(WIP) Fallout 3 Quality Sound Replacement

[Pepper26]

Hello, I'm currently developing a sound replacement for Fallout 3, using high quality sampling and entirely made of custom content. I have just begun, but it is progressing very smoothly. I plan to remake at least all of the wpns and fx folders, as these are the most accessed by the game during usual play. I am doing this due to the lack of a good unique sound set for fallout 3, most of the others seem to be recycled, low quality, though there are some good ones, nothing here suits my taste. The emphasis will not be on powerful sounds, But more of a middle ground between the weak base sounds, and the overdriven, Again I have the resources to not need to sample others materials, so I'm trying to make it as unique as possible. I am also trying to future-proof the audio of fallout 3, as games have already moved far beyond 32khz and 44khz into 48 khz and higher frequencies. (far cry 2 for example, used 48khz audio) I do wish to know if there is anyway to implement a compressed bsa, due to larger audio size, or am I stuck with sticking them in the subfolder structure in data?

[Crowbennett08]

Hello, I'm currently developing a sound replacement for Fallout 3, using high quality sampling and entirely made of custom content. I have just begun, but it is progressing very smoothly. I plan to remake at least all of the wpns and fx folders, as these are the most accessed by the game during usual play. I am doing this due to the lack of a good unique sound set for fallout 3, most of the others seem to be recycled, low quality, though there are some good ones, nothing here suits my taste. The emphasis will not be on powerful sounds, But more of a middle ground between the weak base sounds, and the overdriven, Again I have the resources to not need to sample others materials, so I'm trying to make it as unique as possible. I am also trying to future-proof the audio of fallout 3, as games have already moved far beyond 32khz and 44khz into 48 khz and higher frequencies. (far cry 2 for example, used 48khz audio) I do wish to know if there is anyway to implement a compressed bsa, due to larger audio size, or am I stuck with sticking them in the subfolder structure in data?

 

Well, for one, as far as i've seen fallout will not play anything higher than a 44.1 sampling rate, and you happen to be talking about my most knowledgeable subject, i've been a musician for 17 years, and a producer for 6 years, as well as a FOH engineer and stage manager for United Artist Nashville for several years.

 

the difference of 44.1k to 48k is so slight that it would not justify re-doing the whole sum of all the audio for fallout 3. Plus, if you are making your own sounds, depending on your setup, and i doubt you have a studio that is acoustically sound(most people don't unless you are a millionare), your audio even at 48k probably would not sound better because of the environment you record in. In this case, a sample at 44.1k that was produced in a sterile environment would sound much better than a sample at 48k in a home studio.

 

For voice-overs this is not so much a problem, i've recorded samples on an AKG perception 300 that is damn close to sounding just like the vanilla voice-overs. But for gun samples, and especially environment samples, acoustic spaces, etc. it would just not be sufficient. Plus every time you double the sampling rate you are increasing the size of the files, and you need to take into consideration the quality of sound versus the amount of memory you will be using. In this case the small increase in quality would not be worth the memory.

 

Also, if you take into account the Nyquist Theorym, the 48k sample would translate back to a 24k range of audible frequencies(1/4 of which we cannot hear), as well as the fact that it will still have to be converted to 16-bit(which furtherly diminishes your audible FQ Spectrum). You are getting into the realm of psychoacoustics which really isn't at all necessary for a mod. Ultimately, a 48k sample will sound identical to a 44.1 sample, it would be a waste of time i'm sorry to say, but your head is in the right place, you want to make fallout a better experience. Why not use your talent to make new sounds?

 

Higher sampling rates are used for much more dynamic situations, for instance in jazz music(frequently recorded at 192 Khz), where players go from very soft to very loud. Or when you want to hear small nuances in instruments, environments, etc. most gamers wouldn't even have speakers that could accurately translate these nuances anyway. So unfortunately for gamers, high-end audio is still almost exclusive domain to big-budget hollywood films with 7.1 surround sound movie theaters.

