The Next Tes is the End of the Human Main Culture, how many TES Games

[Lachdonin]

Id love to see proceduraly generated sandbox recreating the whole of tamriel again(as in Arena) or a very detailed region (as in daggerfall) with modern technologies. alas it probably wont happen since this is not the way Bethesda makes games (they are still good game nevertheless though)

 

As much as I would like to see the same thing, many people forget how problematic both those games were. They were full of game-breaking glitches, had almost no memorable characters, beat the computers of their day like a cheap drum and were an absolutely mind-numbing dungeon experience (am I the only one who remembers the Right-hand-technique for dungeon crawls? god I hated those randomised monstrosities...).

 

The there's the technical limitations... Rendering a province, to scale, even in the quality of Oblivion, would obliterate almost every computer on the market, not to mention the poor consoles. If you were to get rid of cells (as many people want) it would be even worse. Imagine Minecraft, populated by tens of thousands of NPCs, with Oblivion's graphics. It's just not technically possible to do something to scale like Daggerfall and Arena. Though, I admit, it would be awesome.

[budcat]

 

If they want my money they better turn this ish around. I've gone back to Oblivion.

 

I just hope they pick a region with charisma. Skyrim is the ugly duckling of Tamriel provinces.

Good for us your opinion means nothing.

3.4 million sales the first 48 houres.

The average score of the game is what, 96+/100?

Hopefully there's only one status bar, two magic schools, one weapon type, and armor equips all in one item slot. I hope they just keep cutting elements from the series because as long as that = sales, it's all good!

 

Mostly it was hype, hype, hype. I fell for it, too. It's a cool game, even an awesome game, but this is not the direction I want to see TES go. In Skyrim's case, less was not more. Is anyone really saying, "MOAR LESS!!!"?

Edited October 23, 2013 by budcat

[MostlyMuggie]

Id love to see proceduraly generated sandbox recreating the whole of tamriel again(as in Arena) or a very detailed region (as in daggerfall) with modern technologies. alas it probably wont happen since this is not the way Bethesda makes games (they are still good game nevertheless though)

 

Daggerfall focussed on Bretons, Redguards, and Orcs. Daggerfall was a huge game. On the map, there was thousands of locations and towns. It makes later Elder Scrolls Games look puny. Here is an image I put together to show it.

 

Although it is so huge, the game is mostly randomly generated and uninteresting (Still a great game though). I do not think it would be popular for them to make a game like this again for today's audience. Everything would look the same and lack in character.

Edited October 23, 2013 by MostlyMuggie

[daventry]

Have you seen ESO :whistling:

[MostlyMuggie]

Have you seen ESO :whistling:

I would be GREATLY surprised if ESO is anywhere near the square mileage as Daggerfall. Let's say they make each of the 9 provinces are 16 square miles each (about the size of Oblivion's map). That would be 144 square miles when added all up. Daggerfall's map is over 62,394 square miles. I don't think it will even be a comparison. Plus, no one knows how big ESO will be and even if it is open world at all.

Edited October 23, 2013 by MostlyMuggie

[CalibanX]

I'm hoping the next series will focus on a non-human race. I loved what the artists did with Skyrim. The place feels like a cold, rough place yet still has distinct geographic regions, and differrent exprestions of Nord culture in the various cities. I'm a gamer who savours these kinds of details and still enjoy playing Skyrim 2 years after it's release.

Still, it would be great to see an older, more mysterious culture like the Altmer fully developed by Bethesda's art department. I'm crossing my fingers for something non-human so they can really run with an alien culture unrestrained by the more typical, human cultures.

[Lachdonin]

 

Have you seen ESO :whistling:

I would be GREATLY surprised if ESO is anywhere near the square mileage as Daggerfall. Let's say they make each of the 9 provinces are 16 square miles each (about the size of Oblivion's map). That would be 144 square miles when added all up. Daggerfall's map is over 62,394 square miles. I don't think it will even be a comparison. Plus, no one knows how big ESO will be and even if it is open world at all.

 

 

Yeah... many people forget that Daggerfall was built TO SCALE. Walking from Wayrest to Daggerfall, on foot, would take weeks (and also be really, really boring, what with the bland random environment... Tree, tree, tree, bush, tree, rock...) in real time. There is no chance that TES:O is anything approaching the same area.

 

I'm hoping the next series will focus on a non-human race. I loved what the artists did with Skyrim. The place feels like a cold, rough place yet still has distinct geographic regions, and differrent exprestions of Nord culture in the various cities. I'm a gamer who savours these kinds of details and still enjoy playing Skyrim 2 years after it's release.

 

Still, it would be great to see an older, more mysterious culture like the Altmer fully developed by Bethesda's art department. I'm crossing my fingers for something non-human so they can really run with an alien culture unrestrained by the more typical, human cultures.

 

The most interesting and least explored cultures are the Argonians, and the Khajiit. Both of which offer great story opportunities in a post-Skyrim world. The Altmer would be interesting, if they don't just do the whole Tolkien-Rivendell schtick. I'm personally terrified that TES:O will ruin the Altmer. The Palace of Alinor had damn well better look like it's built out of crystallized dragonfly wings or so help me!

[darkmadmax]

As much as I would like to see the same thing, many people forget how problematic both those games were. They were full of game-breaking glitches, had almost no memorable characters, beat the computers of their day like a cheap drum and were an absolutely mind-numbing dungeon experience (am I the only one who remembers the Right-hand-technique for dungeon crawls? god I hated those randomised monstrosities...).

