Help with FOMM and crashes

[sleemie]

I hate to ask for help without first researching an answer, but I couldn't find anything that exactly helped although I've seen other people make posts about the same problem. I'm using the FOMM and I keep getting the infamous freeze ups. Right now I'm pretty much stuck in Rivet City. I'm tempted to scrap everything and just give up the Mods, but I've already beat it on the 360 and the main attraction to the PC version is the mods so I hate to give up on it. My son has done all of the mod-ing and really have no idea of what he's done. The only thing I can provide is a copy of the load order and see if that's helpful. I'm using the Steam version.

 

Thanks

 

 

Fallout3.esm

Anchorage.esm

ThePitt.esm

BrokenSteel.esm

PointLookout.esm

Zeta.esm

CALIBR.ESM

20th Century Weapons.esm

CFWRv3.esm

Mart's Mutant Mod.esm

Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow.esm

Project Beauty HD version.esm

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch.esm

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Operation Anchorage.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - The Pitt.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Broken Steel.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Point Lookout.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Mothership Zeta.esp

Project Beauty.esp

WeaponModKits.esp

WeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.esp

WeaponModKits - ThePitt.esp

WeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.esp

WeaponModKits - PointLookout.esp

WeaponModKits - Zeta.esp

WeaponModKits-Unique.esp

WMKAA12Shotgun.esp

Fellout-Full.esp

Fellout-BrokenSteel.esp

Fellout-PointLookout.esp

Fellout-Zeta.esp

Fellout-pipboylight.esp

Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow in Fallout.esp

Enhanced Weather - Weather Sounds in Interiors.esp

Enhanced Weather - Sneak Bonus during Storms.esp

EVE.esp

EVE Operation Anchorage.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Tougher Traders.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Natural Selection.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC The Pitt.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Point Lookout.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Zeta.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Project Beauty.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Project Beauty (HD Addition).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Vendor).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Containers).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Vault 101).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Talon_Regulator).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (TEST Container).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (NPC_Settler).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (RivetCity).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Slaver).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Brotherhood_Outcast).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Chinese Ghoul).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Raider).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (SuperMutant).esp

CFWRLoadLastEVE.esp

Choose your own hairstyle (load this last on FOMM).esp

 

Total active plugins: 61

Total plugins: 62

[mongrelarchitect]

Here's some copy-pasta from another thread in which leaving Rivet City was problematic:

 

A while back I was having the same problem while running a few of the same mods as well.

 

I managed to fix the issue by creating a merged patch with FO3Edit.

 

Try following the instructions found in this forum thread:

http://www.fookunity.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1544

 

 

Hope this helps. Good luck!

[sleemie]

arrrrrrrrrggggggggg still didn't work. I'm assuming it's okay to go back to my last save and try from there. I loaded and then created a new save and then tried to leave Rivet City and still crashes! I'm getting freakin tired of this! If i didn't just pay $60 for this stupid game I would just say F the whole thing!

[BadPenney]

It looks like the last two items in your load list both say Load Last.

[sleemie]

Here's my new one with the merged patch. The instructions said the merged patch should definitely come last. If I have two that say load last, what could I even do about that? Only one can come last. Would I have to get rid of one? In this case since the merged has to come last get rid of the other 2?

 

Fallout3.esm

Anchorage.esm

ThePitt.esm

BrokenSteel.esm

PointLookout.esm

Zeta.esm

CALIBR.ESM

20th Century Weapons.esm

CFWRv3.esm

Mart's Mutant Mod.esm

Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow.esm

Project Beauty HD version.esm

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch.esm

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Operation Anchorage.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - The Pitt.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Broken Steel.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Point Lookout.esp

Unofficial Fallout 3 Patch - Mothership Zeta.esp

Project Beauty.esp

WeaponModKits.esp

WeaponModKits - OperationAnchorage.esp

WeaponModKits - ThePitt.esp

WeaponModKits - BrokenSteel.esp

WeaponModKits - PointLookout.esp

WeaponModKits - Zeta.esp

WeaponModKits-Unique.esp

WMKAA12Shotgun.esp

Fellout-Full.esp

Fellout-BrokenSteel.esp

Fellout-PointLookout.esp

Fellout-Zeta.esp

Fellout-pipboylight.esp

Enhanced Weather - Rain and Snow in Fallout.esp

Enhanced Weather - Weather Sounds in Interiors.esp

Enhanced Weather - Sneak Bonus during Storms.esp

EVE.esp

EVE Operation Anchorage.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Tougher Traders.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Natural Selection.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Anchorage.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC The Pitt.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Broken Steel.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Point Lookout.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - DLC Zeta.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Project Beauty.esp

Mart's Mutant Mod - Project Beauty (HD Addition).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Vendor).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Containers).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Vault 101).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Talon_Regulator).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (TEST Container).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (NPC_Settler).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (RivetCity).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Slaver).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Brotherhood_Outcast).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Chinese Ghoul).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (Raider).esp

20th Century v5 ALIVE (SuperMutant).esp

CFWRLoadLastEVE.esp

Choose your own hairstyle (load this last on FOMM).esp

MergedPatch.esp

 

Total active plugins: 62

Total plugins: 62

[sleemie]

No suggestions?

