General Mod Compatibility and Load Order

[ProzaicMuze]

I'm experienced several issues with Oblivion that while not ultimately game stopping, aren't to my liking. I'm a perfectionist so I don't use mods unless they work without conflicts (that I'm consciously aware of: random items not spawning randomly on randomly generated monsters don't bother me too much)

 

My current load order is as follows:

 

Oblivion.esm

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esm (latest)

Open Cities Resources.esm

Armamentarium.esm

Mart's Monster Mod.esm (latest)

Mart's Monster Mod for OOO.esm

Artifacts.esm

TamrielTravellers.esm

ScreenEffects.esm

EnhancedWeather.esm

Enhanced Daedric Invasion.esm

++ROOT=====================

Unofficial Oblivion Patch.esp

UOP Vampire Aging & Face Fix.esp

++LIBRARY==================

ScreenControls.esp

EnhancedWeather.esp

EnhancedWeather - Enhanced Seasons.esp

EnhancedWeather - Darker Nights, 50.esp

MaleBodyReplacerV4.esp

RTFemaleReplacerV12.esp

Roberts Armamentium female.esp

++LIBRARY+1================

Advanced Water Modification.esp

Natural_Habitat_by_Max_Tael.esp

Natural_Vegetation_by_Max_Tael.esp

Book Jackets Oblivion.esp

Natural_Weather_HDR_by_Max_Tael.esp (Off)

++COSMETIC=================

emperorface.esp

AinmhiRace.esp

IDKRRR_Moira_race.esp

Cosmetic Compilation - No NPC Changes.esp

Soya 4 Hair Pack - English.esp

PA Eye Colors.esp

PA Eye Colors 2.esp

++WEAPON===================

Adonnays Classical Weaponry.esp

Crossbows of Cyrodiil.esp

Mithril and Orcish Weapon Sets by Ionis.esp

RealSwords - Balanced and Combined for OOO.esp (custom mod of all 7 races, changed NPC inventories, LL weapon tables and all item stats to balance with OOO)

tkRapiers.esp

++TWEAK====================

100% Harvest Chance.esp

Denock Arrows.esp

More Realistic Encumbrance.esp

RenCorpseMod.esp

++TWEAK+1==================

moremerchantmoneyv1.1.esp

++TWEAK+2==================

Living Economy.esp

++OVERHAUL-1===============

Oscuro's_Oblivion_Overhaul.esp

++OVERHAUL=================

OOO-Magic_Script_Effect_Fix.esp

OOO-Water_Weeds.esp

OOO-WaterFish.esp

Open Cities Full.esp

OCC-OOO-Patch.esp

++OVERHAUL+1===============

Mart's Monster Mod for OOO.esp

++OVERHAUL+2===============

Mart's Monster Mod - Additional Enemy NPC Vars.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Hunting & Crafting.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Looting NPCs & Creatures.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Resized Races.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Zombies for Body Meshes.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Safer Roads.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Durzog Addon.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Spawn Rates - Reduced.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Vindasel.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Foxes.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Dungeons of MMM.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Farm Animals.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - More Wilderness Life.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Extra Wounding.esp

Mart's Monster Mod - Friendlier Factions OOO+FCOM.esp

++OVERHAUL+3===============

TamrielTravellerAdvscript.esp

TamrielTravellers4OOO.esp

TamrielTravellersItemsnpc.esp

Travellers4MMMHostileFactions.esp

RenGuardOverhaul.esp

++OVERHAUL+4===============

Enhanced Daedric Invasion.esp

ArmamentariumLL4OOO.esp

ArmamentariumLLMagic.esp

ArmamentariumLLVendors.esp

ArmamentariumArtifacts.esp

Artifacts.esp

Artifacts - ArmaCompleteAddon.esp

FineWeapons for OOO.esp

RustyItems for OOO.esp

++MISC.====================

Bedrollsanyone.esp

HouseMapMarkers.esp

Map Marker Overhaul.esp

Packhorses v1.esp

Real Lava 1.3.esp

WarriorBandages_V2.0.esp

++MISC.+1==================

_Real_Lights.esp

Harvest [Flora].esp

MiniMap.esp

++MAGIC====================

SupremeMagicka.esp

++MAGIC+1==================

SM_EnchantStaff.esp

SM_OOO.esp

SM_MMM.esp

SM_UnlockSpells.esp

SM_Scrolls.esp

++MAGIC+2==================

Dungeon Actors Have Torches 1.6 DT.esp

Exterior Actors Have Torches 1.3 DT.esp

++LAST=====================

KT_CustomRaceFix.esp (Off)

Streamline 3.1.esp - (Off: Was causing fast travel CTDs)

++LAST+1===================

Bashed Patch, 0.esp

 

Non-esp Mods:

Improved Facial Textures (Installed 1st)

Natural Faces (Installed 2nd)

Danis13 Beauty Faces (Installed 3rd)

ArchiveInvalidationInvalidated!

