Help With Load Order

[ArbPotatoes]

Some help with my load order? I'm getting frequent CTDs and occasional crashes on save/load.

 

Fallout3.esm

FakePatch_v1.5.0.22c.ESM

Mart's Mutant Mod.esm

EnclaveCommander-OA-Pitt-Steel.esm

HairPack.esm

RRCompanionVault.esm

RR5MoreFemales.esm

Tau Ammo.esm

Advanced Combat Armor.esp

RemapWaterType.esp

BoS_FOOKedition_Armor.esp

Outcast DX.esp

JessiCompanion.esp

RRGuards.esp

RRNoClothesRemoved.esp

RRWastelandPosters.esp

ACE2-0.esp

FieldJackets.esp

Real Latex.esp

FleshBurningPlasma.esp

NAPA-Sneak.esp

Mannequin.esp

DCInteriors_SewardSq.esp

DCInteriors_Mason.esp

DCInteriors_Georgtown.esp

IPip.esp

Crusaders Armor.esp

ghoulification.esp

japanese_armor_set.esp

ConsoleCodes.esp

Boat House.esp

Tailor Maid.esp

Tau Rail Rifle (MFC).esp

Tau Pulse Carbine.esp

Tau Armor.esp

hair_add_npc.esp

LongerDeathCamera.esp

blanket.esp

Sprint Mod.esp

Explosive Entry.esp

Echo_UseBothGloves.esp

WeaponModKits.esp

WeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.esp

WeaponModKits - ThePitt.esp

WeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Increased Spawns.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Hunting & Looting.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Tougher Traders.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - No Floaters.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Natural Selection.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Zones Respawn.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC The Pitt.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.esp

Mergedpatch29-9-09.esp

3EFdrgplate.esp

 

I have Operation Anchorage, The Pitt and Broken Steel but I extracted their contents into Data.

[csb]

Get FOMM if you don't have it, and ArchiveInvalidationInvalidated! Then get FO3Edit by ElminsterAU and Miax's great FO3Edit guide on how to use it -- it's invaluable for finding and then correcting mod conflict issues, and works hand-in-hand with FOMM (arranging the load order) to help you achieve the best conflict-free results to make Fallout3 stable and enjoyable.

 

Hope this helps.

[ArbPotatoes]

Get FOMM if you don't have it, and ArchiveInvalidationInvalidated! Then get FO3Edit by ElminsterAU and Miax's great FO3Edit guide on how to use it -- it's invaluable for finding and then correcting mod conflict issues, and works hand-in-hand with FOMM (arranging the load order) to help you achieve the best conflict-free results to make Fallout3 stable and enjoyable.

 

Hope this helps.

 

I have FOMM and AII. I've used FO3Edit to create a merged patch. Is there a way to use FO3Edit to find the best load order?

 

Also, should the DLCs be part of the merged patch?

[csb]

Get FOMM if you don't have it, and ArchiveInvalidationInvalidated! Then get FO3Edit by ElminsterAU and Miax's great FO3Edit guide on how to use it -- it's invaluable for finding and then correcting mod conflict issues, and works hand-in-hand with FOMM (arranging the load order) to help you achieve the best conflict-free results to make Fallout3 stable and enjoyable.

 

Hope this helps.

 

I have FOMM and AII. I've used FO3Edit to create a merged patch. Is there a way to use FO3Edit to find the best load order?

 

Also, should the DLCs be part of the merged patch?

 

Conflict resolution is part FOMM, part FO3Edit. When you see conflicts in FO3Edit, it is usually apparent who the culprits are ... and depending on how you want to handle the conflict -- determining which mod you want to be the overall "winner" -- will influence the load order you set in FOMM.

 

Then it's back into FO3Edit and finishing the process. The automated merge patch method works great -- it's certainly faster than doing the whole thing manually -- but it isn't perfect, because sometimes conflicts are a matter of preference more than a game-crash risk. Say, deciding which mod's eye color for an NPC will over-rule another's.

