The Evolution of Language

[Malchik]

Typo is a shortened form of 'typographical error'.

[Alanador]

That somehow seems painfully obvious now, thanks Malchik. :blush:

[karkarinus]

I first of all want to say that I hope Alanador doesn't get slated for necromancy on this thread, as I think it is still a very valid topic. More and more newbies are coming on here from all over the world, and surely have comments to make on this.

 

Now to my point(s).

 

LoveMe asked if we should "embrace this evolution of the language if it is, in fact, a devolution?"

 

Well firstly, "devolution" is a very relative term. English is the language with most vocabulary in all the world, with over 490000 words and another 290000 technical expressions. This would never have been true if it hadn't been for all the external influences on the language. We would still be speaking Old English or "Ug want food" caveman styley. OK, so it was forced upon us by the fact that we have at one time or another been conquered by pretty much everyone, and the rest have been conquered by us!

 

The Whereas most other languages say "paper folding", we say "Origami". Spanish only has one word for kneecap, "rotula" from Latin, and we can choose between the two depending on the context.

 

All this makes for an extremely versatile tool for communication, art, or just fun.

 

 

 

I am becoming somewhat cynical of so many neologisms cropping up in English, as I don't even live there anymore, but in at the end of the day, any language is a living, breathing entity, and should be allowed to flourish as such.

[KzinistZerg]

...

I'm not sure if anyone is using the strictest form of grammar anymore, although many people use different amounts of restraint depending on where, what, and with whom they are conversing

...

 

I use as perfect as I can get grammar when speaking, when typing in debates, E-Mailing, writing letters, writing stories, role-playing, or other similar situations.

 

Occasionally i resort to 'r u there' if i REALLY need to type fast... or to make a pun or similar.

 

I even tend to use some old-english expressions, too. Like twas, twere tis, twould, using would for wish, and such.

 

I've found that friends that are taking the same foreign language as you can have a good conversation about language. Try it sometime- it's rather fascinating.

[karkarinus]

I use as perfect as I can get grammar when speaking, when typing in debates, E-Mailing, writing letters, writing stories, role-playing, or other similar situations.

 

This is by no means a dig at you, KZ, but t'was and t'would and such like have apostrophes. Punctuation is also dramatically on the decline. So many people don't know how top correctly punctuate a written sentence. Altough I myself am not a great reader, I do beleive that the decline in reading is directly affecting young people's ability to not only read, but also to write, spell, and above all make interesting use of their language, whichever it may be. Spanish is the second language in the world for vocabulary, but they just don't use it. Too much hassle. Why say with 5 words what you can say with one? True, but where does that leave the rest of the language? If we are not given the opportunity to form and vent our imagination, it will eventually diminish and fail, leaving us as robots.

 

I won't go on any more right now, but suffice it to say that I hope the dreaded Larry Jotter can at least serve one purpose: to revive the dwindling imagination of today's kids.

 

EDIT: Censored the forbidden reference! You'll have the Dark Army down on our heads if you don't watch it. :P

[KzinistZerg]

*gasps at the horrible evil reference*

 

Really? I always thought it was 'twould, or 'tis, representing the 'i' in the 'it'. But that's not something we learn in school.

 

I also have to agree with the decline of reading and such. I'm one of the few poeple that really does read a lot and that's why I am considered fairly knowlegeable (<- methinks I butchered that word)- though I know that the more you know, the more aware you generally are of how little you really do.

[phawk69]

Right now, the English speaking world is in power in world politics, but for how long? Everyone wants to speak English, and so that brings some changes into the language, as other cultures massacre (in most cases) our language (which has so many rules so it can have so many exceptions). This is not the fault of those non-native English speakers, it lies with this language that has stolen from so many other languages. But I digress, what happens when China becomes the new super power of the world? Or Iran? Now suddenly hoards of new students are learning new languages. As we move closer to a global economy, we will move closer to a common language - it is inevitable (please don't tell Quebec, they think everyone will learn french one day, but France's glory days are all in the past). Don't dispare, don't fret, go with the flow. There will likely always be pockets of regional language, but these all change with time as well. The evolution of language happens because man changes, his ideas change, and new ways of expressing one's self are sought. Embrace the change, learn to love it and move with it, flow, or be left behind in a language void where noone understands you, and you understand noone, and any great thoughts you may have had die with you.

 

Hey, what's with the Fairy Sotter reference? I thought this was a decent place :)

[karkarinus]

Hey, what's with the Fairy Sotter reference? I thought this was a decent place :)

 

 

 

I humbly beg forgiveness for the mention of Barry Plotter. I was referring to the fact that hopefully the wand-wielding, basin-hairdoed little runt may yet prove to be of some minor use in today's society. At least it's becoming more fashionable for kids to read books and thus enhance their imagination and creative use of language. That, and the fact that maybe as they grow up they could move on to greater literary jewels like LOTR.

 

 

 

as other cultures massacre (in most cases) our language

 

Now there's a prime example of evolution: The word "massacre" has always meant to kill large numbers of people, but has evolved in recent years to also have the connotation of killing one person or thing in a dramatic or over-violent way. This has happened because people use the word incorrectly, and as a result society - and the custodians of the language like the Oxford English Dictionary - have no choice but to accept it as a legitimate meaning (although I still refuse to do so :rolleyes: .) Language is dictated by what people say, not vice-versa like in Spain where the Real Academia Española try to prohibit the use of certain terms. For example, "Football" is commonly termed as "Fútbol", due to the similar pronunciation. But the RAE want people to say "Balompié" being a literal translation of "balón" ("ball") and "pié" (foot). Although "Fútbol" is what people say, it is not accepted by the RAE as a valid word, and therefore doesn't exist.

 

Where the hell would any language be if we didn't embrace change? We'd all still be speaking Aramaic.

 

(KzinistZerg) (Really? I always thought it was 'twould, or 'tis, representing the 'i' in the 'it'

 

Ehem... Yeah, sorry KZ, you are right :blush: although you hadn't lncluded the apostrophes in your 1st post. :)

[phawk69]

Actually, I think it's great that kids are reading today, with all the other options out there in the audio/visual field, whether it's that geeky kid with the scar who-must-not-be-named :) or car mag articles that tell how to jack a normal truck up high enough to clear a Datsun. Use the language, don't let it use you. As for purists, it isn't working in Quebec, and it won't work in Spain. Isn't South American Spanish slightly different already? And I have heard the theories of one king or another having a speach impediment and that's why this is different than that.

[karkarinus]

Yes, Latin-American Spanish has been heavily influenced by American English. One quite surprising example is the verb "to leak", which officially is "gotear" (to drip) or "fugar" (to escape), but has transformed in recent years into "liquear" (pronounced "leak-e-ar"), a word that never used to exist, and would be completely shunned here in Spain.

 

Where would French be without "le weekend" or "un cheeseburgeur" ? Or English without "rendez-vous" ?

 

 

 

Interesting fact: the expressions "The sky's the limit" and "To turn over a new leaf", amongst many others, are direct translations from frases used in Miguel de Cervantes' Don Quijote, written at the beginning of the 17th century, and 'coined' into English.