[fap6000]

hahahhaha, sorry man, that's just foony. I'll try to keep this short for ya. The above listed mods are the largest an most complex mods out there. Also the ones that take the most work to fix. Then also when they were created they were never meant to be used together. For example WMK the general idea for it an the things that have to be done in order to allow that, is the very things that make it one of the most conflicting mods out there. That being Said WMK is a nice small simple mod. All of these mods are the highest quality, Fallout 3 is of the highest quality too, just about any computer system these days is of a high quality. Put all these things together an you get your issues though. Which doesn't reflect back on these systems/softwares creators, it reflects on the end user an how quickly they threw them together. It's simple math. Time spent in planning a fallout 3 build = less issues.

 

However when you first start out pretty much the only way to learn is to mess things up. You have to get seat time working with this stuff to get any good at it. Either get to reading guides an other information or just git in there an try some things. Even when you mess up you learn. Modding fallout 3 is great yah, and we can do just about anything. That comes at a price, which is down an dirty hard work at the computer. I can spit out a 6 page step by step list of what you should do, but it won't help you. The best thing I can tell you is that you have taken on a task which is beyond your current experience level. So even in the best cases the quality level you will have in the end result will always be limited by that fact. While also driving you mad.

 

20th century weapons, UFP unofficial fallout 3 patch, Project beautifiedz, WMK weapon mod kits, and MMM Mart's magic. These are the red flags, All of them except WMK can be classed as OverHawl type mods. Meaning they touch on just about 50% of the vanilla fallout 3 content, also meaning they conflict with 90% of the mods out there. While after about a year of modding fallout 3 I could produce a 100% problem free version of this load order in a few days. A person that has just started working with this stuff it would take about 3 days per Overhawl to fix, also with more fixes popping up as any new mods are installed. Which recently it's came to me that it's probably a better idea to install the overhawls last, so you only have to fix them once.

 

At any rate while you are just starting out, you will have better luck by using only one huge overhawl mod, then many tiny single mods with it, to produce a enjoyable end result, with the least amount of work. That being said, this easy to work with load order may only last a few weeks, an then you learned enough to try something else. In one case in my learning I put in the hard work an kept the load order for 6 months. Durring this time I was creating new mods, an learning more still. Now over a year later I can use any mod in any order I like, and make it do anything I can think up. But it took a lot of failures an grinding at the bit to get here.

 

I've done over 20 clean install load order builds of fallout 3 over the last year. From the start each one turnned out a little better, Heck one of them was a total failure. The biggest problem I faced was that most of the install was done in one sitting. So when I problem came up I was looking at a list of 200 mods for a single problem. Now days I'll just install the game, then test it in vanilla for a good while, which gives me a baseline of how well it's going to run, later I put the DLC's in an do it again. Time is spent here testing an tweeking, until I have ruled out the vanilla game an DLC and my computer system as a future cause to any problem I might face. Then for starters I come up with a overall plan for the build of a load order which centers around only installing small amounts on any one day of the week, followed by lots of time testing. So then anytime I run into a problem I'm looking at the last 4 mods I installed rather than a list of 200 as a root cause to any given problem.

 

Also I tend to download stuff an keep it. I'll create a folder on the hard-drive then sub-folders depending on what the mod is or does. This does two things. 1. I don't have to waste time downloading 2. I always have a reference to go back to for read-me's or backup copies. Just hang in there an keep on what you are doing.

 

 

[sleemie]

Hey there...thanx for long reply. Honestly, I don't even know how to set up the mods that I do have, my son did them. I don't even know the first step in doing it, like do you download each mod individually as a file and then stick them in a folder somewhere and then open FOMM and tell it which of the mods you want to use and what order to load them??

 

Anywho, I just unchecked all of the unofficial patches in my list and then I was able to leave Rivet City without it crashing. I haven't tested it out beyond that yet, but could the fix be that simple? Also, what will I be losing by not using the patches any more? If things work this way can I just keep on playing from here?