 

I've only come across one instance so far that stumped me -- because two scripts were conflicting and I'm not adept enough in GECK and with all the syntactical ins and outs of Fallout3 scripting to take two scripts and rewrite them (I'll qualify that with a big YET :closedeyes: ... I think if I can learn C# and Java, then this is doable).

 

In the previous case, I had to take Miax's Choice #4 in conflict resolution: uninstall one of the conflicting mods. So I did, until I'm proficient enough to fix the scripting myself in GECK and ensure that the needs of both mods are met by one script.

 

(Added after-the-fact): In resolving conflicts in FO3Edit, it's not necessarily a winner-take-all deal. Mod A can "win" 90% of the conflicts over ModB, and you can still override a specific record or two in ModB's favor -- as along as, ultimately, ModA and ModB are still functional and pose no game-crashing threat.

 

But overall, here's how I handle mods and their load order:

 

Following all the .esm files ...

 

1. Mods that change a specific aspect of the game, say Auto Aim Fix v1.1.esp, followed by Backpedal.esp ... No Karma Messages ... etc. These sorts of mods are the least likely to get clobbered and are usually safe up at the top. If they do get conflicted, the merge patch can definitively resolve who "wins" ... no real game-crash threat here. I've got a good number of that kind, and 99% of them haven't raised a conflict.

 

2. Fix mods. Small mods that address a specific issue with Fallout or one of the DLCs. Things like PittRepair.esp, UrgeRivetCityBridgeFix.esp ... etc. Again, they usually don't conflict with other mods, and if they do, you can decide how to handle who the winner is in the merge patch.

 

3. World-altering mods. Things like DCInteriors, ArefuExpanded, Shady Sands ... followed by other mods like those by Puce Goose -- NotSoFast.esp, HeirApparent.esp, etc. These can (and do) conflict, but by and large they are cosmetic conflicts.

 

4. Mods that add things into the world in various cells. Here I am on the lookout for deleted items that are needed by a mod in this category. Load order can help here. As can using FO3Edit to set the Deleted item to Disabled and sending the mod author a PM so maybe they'll fix it in their next release. Actually, I'm always on the lookout for "Deleted" items, because they are potential game-breakers if another mod is trying to do something with an object that is effectively removed from the game world.

 

5. Weather, lighting and other mods that impact the environment. These will sometimes conflict with some of the adventure or world-altering mods, but since their purpose is geared to an environmental aspect, it's usually safe (after looking at the conflict) to let them go ahead and override.

 

6. NPC mods. These can conflict with other mods who alter NPCs, I lead the list off with LingsPrettyThings.esp. Usually conflicts here are in the cosmetic-appeal-wins-out category in my merge patch. But you do have to make sure (like in Miax's guide example of poor Jericho) that none of the mods lose any special enhancement, like making Bittercup Essential and a derring-do follower sort who will join you as a companion.

 

7. Perks ... For the most part UPP, but a few that add things from DLCs, etc. I scrapped UPP Beverages because it conflicted with a few mods, and again it has to be a "merged script" approach that is beyond my current ability :D ...

 

8. Armor, Weapons and Goodies. These can have conflicts, but again, by-and-large, they are not game-breakers and resolving the conflict is a personal preference.

 

9. Mega-Realism-That-Change-The-World mods. I like these toward the end because they'll usurp the others loaded before them. Resolution here is pretty straightforward ... let them win unless it majorly breaks another mod (hasn't happened to me yet). They also tend to conflict. A lot. You resolve them carefully, making sure that anything that goes in the merge patch doesn't break the functionality of ANY other mod in this category. These can be game-crashers.

 

10. Things that need to load last. NCEyeDamage, No_Vats, Echo_UseBothGloves, CRBSOR (that's the horrible-acronym but great non-Vanilla race mod that let's you start Broken Steel) and ... ta-da ... of course, my merge patch to end it all.

