Hope this meets your needs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tyjet3 Posted September 23, 2004 Share Posted September 23, 2004 There has to be console command to make the mouth appear... does anyone know it? or at least the basic outline of the command? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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