[fap6000]

Bah, from one user to another they all have different methods. Most of that develops from just figuring it out an messing up over an over. There's guides to it. Actually the best ones are all pinned topics here on Nexus. Because it's kept as current information, based off the mass of data one would have to fumble around to find in all these posts. It's also compiled into one place. All I can tell you is what I end up doing.

 

1. I start out by installing fallout 3 in it's own folder on the harddrive, out of habit, an in the tradition from back when we had problems with Windows putting security risks on things installed inside the program files folder. Then I'll get the 1.7 update patch installed either from downloading it or letting GFWL (games for windows live) auto update it.

 

2. I'll download FOMM, FOSE, GECK, GECK Update, FO3edit, FO3 plug in utility. FOMM (fallout mod manager) FOSE (fallout script extender) GECK (bethedsa construction set), Then FO3edit an FO3 plug in are advanced tools to do certian things. For example FO3edit will fix your mods to all run together even though they were made on different systems by different people, then the FO3 Plug in utility is the cleanest way I've found to take two mods an combine them into one, so the 255 mod limit can be passed.

 

---We use FOMM to launch the game via FOSE if it is installed. Also we apply archive invalidation a button you toggle an forget about. The moving around of the mods into a actual load order is done with FOMM. If you were making mods you use FOMM to unpack content from the .BSA archives. If you were making mods you also use FOMM to turn a .Esp into a .Esm. Then if you are having trouble you also use FOMM to copy the current load order to the clipboard in order for it to be pasted here in a help post. There's probably other stuff you can do with it too. Mainly it's used to make the load order an apply archive invalidation.

 

----FOSE pretty much unlocks the ability to make scripts that can do anything inside the game, maybe you want the player to fly or jump 50 feet, an other really complex stuff. For the most part you notice that the best mods will use FOSE to make things more easy on the player. But there's super cool stuff too that it can do. It's a must have, an quite stable. Out of the many things it can do, it also disabled GFWL (games for windows live) taking microsofts finger out of the pie, when it comes to our offline game being online just for GFWL anti cheat measures, which are not even needed inside an offline game.

 

-----GECK is used as a tool to build mods, as well as sort of have a window into the game world while doing so. It's hard to learn, hard to work with, but after a few months it's cake. Some players have had to have GECK installed as well as updated, to get fallout to run right, hence why you should at least install it.

 

------All this stuff get's installed in your bethesda softworks/fallout 3 folder, read the read meh

 

3. The only reason I go ahead an get all that stuff is because it's pretty much the foundation of the build. At this point pretty much I read the tweekguide to bring out the horsepower in the Gamebro engine which fallout runs on. It's old it's weird, but gamebro works. The tweekguide is @ http://www.tweakguid...Fallout3_1.html Basicly it starts with a basic run down of what each setting does, an then moves on to advanced tweeking. Pretty much you try configurations an then test them out.

 

----Key things to focus on is frame stutter, run across the wasteland an do a bunch of crazy stuff to see how smooth it runs, basicly try to make it crash, do stuff you wouldn't normally do, trying to make it crash.

 

----This whole process of a testing phase of the vanilla game, gives a baseline of how well it's going to run, as well are rules it out as a future cause to any problem you might face.

 

4. Install the DLC's an run the testing phase again. The order for the DLC's goes off the content inside them, DLC 01, DLC 02, DLC 03, DLC 04, DLC 05, which is how I know the correct order for them is The Pitt, Anchorage, Broken Steel, Point lookout, Zeta Because in certian areas they were made to overwrite the privious DLC as they were developed.

 

----At this point hopefully I have a 100% "known good" Fallout 3 build as well as my computer system. Which takes it off the table when I'm looking for a diagnosis.

 

 

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXMODZ MODZ I MUST HAVE MORE MODZ OMG RAPGH ZERG WOOP WOOPXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

 

FO3edit guide by CSB http://fallout3nexus...ile.php?id=9616

 

1. You can download an install whatever you want. The key is to create a folder on the hard-drive somewhere away from your games. Then in here you create folders an sub folders which ends up being a backup copy of the mods you got. Then you don't have to download it again, an can always go back an read the read me if needed, or re-install it. I'll keep them once I have them. After maybe 3-6 months go by I'd delete them an download again so that I get updated versions. But that's only if I'm going to make a totally new fallout 3 build by re-installing it. Then also as I install the mod, I move it from this downloads folder, into a folder named "already installed" following the same sub folders so I can keep up with it later on if needed.

