Chaotic Physics

[lee3310]

So after editing a workshop location, navmeshing and generating previs, i noticed that sometimes, when i load a save without changing cell, physics go haywire, objects start flying around and NPCs falling from the sky to their death.
I've seen this phenomenon reported by users on different forums and mods but i can't find any information on what is causing it so i don't know where to start looking in order to fix it.
Could be a corrupted object ? or too much scrapable clutter ?

[South8028]

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

[lee3310]

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.

I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.

PS

I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Edited February 16, 2023 by lee3310

[RaidersClamoring]

Probably a light, fleeting corruption of a save, barely qualifying as such. If it gets on your nerves ReSaver has a 'reset havok' option you could try. Be careful with ReSaver, some options can screw up your save even further. 'Reset havok' should be safe.

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/5031/?tab=description

[lee3310]

Probably a light, fleeting corruption of a save, barely qualifying as such. If it gets on your nerves ReSaver has a 'reset havok' option you could try. Be careful with ReSaver, some options can screw up your save even further. 'Reset havok' should be safe.

 

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/5031/?tab=description

I didn't know that Resaver has that option, i only used it to delete some persistant idle markers (stuck in the cell after scrapping the object like the PickMeUp station)

For the save, i just have to quit to desktop and load it again for it to work properly (weird). The bug only happens when you save/load without exiting the game.

Edited February 16, 2023 by lee3310

[South8028]

 

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.

I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.

PS

I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Depends on whether items and npc's fall through the world, or they fall through static objects with collision. If through objects - it means that these objects are placed in the workshop. npc and items (in ini settings) interact with the player beyond the uGridstoLoad radius and accordingly fail when the workshop objects they rely on disappear. The engine overrides everything that is outside of uGridsToLoad and does not have a corresponding permanent load flag. Real objects with physics are replaced by lods (if any). The collision disappears.Such is my theory. )

[lee3310]

 

 

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.

I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.

PS

I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Depends on whether items and npc's fall through the world, or they fall through static objects with collision. If through objects - it means that these objects are placed in the workshop. npc and items (in ini settings) interact with the player beyond the uGridstoLoad radius and accordingly fail when the workshop objects they rely on disappear. The engine overrides everything that is outside of uGridsToLoad and does not have a corresponding permanent load flag. Real objects with physics are replaced by lods (if any). The collision disappears.Such is my theory. )

 

 

Your theory make sense and most likely what is happening here. The houses were scrapable at the beginning but after generating the precombines, they became static (can't interact with them in workshopmod). I experience a lot of problem with the houses collision too when generating previs and some objets behave abnormally in the editor; they rotate on x/y axis without even touching them and when i try to move them they act like a gyroscope (i don't know how to describe it). The whole thing need some cleaning i presume (check flags/linked form... and also remove some clutter and test again)

Edited February 16, 2023 by lee3310

[greekrage]

the weird rota

 

 

 

 

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.
I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.
PS
I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Depends on whether items and npc's fall through the world, or they fall through static objects with collision. If through objects - it means that these objects are placed in the workshop. npc and items (in ini settings) interact with the player beyond the uGridstoLoad radius and accordingly fail when the workshop objects they rely on disappear. The engine overrides everything that is outside of uGridsToLoad and does not have a corresponding permanent load flag. Real objects with physics are replaced by lods (if any). The collision disappears.Such is my theory. )

 

 

Your theory make sense and most likely what is happening here. The houses were scrapable at the beginning but after generating the precombines, they became static (can't interact with them in workshopmod). I experience a lot of problem with the houses collision too when generating previs and some objets behave abnormally in the editor; they rotate on x/y axis without even touching them and when i try to move them they act like a gyroscope (i don't know how to describe it). The whole thing need some cleaning i presume (check flags/linked form... and also remove some clutter and test again)

 

the weird rotation and/or falling in a loop is usually because there is an element that has ragdoll in a group or scol.. I see this a lot when doing mashups/kitbashes when i unknowingly add something to a scol that has these physics. I saw it happen 2 days ago when i added an Anchor to a ship that looked like a static but when placed in the mix (scol) the whole ship would sink /rotate and drop in a loop.