 

I do have farcry 2 and the sound is good, Ubisoft is a developer that i've always enjoyed, and they certainly are trying to up the standard of audio in gaming by recorded all their audio at 48k, and they did do everything they could so one could hear the difference, but the truth is, if they had done it all in 44.1, it would still sound good and be just as immersive. I think more than anything their decision to record at 48k was a nudge to everyone else to step up engines (their farcry 2 engine is amazing!!!!!) to ensure that the next-gen delivers better audio, 96khz is the next logical step in this direction. Blu-Ray has 96 K audio, and there is definitely a difference to be heard.

 

next gen games will most likely have 96k audio samples.

 

Welcome to the Nexus!

 

CROW

[Pepper26]

Hello, I'm currently developing a sound replacement for Fallout 3, using high quality sampling and entirely made of custom content. I have just begun, but it is progressing very smoothly. I plan to remake at least all of the wpns and fx folders, as these are the most accessed by the game during usual play. I am doing this due to the lack of a good unique sound set for fallout 3, most of the others seem to be recycled, low quality, though there are some good ones, nothing here suits my taste. The emphasis will not be on powerful sounds, But more of a middle ground between the weak base sounds, and the overdriven, Again I have the resources to not need to sample others materials, so I'm trying to make it as unique as possible. I am also trying to future-proof the audio of fallout 3, as games have already moved far beyond 32khz and 44khz into 48 khz and higher frequencies. (far cry 2 for example, used 48khz audio) I do wish to know if there is anyway to implement a compressed bsa, due to larger audio size, or am I stuck with sticking them in the subfolder structure in data?

 

Well, for one, as far as i've seen fallout will not play anything higher than a 44.1 sampling rate, and you happen to be talking about my most knowledgeable subject, i've been a musician for 17 years, and a producer for 6 years, as well as a FOH engineer and stage manager for United Artist Nashville for several years.

 

the difference of 44.1k to 48k is so slight that it would not justify re-doing the whole sum of all the audio for fallout 3. Plus, if you are making your own sounds, depending on your setup, and i doubt you have a studio that is acoustically sound(most people don't unless you are a millionare), your audio even at 48k probably would not sound better because of the environment you record in. In this case, a sample at 44.1k that was produced in a sterile environment would sound much better than a sample at 48k in a home studio.

 

For voice-overs this is not so much a problem, i've recorded samples on an AKG perception 300 that is damn close to sounding just like the vanilla voice-overs. But for gun samples, and especially environment samples, acoustic spaces, etc. it would just not be sufficient. Plus every time you double the sampling rate you are increasing the size of the files, and you need to take into consideration the quality of sound versus the amount of memory you will be using. In this case the small increase in quality would not be worth the memory.

 

Also, if you take into account the Nyquist Theorym, the 48k sample would translate back to a 24k range of audible frequencies(1/4 of which we cannot hear), as well as the fact that it will still have to be converted to 16-bit(which furtherly diminishes your audible FQ Spectrum). You are getting into the realm of psychoacoustics which really isn't at all necessary for a mod. Ultimately, a 48k sample will sound identical to a 44.1 sample, it would be a waste of time i'm sorry to say, but your head is in the right place, you want to make fallout a better experience. Why not use your talent to make new sounds?

 

Higher sampling rates are used for much more dynamic situations, for instance in jazz music(frequently recorded at 192 Khz), where players go from very soft to very loud. Or when you want to hear small nuances in instruments, environments, etc. most gamers wouldn't even have speakers that could accurately translate these nuances anyway. So unfortunately for gamers, high-end audio is still almost exclusive domain to big-budget hollywood films with 7.1 surround sound movie theaters.