Arrow Replacement Pack

Boss v1.41

Colored Enemy Health

Elven Map Redux

FastExit 2

Non-tiling Texture

Oblivion Stereo Sound overhaul

OBMM/OMOD support

OBSE v18b

Quest Popup Removal

Robert's Female Artifacts

Robert's Female Chainmail Replacer

Robert's Female Neckline (OMOD)

Robert's Male Artifacts

Robert's Male Armamentarium Complete

Robert's Male Neckline (OMOD)

Robert's Muscular Stock Clothing and Armor (OMOD)

weOCPS

Wrye Bash v271

 

 

Where given, I used the compatibility/requirements of ReadMe's to apply various meshes, textures and plugins. However, given the extensive list it is possible I missed one. Today I installed the full Robert's Body Replace Sweet and Armamentarium armor patches. That's where my problems begin:

 

I used to have the HGEC/ExNem/High Rez Tex suite before I switched to Robert's. I never had any problems with it, but now I have "Floating Wrist" syndrome. When entirely naked, neither gender has any issues. The sub-wrist area widens to align the hand and arm, but when wearing various stock armors the end of the arm shrinks and creates a gap. I've tried numerous load orders and Importing to the Bash plugin but I haven't fixed that problem. Either the Muscular Stock Clothing and Armor doesn't apply here or I'm missing another plugin that solves it and/or misinstalled it.

 

The neckline mods seem to have created an additional gap where it's supposed to smooth over. Now, when the OMOD is on or off, the slightest gap can be seem from an upwards angle on all races and both genders. Again, haven't found a solution.

 

Currently I'm experiencing 4 new CTDs (aside from the expected CTD that happens randomly because Oblivion is Oblivion every few hours):

 

MMM's Hunting and Crafting: prior to Robert's suite and Armamentarium, when using Fletching calipers on Boiled Leather, selecting the third option for Metal Studder Leather causes a CTD. Option 1 and 2 do not, but when closing the UI menu the same CTD happens. This used to happen with ALL crafting items from the MMM plugin, but applying weOCPS fixed the problem.

Now I can't find Fletching calipers at all to test if it still applies. I'm going to assume it still causes a CTD, but a new problem as joined it.

 

Streamline: when I applied this plugin it began to cause CTDs when fast traveling. The locations were not consistent, but it happened without fail within 2-3mins of repeated fast travel. Turning it off fixed the problem, but it returned after applying Robert's Suite.

 

Streamline: when I turned this off to test if it was causing the previous CTD, I began to have CTDs occasionally when completing wait/rest periods. It could be unrelated, but I had successfully waited/rested 5-6 times before the CTD from fast traveling and then upon turning off Streamline I CTD every 2-3 times. Typically it's been over the day/night change as I usually hear the sound of a torch being put away or pulled out RIGHT before the CTD.

 

NPC corpses: after applying Armamentarium, there is a 10% chance (can't be exact, but it's infrequent) that when looting a corpse I CTD. It's not any particular corpse, but as soon as I press my "Use" hotkey the game CTDs. I don't think it's related to items from those mods dropping on the corpse as I've successfully looted other items from the suite.

 

 

Ultimately my questions are:

 

Am I missing plugins that will increase compatibility of my current setup?

 

Am I mistaken in thinking what I currently have is compatible?

 

Is there a way to manually change the mesh files quickly to fix the wrist gap if it's not a compatibility issue?

 

Does my load order look solid?

 

 

Can't think of any other questions off the top of my head, but don't hesitate to point things out if I didn't think of it. Ultimately I'm striving for a highly stable setup so that I can finish the game once before I dive into the Official DLC, SI and the plugins from my current set that go with them.

[dezdimona]

General Load-Order Guidelines

Here are the guidelines that I adhere to, personally.

 

~ Unofficial Oblivon Patch should always be first on the list. The fixes are great, but most aren't essential, so if a mod overwrites them its not a big deal, and the fixes have the potential for screwing up other mods if loaded later.

 

~ Offical Content (DLC's) should be loaded last, until you complete all quests associated with them (that includes buying all furniture for the houses and whatnot). Once they're complete, they can be safely moved up in the list. This is especially important for Knights of the Nine, which will have some fairly major problems unless loaded last (unless you get the UOP for KotN)

 

~ Major overhaul mods (OOO, Frans, MMM) should be loaded near the end. That gives you the most complete experience with any of those particular mods. It also lets you carefully choose which other mods to load afterwards... only move mods that you know will conflict and that you want the changes from. For example, I have Improved Soul Gems below OOO because I know that OOO changes the icons of some of the SG's, and ISG needs to be below to show through.

 

Some people will recommend putting larger mods first, but personally I disagree. There are a number of mods out there that make minor tweaks, and loading after a large mod will end up completely overwriting a chunk from one of the bigger mods because of the way conflicts work in Oblivion (even one minor change will take precedence over the entire record... for example, simply tweaking the speed of a weapon can cause every stat of that weapon to be retained to vanilla levels if loaded later).

