The Right to Bear Arms

[Balagor]

Problem in DK and I have seen in UK as well, that drunk misbehaving bullies, CAN do serious damage with just a 2 inch knife. People have been killed here by such knifes. On the other hand, the law is ridiculess, since such a small knife is easy to hide away for the one who wants to, and at the same time a indispensable tool, for the carpenter, fishermen, etc, etc.

Those who wants to arm them selves when they go out friday and saturday night, and are even ready to use this knife, don´t even think about those 2 weeks in prison. H::ll, they will get several years if they kill somebody with that knife, so what is 2 weeks?

 

@Aurielius

For your questions:

Hunters can transport their guns in a locked box (ammo seperated) in their car. They can also hunt on private property, but it need to be a certain size, wich I do not remember.

You do not need to own land, in DK we have plenty of public hunting ground.

 

I do think that the general opinion here in DK is that our law is simply too strict. I concider myself a peacefull man, have even been a hippie 30 years ago. I too wish that if a heavily armed robber stands at my doorstep one day, that I had a better weapon than just saying to him "peace brother"

[Surenas]

 

I do think that the general opinion here in DK is that our law is simply too strict. I concider myself a peacefull man, have even been a hippie 30 years ago. I too wish that if a heavily armed robber stands at my doorstep one day, that I had a better weapon than just saying to him "peace brother"

 

Sounds almost like a fetish to me... and a crying widow comes into my mind.

Lo - when you've finally realized the guy at you doorstep as "a heavily armed robber" it's, as a rule, already too late to produce your gas pistol. Why? Well that guy would probably have already the unlocked machine gun at the ready before you've opened the door... unaware...

To nullify the robber problem simply by opening the door always with an unlocked rocket launcher in your hands would directly lead you to Guantanamo or somethin, I guess.

 

Peace, bearded brother :teehee:

 

http://www.greensmilies.com/smile/smiley_emoticons_unknownauthor_lady.gif

[ginnyfizz]

 

I do think that the general opinion here in DK is that our law is simply too strict. I concider myself a peacefull man, have even been a hippie 30 years ago. I too wish that if a heavily armed robber stands at my doorstep one day, that I had a better weapon than just saying to him "peace brother"

 

Sounds almost like a fetish to me... and a crying widow comes into my mind.

Lo - when you've finally realized the guy at you doorstep as "a heavily armed robber" it's, as a rule, already too late to produce your gas pistol. Why? Well that guy would probably have already the unlocked machine gun at the ready before you've opened the door... unaware...

To nullify the robber problem simply by opening the door always with an unlocked rocket launcher in your hands would directly lead you to Guantanamo or somethin, I guess.

 

Peace, bearded brother :teehee:

 

http://www.greensmilies.com/smile/smiley_emoticons_unknownauthor_lady.gif

 

LOL, I don't think you end up in Gitmo for blowing away an armed robber, Surenas! And I don't think Balagor was suggesting a scenario, when he mentioned an armed robber stands at his doorstep, that (a) robber knocks at the door or rings the bell and then (b) Balagor opens door. More likely armed robber has already blown large hole in the door to facilitate forced entry....that's what would kind of alert you to the fact it might be a good idea to arm yourself.

 

And, as I understand, as a logical extension of the right to bear arms, certain US states have a "castle law" which indeed allows a citizen to shoot burglars dead, without fear of either Gitmo or indeed, Death Row. Sadly, in the UK, even hitting them with your handbag would be likely to land you in court.

[Surenas]

 

LOL, I don't think you end up in Gitmo for blowing away an armed robber, Surenas! And I don't think Balagor was suggesting a scenario, when he mentioned an armed robber stands at his doorstep, that (a) robber knocks at the door or rings the bell and then (b) Balagor opens door. More likely armed robber has already blown large hole in the door to facilitate forced entry....that's what would kind of alert you to the fact it might be a good idea to arm yourself.

 

And, as I understand, as a logical extension of the right to bear arms, certain US states have a "castle law" which indeed allows a citizen to shoot burglars dead, without fear of either Gitmo or indeed, Death Row. Sadly, in the UK, even hitting them with your handbag would be likely to land you in court.

 

Don't play hero in Homer Simpson fashion when somebody has already "blown a large hole in the door" (the rocket launcher mentioned above?) - cos that sounds like soap opera. And you'll indeed end up in Guantanamo if you have a beard, a rocket launcher, a secret canabis lair (peace, brother!) and a shredded neighbor at the doorstep (oops!).