 

Hope this helps you get an idea in how you want to approach things. :)

[csb]

Ack! as a ps:

 

I noticed these two things well after the fact:

 

"I have Operation Anchorage, The Pitt and Broken Steel but I extracted their contents into Data."

 

Why? Mods that need those resources will have set them as Masters. Otherwise, you're bloating your Data sub-folders.

 

"Also, should the DLCs be part of the merged patch?"

 

Yes, if you use the automated merge patch method as a starting point, they get added automatically. You'll need that, especially for conflict resolution for mods that use any of the DLCs.

[ArbPotatoes]

Ack! as a ps:

 

I noticed these two things well after the fact:

 

"I have Operation Anchorage, The Pitt and Broken Steel but I extracted their contents into Data."

 

Why? Mods that need those resources will have set them as Masters. Otherwise, you're bloating your Data sub-folders.

 

"Also, should the DLCs be part of the merged patch?"

 

Yes, if you use the automated merge patch method as a starting point, they get added automatically. You'll need that, especially for conflict resolution for mods that use any of the DLCs.

 

I had some trouble with the DLCs and after extracting them into Data it was fixed. Thanks for your help, I'll have a go at reordering it like that. But if a mod such as MMM tells you to load its master very early and its esp's last, it's wise to do that rather than putting it with other mods of its type, yes?

[csb]

If the DLCs were downloaded via Live and not installed from DVD, it is a great idea to get the utility that moves your Live things into your "real" Data folder. I suspect that is what happened in your case.

 

All .esm's (masters) will load first before .esp (plug-ins) files. (Correction: If you have them in the load order first -- use FOMM to put your .esm files at the top of the load order.) Yes, setting the order of the masters can help. In the case of something like MMM, when the mod author recommends loading near the end, it's usually great advice (MMM falls into my Mega-World-Altering category and would be near the end anyway).

 

Good luck and keep at it! Your perseverance will be rewarded with a less crash-prone gaming experience and a Fallout3 customized to suit your style of play.

[thatguy456456]

may have been answered somewhere else, but........i'm having the same trouble. i just got the game for my pc. i have installed a few mods, but i am having trouble with the order of them. i have FO3edit (or whatever it's called). i have all the stuff i need, and when it comes to modding its kinda like watching a monkey do a football ,funny but getting no where. i've uninstalled EVERYTHING and reinstalled it and nothing happened. i still get the same problem. how can i decide the order of the mods easiest way possible. like you're telling a 8 year old how to do it.

[csb]

See above for my "categories" of Fallout3 mods. Start FOMM, organize your mods in roughly the order I listed. Close FOMM (to save the load order).

 

Follow the FO3Edit guide by Miax ... especially the sections on conflict detection and resolution. After running the FO3Edit filter, take a look at your conflicts. Some conflicts can easily be fixed by moving things around a bit in your load order. To do that, close FO3Edit and start up FOMM again. Make the switches. Close FOMM. Start up FO3Edit and run your conflict filter again. Rinse, lather, repeat until you get rid of the ones you can through load order.

 

After that, you create a merge patch in FO3Edit. After FO3Edit starts, right-click in the tree view area and select Create Merged Patch from the context menu. Enter a name for your merge patch ... I use merge000000, where the zeroes are the date (e.g., 101909). Once the operation completes (it will say done in the Messages area), close FO3Edit. Start FOMM, check your new merge patch to activate it ... it should be at the end of your load order. Close FOMM. Restart FO3Edit ... read Miax's guide -- the section on creating a manual patch. Fix the conflicts that still exist using the guide's instructions.

 

If you have a lot of mods and haven't done conflict resolution before, it might take some time to resolve everything. Run FO3Edit in Master Update Mode (except those very few mods that explicitly state not to run them MUMified).

 

Voila, you're done. Go wreak havoc in Fallout3. Enjoy the less crash-prone game with all your cool custom content.