Defeating Death

[kidwitthafro]

i'm interested as to what people think. If we could eliminate all aging, would it be wise to do so?

 

is overpopulation a legitimate excuse?

 

are fatalistic judgments in general a legitimate excuse to hinder said advancement?

 

there are animals believed to not age...hydras for example. is forcing people to die of aging (if you had the power to prevent it) ok?

 

if we could conquer aging could we not also conquer other problems as well?

 

would curing aging cause cultural or intellectual stagnation?

 

would we be able to handle the change not aging would have on law? (prison sentences for example)

 

is death good/bad for humanity?

[Zephyr2011]

Bell to the No.

 

Humanity is already arragant and over-self-valued as it is. We may be the dominant species on the planet but we're not dieties. You illiminate aging and prevent natural death you start playing God (metaphorically speaking, not meaning to affend anyone who is atheistic) and don't we do enough harm as it is? We rape the landscape for our desires and destroy countless species. Rather than ask is it right to let someone die from old age ask is it right to slaughter millions of creatures joust so we get some more exotic lumber for housing and furniture? for more cash in our pockets? for expansion outward rather than upward? for more resources we "need" rather than synthesizing them?

 

Death is what makes us human. What truelly defines us. How we live and who we are. What's "spur of the moment" and "reckless" without a chance to die? Who keeps in line for fear of destroying their lives? Without death we lose our humanity (however repulsive humanity may be at times) To become a biomedical Engineer (the field that could be responsible for this if we ever dare to do so [heaven forbid]) you are required to take several ethics classes all of which promptly smack you upside the head with a wet noodle saying "WTF are you thinking???" with the whole immortality concept.

[hoshi23]

you only conquer death as you welcome it in you-trying to fight it you end up like this society-a perverted/enslaved mind believing his images to be real-its neurosis actually-so try not to be a fool

[Balagor]

Absolutely no, and I can only repeat what Kronos says. And yes it´s true what hoshi says too. I welcome death, I look foreward to it, I am not afraid of it, I am curious. So I have defeated death. It is my friend.

[ginnyfizz]

I am very much in agreement with Zephyr, hoshi and Balagor here. Death is an inevitability, as is aging. I would agree with palliative care to ease both the aging and dying processes. For example, my mother has Alzheimer's, and due to a very enlightened specialist she receives the very best in available therapy - she is precribed galantamine, which is the top drug available in the UK - to mitigate the effects of the disease on both her and her carers (one of whom is me.) But it will not cure it, it is palliative. Likewise I applaud the work of the hospice movement with people who have incurable illness and are dying, sometimes their deaths could be agonisingly painful, were it not for the dedicated medical teams in the hospices, where the emphasis is on easing the path to death, easing suffering both physical and mental, helping people come to terms with their condition.

[kidwitthafro]

Bell to the No.

 

Humanity is already arragant and over-self-valued as it is. We may be the dominant species on the planet but we're not dieties. You illiminate aging and prevent natural death you start playing God (metaphorically speaking, not meaning to affend anyone who is atheistic) and don't we do enough harm as it is? We rape the landscape for our desires and destroy countless species. Rather than ask is it right to let someone die from old age ask is it right to slaughter millions of creatures joust so we get some more exotic lumber for housing and furniture? for more cash in our pockets? for expansion outward rather than upward? for more resources we "need" rather than synthesizing them?

 

Death is what makes us human. What truelly defines us. How we live and who we are. What's "spur of the moment" and "reckless" without a chance to die? Who keeps in line for fear of destroying their lives? Without death we lose our humanity (however repulsive humanity may be at times) To become a biomedical Engineer (the field that could be responsible for this if we ever dare to do so [heaven forbid]) you are required to take several ethics classes all of which promptly smack you upside the head with a wet noodle saying "WTF are you thinking???" with the whole immortality concept.

 

I do not believe that age increases or decreases someone's destructive tendencies. What does it matter whether or not we are destroy the planet or our children? And if as humans, we are committing all these atrocities, would it not be wiser to advance ourselves and become more? perhaps with more experience would also come the actualization that the world requires solidarity. Would it not be easier to make better decisions with more life experience?

 

you only conquer death as you welcome it in you-trying to fight it you end up like this society-a perverted/enslaved mind believing his images to be real-its neurosis actually-so try not to be a fool

 

although conceptually gratifying, is this a practical way to go about doing things? should i also welcome pneumonia? or any illness for that matter? we fight infections, so that we may prolong our lives. medicine indirectly fights death.

 

 

Absolutely no, and I can only repeat what Kronos says. And yes it´s true what hoshi says too. I welcome death, I look foreward to it, I am not afraid of it, I am curious. So I have defeated death. It is my friend.

 

Im not afraid of pneumonia, but i do not welcome it? is my analogy appropriate?