 

BTW Hippie subculture and private militarism, that's already an oxymoron at its best, for one has to make a strange metamorphosis first, the shift from the former student Jeckyll to the suspect Mr. Hyde :wacko:

 

http://www.greensmilies.com/smile/smiley_emoticons_unknownauthor_lady.gif The Ultimate Face

[ginnyfizz]

 

LOL, I don't think you end up in Gitmo for blowing away an armed robber, Surenas! And I don't think Balagor was suggesting a scenario, when he mentioned an armed robber stands at his doorstep, that (a) robber knocks at the door or rings the bell and then (b) Balagor opens door. More likely armed robber has already blown large hole in the door to facilitate forced entry....that's what would kind of alert you to the fact it might be a good idea to arm yourself.

 

And, as I understand, as a logical extension of the right to bear arms, certain US states have a "castle law" which indeed allows a citizen to shoot burglars dead, without fear of either Gitmo or indeed, Death Row. Sadly, in the UK, even hitting them with your handbag would be likely to land you in court.

 

Don't play hero in Homer Simpson fashion when somebody has already "blown a large hole in the door" (the rocket launcher mentioned above?) - cos that sounds like soap opera in my ears. And you'll indeed end up in Guantanamo if you have a beard, a rocket launcher, a secret canabis lair (peace, brother!) and a shredded neighbor (oops!) at the doorstep.

 

http://www.greensmilies.com/smile/smiley_emoticons_unknownauthor_lady.gif The Ultimate Face

 

You can blow a large hole in a domestic door with a 12 bore shotgun, Surenas, a rocket launcher isn't necessary. I have seen a ballistics demonstration where someone fired a candle through a barn door using an old fashioned blunderbuss. Sawn off 12 bores are the firearm of choice of the criminal fraternity in the UK, and seeing that this is RL and not Oblivion, rather than pick the lock, they'll just blow it off. No, not soap opera, lady, RL - there are gangs in England who specialize in burgling large remote country houses, which frequently contain valuable antiques, precisely in this way. When there is nowhere surrounding where the shot can be heard from, it's worth their while. They tried it with someone I know, unfortunately for them, not only did they trip the alarm, they woke up the dogs and found out that even Labrador gun dogs can be quite savage in defense of their masters' property. The commotion giving said master ample time to unlock the gun cupboard and load his deer rifle while the wife called the police.

 

Please try not to be quite so dismissive of others in your responses, Surenas, it's not quite the way to debate.

[Aurielius]

@Ginneyfizz

I believe this is what you are describing, it's an excerpt from a judicial law review in my state, where only 34% of the state's population have registered guns .

 

"In Pennsylvania, a victim has the right to use non-deadly force in defense of his dwelling when, and to the extent that he reasonably believes that such conduct is necessary to prevent or terminate another’s unlawful entry or attack upon his dwelling.

Deadly force is authorized when violent entry is made or attempted and the victim reasonably believes that it is necessary to prevent an attack on his person. It is also authorized when the victim reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent entry into the dwelling by one who intends to commit a felony therein.

The rationale for allowing self-defense in these scenarios is based upon the right of inhabitants to be secure in their homes, rather than the right to defend property, as can be demonstrated by the law regarding defense of uninhabited property." --Pennsylvania Case Law Review 2008

 

As you can see the criterion is imminent danger, which is generally at least in this state, critically judged. It is not a carte blanche to go on a shooting spree because someone trespasses on your property. Seems fairly rational to me.

 

 

@Surenas

No US citizen can be tried in Guantanamo, it's not US territorial soil....thats the reason why (alleged) terrorists are held there. I used alleged only because they have YET to be convicted in either military or civil court .

[Balagor]

@All

The scenerio I was thinking is rather common in DK. We call them "homerobbers" in Danish. They knock at your door late at night, when you open, they´ll point a gun or a knife under your nose.

Ususally I don´t expect guests late in the night, nobody run out of gas either, they have cell phones and can call for AAA. So when it knocks on my door at that time, I AM prepared, with my 3 feet pipe in my hand. It is my reaction time against his. My pipe is just as dangerous as his gun.

The law says I am allowed to defend myself, but with no weapons. Pipe is no weapon before I use it as such. Here the law says, if I grab the pipe by coincidence, then it is not a weapon. (That I keep the pipe behind my door all the time however, is no coincidence.)