 

So basically, it stacks up like this...

 

Oblivion.esm

Unofficial Oblivion Patch

<Minor Mods / DLC's (Post-Completion)>

<Major Overhaul Mod/Mods>

<Mods that specifically conflict with overhauls and need to take precedence>

<DLC's (Pre-Completion)>

Note: If using Mayu's Overhaul Mod. I recommend loading it after OOO or MMM

 

 

Expanded Load-Order Guidelines

by dev_akm

 

I would extend this to include:

 

Oblivion.esm

Unofficial Oblivion Patch

<Weather/Environment/Sound Mods>

<Minor Mods/New Items/Houses/DLC's (Post-Completion)>

<Major Overhaul Mods>

<Mods that specifically conflict with overhauls and need to take precedence>

<DLC's (Pre-Completion)>

<Quests>

<Compatibility Patches/UOMP/Merged Leveled Lists>

 

And a special-case warning for Knights.esp (Knights of the Nine) -- you may not be able to move it earlier than some other mods (some people have had problems after moving it before OOO, for example).

 

That's basically the structure I use and I have 140+ mods working well together.

 

Another way of describing this (posted by DMan77):

....

Oblivion

unoffical patch

Deeper realism mods that add sights and sounds

added content like weapons/items

gameplay changes, like 'must eat and sleep'

The OOO type

the 'new begining' type mod..

maigrets...You should also follow Dezi's load order guide if you're new to mods. BOSS is good, but not foolproof. There are a lot of mods it doesn't have in it's database and they have to be ordered manually.

[malonn]

Ahaha the old load order guideline surfaces again. I hadn't seen it for a couple of threads.

[ProzaicMuze]

Yeah I've also already seen that multiple. . . multiple. . . multiple times. . . it would appear you post that daily on 10+ forums ;)

 

But I already adhere to that and then categorize it further as you can see by the Wrye Bash group esp's.

[bben46]

Here is another one you probably see a lot. We post them because many new members have not seen them yet.

 

Here is a link to Bben's Crash Help

http://www.tesnexus.com/articles/article.php?id=298.

[ProzaicMuze]

I looked over the article, but I don't think any of those are an issue. I'm a HEAVY graphics user for Photoshop/Lightroom/Dreamweaver/Flash and so I take great efforts to do many of things on this list already. I control programs that run in the background with Spybot, Ad Aware and CCleaner. I've also disabled ALL of the Windows security programs because who doesn't hate that annoying warning? (Save a customized Firewall of course)

 

I don't have any IM services outside of xFire and ICQ (both on manual start only) and I have my updater on a schedule, uTorrent on a schedule and all other "start whenever I feel like it" programs either programmed for sleepy time or not at all.

 

As you can see I already have weOCPS and I even have FastExit 2 which fixes the CTD on Exit Game. I also have BOSS which I use sparingly (only after adding new mods for the Bash Tags) and then use Wrye Bash to group mods and OBMM to tweak the groupings.

 

Didn't think about Prefetch though, so trying that and will update after an hour of mod swapping and testing. See if it helps :D

[dezdimona]

Ahaha the old load order guideline surfaces again. I hadn't seen it for a couple of threads.

I did it cause I know you missed seeing it so much...lol

[malonn]

Ahaha the old load order guideline surfaces again. I hadn't seen it for a couple of threads.

I did it cause I know you missed seeing it so much...lol

 

 

:)

[ProzaicMuze]

Since no one else has offered any suggestions, here's an update of my testing:

 

1st) Backed up entire Data folder outside of the Oblivion structure

 

2nd) Opened ALL mods at once in TES4Edit.exe using v2.5.3 so as to avoid all the renaming and TES4View hassles.

 

3rd) Because I have a Bash patch, I've decided to try a MUCH more customized and perhaps flexible approach to conflicts between mods. Applying the typical filter to everything at once allowed me to see what exactly each mod was supplying to every conflict and in multiple cases helped me figure out exactly what was going right or wrong. For example, BOSS created several conflicts when applying BASH tags because my Bash Patch imported items from mods that had Vanilla Oblivion settings. This would override the Mod between the Bash and the Vanilla cell thus creating some issues I didn't even know existed. For example, I had 100%Harvest after HarvestFlora. I had already edited 100%Harvest once to include the Animations from HarvestFlora, but the Bash Patch was using tags from Oblivion to override everything. I manually picked the animations and put them into the Bash Patch.

 

In this way I'm managing to successfully merge almost all patches. I can resolve every conflict TES4Edit detects to my liking. I'm not finished so I'm still testing as I go, but so far it's proved successful for many minor problems.

 

4th) Once finished I plan to go back through mod by mod and clean out the dirty edits again. Then open all mods one last time to see if any residual issues are there.

 

 

Let me know if any of you think this is a terrible idea or if I've actually created an unseen problem for myself that will show up down the road.