 

I do have farcry 2 and the sound is good, Ubisoft is a developer that i've always enjoyed, and they certainly are trying to up the standard of audio in gaming by recorded all their audio at 48k, and they did do everything they could so one could hear the difference, but the truth is, if they had done it all in 44.1, it would still sound good and be just as immersive. I think more than anything their decision to record at 48k was a nudge to everyone else to step up engines (their farcry 2 engine is amazing!!!!!) to ensure that the next-gen delivers better audio, 96khz is the next logical step in this direction. Blu-Ray has 96 K audio, and there is definitely a difference to be heard.

 

next gen games will most likely have 96k audio samples.

 

Welcome to the Nexus!

 

CROW

 

I see your point, I knew it wouldn't support 96khz, but I thought I could get away with at least 48. Well 44khz it is. (not that that's bad)

 

I'll have to rethink what I'm doing with this. I could still emphasize unique and not too powerful sounds, but most gamers love guns that go boom.

[Crowbennett08]

I've seen Mods that replace ALL weapons sounds, what i think would be super cool, is a series of mods that has individual mods to DL, that replace ONE weapons sound.

 

That way it's easier to install/uninstall.

 

I like the vanilla sounds, but there are a few realism mods that are cool. Actual gun samples.

 

How you go about making the sounds is an important aspect of what you are doing too. Are you going to be recording actual gun sounds? or editing creative commons gun samples?, or using audio programs to simulate gun sounds?

 

like i said, i like the vanilla sounds, but i'm a sucker for NEW weapons that have maybe a vanilla texture and a new sound. or completely new weapon models with new sounds.

 

i'm glad you didn't take what i said the wrong way, i'm definitely not trying to discourage you, if you are a musician you could also make new music for the fallout world, there are plenty of cells with DEFAULT music.

 

what's your rig you're working with anyway?

[Pepper26]

I've seen Mods that replace ALL weapons sounds, what i think would be super cool, is a series of mods that has individual mods to DL, that replace ONE weapons sound.

 

That way it's easier to install/uninstall.

 

I like the vanilla sounds, but there are a few realism mods that are cool. Actual gun samples.

 

How you go about making the sounds is an important aspect of what you are doing too. Are you going to be recording actual gun sounds? or editing creative commons gun samples?, or using audio programs to simulate gun sounds?

 

like i said, i like the vanilla sounds, but i'm a sucker for NEW weapons that have maybe a vanilla texture and a new sound. or completely new weapon models with new sounds.

 

i'm glad you didn't take what i said the wrong way, i'm definitely not trying to discourage you, if you are a musician you could also make new music for the fallout world, there are plenty of cells with DEFAULT music.

 

what's your rig you're working with anyway?

 

 

I was thinking about a custom installer, where you choose which guns you want. would need software or a coder though.

 

I could probably try to locate a nearby gun range, and take my md recorder, but the microphone is not very good quality and anything bigger would attract attention. I suppose i could try calling ahead and bring my laptop and equipment. the bb gun was easy, I had a friend who lent me one from his childhood.

 

I dabble in 3d modeling, but I'm a horrid texturer. I just can't use photoshop effectively.

 

Oh no, I understood it was constructive criticism. I hadn't even tried 48khz sounds in the engine, so I was getting ahead of myself. I also dabble in music, but the only way i enjoy it is when i use sonic foundry ACID, now made by sony I hear, but it's too simple of software, and when I make something I feel it's always missing something. the professional aspect of it or it just feels empty.

 

I've never been much of a knowledgeable hardware guy, but I do have about three microphones, my favorite I just broke however. (shot it with the bb gun by accident, then it fell and the housing cracked.) I have about three 500gb external harddrives, near full of my projects and recorded audio. A factory 003 with pro tools 7 that I barely use. A pair of maudio monitoring speakers, I like them as well, but I could swear my very old altec lansing speakers had better quality and crispness. I have some commerical libraries, but I don't think I can use those due to the license and whatnot. A used sony minidisc recorder, and microphone. Various headphones and earbuds. My base desktop that I use with audacity, goldwave, Audition, and pro tools, is pretty old and worn down. I got a newer laptop, but I only use it for college.