 

The there's the technical limitations... Rendering a province, to scale, even in the quality of Oblivion, would obliterate almost every computer on the market, not to mention the poor consoles. If you were to get rid of cells (as many people want) it would be even worse. Imagine Minecraft, populated by tens of thousands of NPCs, with Oblivion's graphics. It's just not technically possible to do something to scale like Daggerfall and Arena. Though, I admit, it would be awesome.

 

 

Well you have to also take into account that both arena and daggerfall were made by a very small group of people working also at the same time on 3-4 other titles. And not only making game iteself but also making literally all the things for it - including 3d engine, game engine and tools to manage all the assets

 

Games like oblivion and especially skyrim are made with huge budgets, huge dedicated team, using 3d party game engine and tools (so bethesda themselves do nothing but creating the game and art assets)

 

That is not to say diminish the achievement that Skyrim is amazing game in its own right , but speculation on whats possible and whats not should be made taking into account many technical details with proper care and understanding. its is quite possible to make seamless world size of daggerfall /arena and even much bigger with modern graphics , in fact its not only possible there are commercial projects with this technology on the market right now

Edited October 24, 2013 by Dark_MadMax

[Lachdonin]

 

As much as I would like to see the same thing, many people forget how problematic both those games were. They were full of game-breaking glitches, had almost no memorable characters, beat the computers of their day like a cheap drum and were an absolutely mind-numbing dungeon experience (am I the only one who remembers the Right-hand-technique for dungeon crawls? god I hated those randomised monstrosities...).

 

The there's the technical limitations... Rendering a province, to scale, even in the quality of Oblivion, would obliterate almost every computer on the market, not to mention the poor consoles. If you were to get rid of cells (as many people want) it would be even worse. Imagine Minecraft, populated by tens of thousands of NPCs, with Oblivion's graphics. It's just not technically possible to do something to scale like Daggerfall and Arena. Though, I admit, it would be awesome.

 

 

Well you have to also take into account that both arena and daggerfall were made by a very small group of people working also at the same time on 3-4 other titles. And not only making game iteself but also making literally all the things for it - including 3d engine, game engine and tools to manage all the assets

 

Games like oblivion and especially skyrim are made with huge budgets, huge dedicated team, using 3d party game engine and tools (so bethesda themselves do nothing but creating the game and art assets)

 

That is not to say diminish the achievement that Skyrim is amazing game in its own right , but speculation on whats possible and whats not should be made taking into account many technical details with proper care and understanding. its is quite possible to make seamless world size of daggerfall /arena and even much bigger with modern graphics , in fact its not only possible there are commercial projects with this technology on the market right now

 

 

Any names? Cause i'd like to follow them and watch their inevitable crash and burn.

 

Most computers grind to a stop when trying to render a minecraft world a fraction of the size of Daggerfall. Admittedly, that has to do in part with the limitations of Minecraft's java-based engine, but it also has to do with the limited memory capacity of PC's and the constant background operations which keep them running. The technology is not commercially available which allows for the type of scale you would require. And that's not including the huge pool of NPC's, most of which would be relegated to mindless drones (can you imagine creating the100,000+ genuinely memorable people players would demand?). The largest games i have heard of have an area less than 200 square miles. And none of them are even remotely as attractive as Skyrim.

 

There is especially a problem with established worlds and geographies like Tamriel. The continent has already been mapped out to a huge degree, so random generation would be impossible without breaking continuity. Of course, that could be solved by Landfall.. but that's something else altogether.

 

We simply aren't to the point where a next-generation, true scale province is possible. At least not for TESVI. VII maybe, depending on how the whole graphine thing goes.

 

 

On the other hand, it WOULD stick it to the damned "fast travel has no place in a TES game" crowd.

[darkmadmax]

 

 

Any names? Cause i'd like to follow them and watch their inevitable crash and burn.

 

There is a company making such a engine for quite a while http://www.vworld.fr/GB_vworldterrain.html .There was an attempt to make a game based on it (it was mmo called dark and light), and while there was not much of game out of it all (main reason it failed too) the world was absolutely stunning ( I was in closed beta of it). Like breathtaking literally - seamless world you can see for hundred of kilometers, with forest , terrain, mountains and rivers. All proceduraly generated too

 

Most computers grind to a stop when trying to render a minecraft world a fraction of the size of Daggerfall. Admittedly, that has to do in part with the limitations of Minecraft's java-based engine, but it also has to do with the limited memory capacity of PC's and the constant background operations which keep them running.

 

I dont want make harsh judgements but such statements imply that you are relatively unfamiliar with technology aspect of such things. It is not a question of technical feasibility -it is quite feasible and been for quite a long time but a question of a company investing high amount of resources into making such a product. After all procedural generated world which is stunning and amazing still does not make a game all on its own

 

and I kinda have to chuckle at comparisons to minecraft - because it is small project (by amount of time and code involved, not by income it generated), made by 1 person , in quite a short time and was experiment in a cube sandboxes, all in all which was quite remarkably successful due to many factors . But considering it a good software example for the limits of technology yet alone any sort of mark in this area is laughable.

 

Presently on the market there are quite a few products right off the shelf capable of displaying 3d terrain in high detail and in large scale - planetside engine, cryengine are some of those if we want game engines specifically