 

2. I'll only download stuff until I'm bored of doing it. Which doesn't take long at all. Once I get to this point I'll start installing. You either need WinRAR or WinZip to be able to access the compressed downloads the mods are stored on Nexus in. Open one up an always manually install if you can. Which is opening the RAR or ZIP in one window, then your actual data folder in the other, this is to avoid overwriting high quality content with low quality, but there are cases when at this point I'll decide not to use the mod, based of what is inside it.

 

3. Where ever your data folder is, Betheda softworks/fallout 3/data you right click it an create a short cut, rename it as you like an put it on the desktop, change the icon to something cool like the icon in the fallout 3 folder. With it on the desktop now when you are installing stuff, if you wanted to just blindly overwrite stuff, just drag an drop it into that shortcut which will automaticly put it in that data folder, then hit yes to all.

 

4. I'd say start with a few mods, install them, then you open FOMM an toggle invalidation on (then forget about it), put the mods in order, Fallout.esm at the top, then the DLC in order below that, then any other mods .ESM, All the .ESP go after that, but keep them in order, armor with armor, perks with perks, places with places, an so on. Most of the little mods it doesn't matter the order. The big time stuff does though.

 

----come up with a load order, then launch the game, if it gets to the main load screen then the load order is good, if it crashes before even getting to the load screen you have a mod in the wrong spot. Once it reaches the load screen I exit out an go to the advanced steps below.

 

5. Open the whole load order with FO3edit, create a merge patch (but don't fix it yet) Save it, then open the whole load order up again, remember the merge patch too. From here I start at the Fallout.esm an work my way down the list, which I fix any conflicts. Anywhere I see the mergepatch mentioned I skip, because I know later on I'll have to make another merge patch if I install anything else, an that this particular conflict will be fixed inside the merge patch.

 

6. As I fix stuff top to bottom often I'll run into something that can't be fixed by the normal means, at which point I'll create a OverRide to fix it for meh. You don't want to add a mod as a master to another mod, it's dangerous. However you can add any mod as a master to a override or many mods as masters to a override. Just not to many masters per override. I try to keep them seperated. Like OverRide_DLC OverRide_Food OverRide_weapons OverRide_npc These serve to fix things that can't be fixed the normal way of making the spread sheet match, but also provide ways to use mods in ways they were never meant to be, like 6 mods adding content to one in game item. Basicly Overrides are created from right clicking something in the list or the view window, then copy as override into, or copy as new entry into, something like that.

 

7. I'll get bored of this after maybe 4-8 hours, but I've been doing it for a long time. So I do pre-games. Point at which I stop an go inside an test. Which would require fixing that merge patch. Then also maybe cleaning the mods "removing identical to masters" "setting deleted to disabled" Then finally master updating with FO3edit right before I play. Then run another testing phase an either adjust the fixes, or install that mod again an fix it again a different way. I pretty much play until I crash or the player dies, then duplicate the crash, if it's still there, duplicate it in a new game start, at which point if it's still there I fix it before I move on to get more mods.

 

8. When I'm feeling strong an wana do some more work. I'll download some more stuff. Then delete my merge patch, delete all my save games, Then use master restore to remove the master update. I tend to do the installs in single jobs. Something complex is for sure going to be done as one seperate job, install, fix, merge patch, clean, master update, test...

 

9. In the future I'll probably only install huge overhawl type mods at the very last point, because then I'd only have to fix them once, an test them once, because they are so huge they touch on everything in the load order. Also the fixing of these takes a few days work. So I'll be dang sure feeling strong before I attempt it, which basicly means I feel like doing some super boring spread sheet work.

 

10. If I get around 150 mods or so, there's no set number though. I'll start by merging optional .esp into their main .esp, then I'll do a pre screen of what could be merged easy. Using FO3 plug in utility to merge it. This is done along the way so I don't end up spending all day merging 250 mods into 100 slots at the end. Also when I merge I create a backup folder which contains the mods I merged. So that I can keep up with what ends up being merged into one file.

 

11. There are some mods I decide to RCM, short for resource mod, meaning I'll use my tricks to reverce engineer the mod, remaking it so that it doesn't replace anything or the location is moved.

 

12. You can download 5-10 Gb of mods sure an even install it all in one sitting. But it will take two weeks working 8 hours a day to fix it. Which reflects on the quality of your build. This would be of a very low quality, an if you are lucky maybe there's only 8 major problems, but those 8 are hidden inside 200 mods, rather than being hidden in the last 4 mods you installed if you had did it a little at a time seperated by long hours of super fun gameplay in your testing phase. So that you don't go mad. Those quick builds never last, but a well made build will last 6 months or more.

[sleemie]

Wow! That's a lot of info! I'm not really sure I want to put that much time in to it. I don't really need that many mods, just some weather and weapons would be enough.