Actually the law suggests that I call 911. "Please mr. Burglar, could you hold for 20 minutes, please?" :blink:

[ginnyfizz]

@All

The scenerio I was thinking is rather common in DK. We call them "homerobbers" in Danish. They knock at your door late at night, when you open, they´ll point a gun or a knife under your nose.

Ususally I don´t expect guests late in the night, nobody run out of gas either, they have cell phones and can call for AAA. So when it knocks on my door at that time, I AM prepared, with my 3 feet pipe in my hand. It is my reaction time against his. My pipe is just as dangerous as his gun.

The law says I am allowed to defend myself, but with no weapons. Pipe is no weapon before I use it as such. Here the law says, if I grab the pipe by coincidence, then it is not a weapon. (That I keep the pipe behind my door all the time however, is no coincidence.)

Actually the law suggests that I call 911. "Please mr. Burglar, could you hold for 20 minutes, please?" :blink:

 

That is a very neat solution to the problem, Balagor. Most ingenious, if I may say. In DK you then have the same problem as we do, that even an emergency call (in the UK it's 999) will mean 20 minutes wait for the forces of the law to stroll up your garden path. Sadly, in the UK, the law would interpret your pipe in a much more wimpish way than in DK. If you swung the pipe at the robber and hit him before he had chance to fire, the UK prosecutors would have you in court on an attempted murder rap. Presumably it would be OK if he shot you first. Your response has to be reasonable, and the human rights of the robber take precedence over the citizen's right to defend home and family.

 

It's ridiculous, and the fact that this is the case in the UK has led to a spate of a particularly vicious form of armed robbery. The robbers will target the manager of a local bank or large store that has substantial cash or even bullion on the premises. They break into his/her house one night, and hold the entire family hostage. In the morning the bank/store manager is marched off to work by part of the gang, in order to steal money from his employer, while the family are still held at gunpoint back home to ensure compliance. The gangsters KNOW they can get away with it, as they are most unlikely to break into the house and be confronted by a gun toting bank manager. More's the pity.

[Balagor]

@All

The scenerio I was thinking is rather common in DK. We call them "homerobbers" in Danish. They knock at your door late at night, when you open, they´ll point a gun or a knife under your nose.

Ususally I don´t expect guests late in the night, nobody run out of gas either, they have cell phones and can call for AAA. So when it knocks on my door at that time, I AM prepared, with my 3 feet pipe in my hand. It is my reaction time against his. My pipe is just as dangerous as his gun.

The law says I am allowed to defend myself, but with no weapons. Pipe is no weapon before I use it as such. Here the law says, if I grab the pipe by coincidence, then it is not a weapon. (That I keep the pipe behind my door all the time however, is no coincidence.)

Actually the law suggests that I call 911. "Please mr. Burglar, could you hold for 20 minutes, please?" :blink:

 

That is a very neat solution to the problem, Balagor. Most ingenious, if I may say. In DK you then have the same problem as we do, that even an emergency call (in the UK it's 999) will mean 20 minutes wait for the forces of the law to stroll up your garden path. Sadly, in the UK, the law would interpret your pipe in a much more wimpish way than in DK. If you swung the pipe at the robber and hit him before he had chance to fire, the UK prosecutors would have you in court on an attempted murder rap. Presumably it would be OK if he shot you first. Your response has to be reasonable, and the human rights of the robber take precedence over the citizen's right to defend home and family.

 

It's ridiculous, and the fact that this is the case in the UK has led to a spate of a particularly vicious form of armed robbery. The robbers will target the manager of a local bank or large store that has substantial cash or even bullion on the premises. They break into his/her house one night, and hold the entire family hostage. In the morning the bank/store manager is marched off to work by part of the gang, in order to steal money from his employer, while the family are still held at gunpoint back home to ensure compliance. The gangsters KNOW they can get away with it, as they are most unlikely to break into the house and be confronted by a gun toting bank manager. More's the pity.

 

Yes, my response indeed is very reasonable, according to DK law. I will only hold a pipe if he holds a gun. Should he hold a knife, I will go for the broom

stick, :wub: since I can really get in troble if I hurt, traumatize the poor robber with a weapon stronger than his. No joke, this is the law. :woot:

[ginnyfizz]

Just the same as in UK, Balagor. At some point, everything got turned on its head and the criminal is the victim in our culture. At least in the USA there is some acknowledgment of the right of a citizen to defend themself.