[lee3310]

the weird rota

 

 

 

 

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.

I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.

PS

I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Depends on whether items and npc's fall through the world, or they fall through static objects with collision. If through objects - it means that these objects are placed in the workshop. npc and items (in ini settings) interact with the player beyond the uGridstoLoad radius and accordingly fail when the workshop objects they rely on disappear. The engine overrides everything that is outside of uGridsToLoad and does not have a corresponding permanent load flag. Real objects with physics are replaced by lods (if any). The collision disappears.Such is my theory. )

 

 

Your theory make sense and most likely what is happening here. The houses were scrapable at the beginning but after generating the precombines, they became static (can't interact with them in workshopmod). I experience a lot of problem with the houses collision too when generating previs and some objets behave abnormally in the editor; they rotate on x/y axis without even touching them and when i try to move them they act like a gyroscope (i don't know how to describe it). The whole thing need some cleaning i presume (check flags/linked form... and also remove some clutter and test again)

 

the weird rotation and/or falling in a loop is usually because there is an element that has ragdoll in a group or scol.. I see this a lot when doing mashups/kitbashes when i unknowingly add something to a scol that has these physics. I saw it happen 2 days ago when i added an Anchor to a ship that looked like a static but when placed in the mix (scol) the whole ship would sink /rotate and drop in a loop

They are scol indeed and contain some clothes in them and also books and vases... all with physics.

One mystery solved, thank you.

 

What's the best way to fix it ? break the collection and duplicate/edit the meshes to remove the physics then rebuild it or i can export the scol as nif and fix it as a whole ?

Edited February 17, 2023 by lee3310

[greekrage]

 

the weird rota

 

 

 

 

This is probably due to the physical disappearance of the meshes along with the collision outside of uGridsToLoad. Try to increase this parameter in ini. For the sake of experiment. In ck, for objects that exist outside the uGridsToLoad zone, there seems to be a "toLoad" flag, or something similar. I don't remember the exact name. When you move this object to the workshop, this object no longer has this flag. The lives of all npc's are hanging by a thread. )

Not only the NPCs, last time it happened, i was killed by the giant "Vim" bottle i placed on a shelf as decoration.

I remember people always warning about uGridsToLoad in skyrim but i will give it a shot and also look into the flag you mentioned. Thanks.

PS

I didn't mention that last time, it happened after i loaded a save i made during a settlement attack (many super mutant corps scattered around) and also my character got the brown face bug that i haven't seen in months (after i changes the skin texture). I kept that save cause i can't reproduce it every time (+ the bug never occurred elsewhere)

Depends on whether items and npc's fall through the world, or they fall through static objects with collision. If through objects - it means that these objects are placed in the workshop. npc and items (in ini settings) interact with the player beyond the uGridstoLoad radius and accordingly fail when the workshop objects they rely on disappear. The engine overrides everything that is outside of uGridsToLoad and does not have a corresponding permanent load flag. Real objects with physics are replaced by lods (if any). The collision disappears.Such is my theory. )

 

 

Your theory make sense and most likely what is happening here. The houses were scrapable at the beginning but after generating the precombines, they became static (can't interact with them in workshopmod). I experience a lot of problem with the houses collision too when generating previs and some objets behave abnormally in the editor; they rotate on x/y axis without even touching them and when i try to move them they act like a gyroscope (i don't know how to describe it). The whole thing need some cleaning i presume (check flags/linked form... and also remove some clutter and test again)

 

the weird rotation and/or falling in a loop is usually because there is an element that has ragdoll in a group or scol.. I see this a lot when doing mashups/kitbashes when i unknowingly add something to a scol that has these physics. I saw it happen 2 days ago when i added an Anchor to a ship that looked like a static but when placed in the mix (scol) the whole ship would sink /rotate and drop in a loop

They are scol indeed and contain some clothes in them and also books and vases... all with physics.

One mystery solved, thank you.

 

What's the best way to fix it ? break the collection and duplicate/edit the meshes to remove the physics then rebuild it or i can export the scol as nif and fix it as a whole ?

 

yeah thats the only solution or use something else... Its not that simple thought since it has to be done at a nif level (nifskope)... Basically take the nif remove the physics and then import it as a different model/static