 

I am very much in agreement with Zephyr, hoshi and Balagor here. Death is an inevitability, as is aging. I would agree with palliative care to ease both the aging and dying processes. For example, my mother has Alzheimer's, and due to a very enlightened specialist she receives the very best in available therapy - she is precribed galantamine, which is the top drug available in the UK - to mitigate the effects of the disease on both her and her carers (one of whom is me.) But it will not cure it, it is palliative. Likewise I applaud the work of the hospice movement with people who have incurable illness and are dying, sometimes their deaths could be agonisingly painful, were it not for the dedicated medical teams in the hospices, where the emphasis is on easing the path to death, easing suffering both physical and mental, helping people come to terms with their condition.

 

Death may be inevitable, however aging may not necessarily be:

 

 

http://www.ted.com/speakers/aubrey_de_grey.html

 

 

There was a time when many of our illnesses were incurable. Had we just accepted it, our live spans would not be where they are today. There are many physical, social, intellectual, and emotional benefits to curing a disease. (which im sure you already know)

 

why is aging any different from a disease?

[ginnyfizz]

That's just Mr De Grey's hypothesis. I cannot see aging itself as a disease. It is a process which just happens, birthdays come and go with the passage of time, the grey hairs come and so do the wrinkles. You can choose to make yourself unhappy over the non-health threatening parts of the aging process (such as the grey hairs and the wrinkles), or you can choose to focus on the more seriously limiting parts of aging, some of which may be diseases in themselves. I for example do touch up the silver strands that appear among the auburn on my head, but would draw the line at cosmetic surgery - being pushing 50 doesn't scare me that much! But I would consider doing something to my arthritic knees, (now let THAT be a lesson to all you youthful sprinters and long jumpers out there...), as that would truly be of life enhancing benefit.

 

It is possible to accept and even embrace aging, and also the fact that there is no cure for death, at the same time as taking advantage of science and medicine.

[Balagor]

 

 

There are many physical, social, intellectual, and emotional benefits to curing a disease. (which im sure you already know)

 

 

Such as overpopulation, old people sitting lonely at old people's home, memory loss, etc?

 

No.

I would not say I welcome a desease. However I stated in another thread about stemcells, that I have decided that I will not tolerate implanted organs in my body (you need to carry a note about that here in DK). So no, I do not welcome a desease, but should I have one, I simply pulled the number, it´s my turn to go. That´s how life is. I will not try to change it. I have accepted it. Life is beautyfull, and so is aging. I have never felt better mentally since I past my 50.

[Zephyr2011]

Bell to the No.

 

Humanity is already arragant and over-self-valued as it is. We may be the dominant species on the planet but we're not dieties. You illiminate aging and prevent natural death you start playing God (metaphorically speaking, not meaning to affend anyone who is atheistic) and don't we do enough harm as it is? We rape the landscape for our desires and destroy countless species. Rather than ask is it right to let someone die from old age ask is it right to slaughter millions of creatures joust so we get some more exotic lumber for housing and furniture? for more cash in our pockets? for expansion outward rather than upward? for more resources we "need" rather than synthesizing them?

 

Death is what makes us human. What truelly defines us. How we live and who we are. What's "spur of the moment" and "reckless" without a chance to die? Who keeps in line for fear of destroying their lives? Without death we lose our humanity (however repulsive humanity may be at times) To become a biomedical Engineer (the field that could be responsible for this if we ever dare to do so [heaven forbid]) you are required to take several ethics classes all of which promptly smack you upside the head with a wet noodle saying "WTF are you thinking???" with the whole immortality concept.

 

I do not believe that age increases or decreases someone's destructive tendencies. What does it matter whether or not we are destroy the planet or our children? And if as humans, we are committing all these atrocities, would it not be wiser to advance ourselves and become more? perhaps with more experience would also come the actualization that the world requires solidarity. Would it not be easier to make better decisions with more life experience?

 

Let me clerify. I do not oppose extending our lifespans by curing diseases and lviing healthier lives because of diet, exercise and other such things however I do condemn the thought of nigh immortality by destroying death from old age completely. More life experience is one thing but playing God and making oneself only conquerable by war or disease not nature is wrong.

 

How is death different from a disease? The reason we die from old age is a process called apoptosis. The natural programmed death of cells. It happens when cells have gone through mitosis enough times that their natural cycle runs out. This is why we die of old age. This is why ALL things die of old age. If we were meant to never die. We already would be immortal. But look at the human race and the capacity for wickedness it has. You can't honestly tell me you want every single madman, dictator, murderer, and sociopath to live forever. Not to mention the fact that eternal life often is a curroptive force and would likely make them more wicked and others wicked as well.

[Surenas]

We simply cannot run away "in the terror of aging", cos eternal youth is a silly media myth based upon the fear of death and 5 years more really don't make an old almshouser more happy among a crowd that is already mustered for the lonesome final. We'd better fundamentally change our mindset to aging, coming back to a positive view of the family of old, the normal one, where everybody had a place to live and die in peace among the beloved and ... some respect.

What is the name of the Bethesda scrolls we play here? Remember? Ahhh - they're called Elder Scrolls... for they were written by the honorable Elders, not by saplings in front of a shady career like me and you...