 

I am very clumsy, and I go through alot of hardware in a short time. I never try to buy anything too expensive or get too attached, otherwise i never use it in fear of breaking it. (like my factory 003) i probably break at least one or two microphones a month and two or three headphones, and It's all because I don't take very good care of them. I'm trying to fix that, but it's the truth.

[Pepper26]

Bump, with an update, I'm actually thinking about making this a much larger project, making multiple versions and styles for each gun, then letting the user choose at install time. This would probably take at least a few months, but I'm out of college on the 11th, so I've got plenty of time coming up very soon.

 

I also took a trip to an antiques shop, picked up some scrap metal, an old hotel desk bell (covered in oil, had to clean it severely.) and what I assume was some type of large ratchet.

 

end result is attached.

 

damn that 250k file limit: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=PWAZ9WS7

[Crowbennett08]

wow, i went to DL the file and the capcha on that site is really hard to read. idk if you know about sendspace, but no capcha there, and VERY large file limits.

 

 

wow, not bad, not bad!!! the samples are MUCH better than average, the reload cuts off a bit right before the bell, if possible, make it sound more natural and less jutting. Try spliitting the sample right before the bell, and do a crossfade from one into the other.

 

Also, the low end right before the bell lacks a bit of clarity, but all in all, this really is a great sample! if you can keep up this level of quality your project will turn out great!

 

kudos for you :thumbsup:

[Crowbennett08]

or am I stuck with sticking them in the subfolder structure in data?

 

in all cases, world music, sound FX, dialog, radio, ... Every single type has very specific requirements sample wise, and also they ALL have to be in the right folder or they won't even work. :( this does cause me problems sometimes.

 

--=Marcus

[Pepper26]

or am I stuck with sticking them in the subfolder structure in data?

 

in all cases, world music, sound FX, dialog, radio, ... Every single type has very specific requirements sample wise, and also they ALL have to be in the right folder or they won't even work. :( this does cause me problems sometimes.

 

--=Marcus

 

I haven't had too much trouble with specific sample rates for the sound effects in testing, but things that use an "lpm" loop (gatlings and throwers) do seem to require 32khz to work.

 

I've tried the minigun and gatling laser with a perfectly timed 44khz sample, and it just doesn't play nice. I've also been keeping a nice duplicate folders structure of the the original, had a few miss-namings but they're fixed now. also I went to a gunrange yesterday, they were actually nice about it and let me hang around and record. I did have to go through a safety lecture even though I didn't touch a single gun. It's some kind of law or lawsuit precaution.

 

For most of these guns, I'm using kind of a hybrid method. the non-combustion weapons (lasers and plasma and the like) are mostly synthesized, or based off a toy gun in one case (heavily edited). I even used some power tools for the gatling laser's base whir up and down. But I've been heavily layering and tweaking just about everything. the main thing I was having an issue with was the very slight clothing movements in the reload sounds. with my setup, I just can't seem to replicate this without losing most of it to background noise. My room is ridiculously quiet even with my desktop on. but the problem I have is that those subtle cloth movements can't be replicated without significant loss due to the room tone.

 

What I decided to do is keep the original file's cloth movements intact, but add my own clatter and mechanical sounds. It's actually quite easy when you use the original as a template.

 

I have run into a few trouble spots, my computer's sound card is finally starting to crap out, and it plays bits of static randomly, though this is only on my system, and doesn't appear to be in the files. It is still very annoying.

 

I've decided to do at least three variants of the original sounds, the first being "vanilla redone", sounds that are similar to the originals, but with more impact and a very audible difference between the originals. I'm considering even more unique, more realistic, and much more impact for the other two. Now my idea is that it would be downloaded as a self contained exe or msi file, and during install the user can preview and select specifically which sounds from what category and what gun they want. this would take a bit of coding so I will be in need of a coder later on.

[Crowbennett08]

What type of sound card are you using?