Imperial Rule

[SilverDNA]

...well I've found an acceptable solution for who should be an emperor to that great empire. ( This solution would even more working in on the UN or a democratic government in my opinion, but it has been happed before and if such an empire would exist it would happen sooner or later if the old rules of kingship would be applied.) But as I came to the solution I remembered that someone (in my country) had the same Idea about 24 years ago and made a really good song (still popular) about it. And instead of giving you reasons in the normal formal way, I translated the song text into English as best as I could. In my opinion the reasons in that song are better than I could describe them but see for yourselves.

 

Original title in German:

Kinder an die Macht - Herbert Grönemeyer

(1986)

Translated into English:

Children to the power - Herbert Grönemeyer

(1986)

 

(Song text)

The armies of gummy bears

The tanks of marzipan

Wars are eaten

Simple Plan

Childlike genius

 

There is no good, there are no evil

There is no black, there is no white

There are missing teeth

Instead of suppressing

There's instead strawberry ice cream for lifetime

Always good for a surprise

 

Give the command to the children

They do not calculate what they do

The world belongs in the hands of children

An end to the melancholy

We will laughed to ground and land

Children to the power

 

They are the true Anarchists

Love the chaos, clear up

know no rights, know no obligations

Undiffracted force, at plenty

Impetuous pride

 

Give the command to the children

They do not calculate what they do

The world belongs in the hands of children

An end to the melancholy

We will laughed to ground and land

Children to the power

 

my solution = a child as emperor and a senate of children for the empire and I think no one has something against children. They are the future so they should rule to live in it.

 

If you are interested in listening to the song simply copy the original title into the youtube search line.

 

(and there is a newer version out there from "Christina Stürmer - Kinder an die Macht" if you like acoustic guitars more than electric..)

 

Hopefully helpful as always

 

SilverDNA

[Pyrosocial]

...well I've found an acceptable solution for who should be an emperor to that great empire. ( This solution would even more working in on the UN or a democratic government in my opinion, but it has been happed before and if such an empire would exist it would happen sooner or later if the old rules of kingship would be applied.)  But as I came to the solution I remembered that someone (in my country) had the same Idea about 24 years ago and made a really good song (still popular) about it. And instead of giving you reasons in the normal formal way, I translated the song text into English as best as I could. In my opinion the reasons in that song are better than I could describe them but see for yourselves. 

 

Original title in German: 

Kinder an die Macht - Herbert Grönemeyer

(1986)

Translated into English:

Children to the power - Herbert Grönemeyer

(1986)

 

(Song text)

The armies of gummy bears

The tanks of marzipan

Wars are eaten

Simple Plan

Childlike genius

 

There is no good, there are no evil

There is no black, there is no white

There are missing teeth

Instead of suppressing

There's instead strawberry ice cream for lifetime

Always good for a surprise

 

Give the command to the children

They do not calculate what they do

The world belongs in the hands of children

An end to the melancholy

We will laughed to ground and land

Children to the power

 

They are the true Anarchists

Love the chaos, clear up

know no rights, know no obligations

Undiffracted force, at plenty

Impetuous pride

 

Give the command to the children

They do not calculate what they do

The world belongs in the hands of children

An end to the melancholy

We will laughed to ground and land

Children to the power

 

my solution = a child as emperor and a senate of children for the empire and I think no one has something against children. They are the future so they should rule to live in it.

 

If you are interested in listening to the song simply copy the original title into the youtube search line.

 

(and there is a newer version out there from "Christina Stürmer - Kinder an die Macht" if you like acoustic guitars more than electric..)

 

Hopefully helpful as always 

 

SilverDNA

 

 

While children are more often kinder and better intentioned then adults, I'm not sure if a child emperor would work....Perhaps it could i guess, were he/she well taught on how to run an empire, and not to waste resources on toys for everyone. It would seem likely that a child has less chance of becoming a corrupt emperor.

Kudos btw.

 

@ihoe

 

I was speaking in a hypothetical manner, there was no reason to be so hostile

[Ihoe]

@Pyrosocial

me? Hostile? well that was sarcasm in a mature manner. I apologize for sounding hostile.

 

@Topic

a child leader? well, that's a good question, a child leader can become a great leader later on (king Shapur I the great inherited the throne when he was an infant) they are OBVIOUSLY highly powerless, with the lack of logical and management powers there is always a replacement until the child reaches a certain age. And replacements don't like substitutions in terms of power.

 

Also, a child only inherits a throne inherited by someone before them, therefore there should be a young leader needed to die, uniting the world (!) and the throne passed on from him to a child, as a child does not posses the power to manage political campaigns. Surely the young person doesn't want to die young for a dumb juvenile piece of his royal hide. And political vanguards will only put a figure child in charge for propaganda purposes.

 

BTW, corrupt emperors were good intentioned toy loving children once, who were tutored to run an empire.

[Aurielius]

Imperial tutelage has been a tradition extending back to the Hittites and Egyptians it requires years of experience to take control an Empire, however that is no guarantor of their intentions once they take the reigns of power. Caligula was affectionately referred to as 'Little Boots" and was widely acclaimed upon his ascension to the Imperial throne of Rome, his reign was one of the most bloody and cruel of the Claudio Julian line. I think that it is best stated "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely" , the list of benign Emperors is markedly shorter than the list of rapacious ones. Why else would the reign of Augustus, Hadrian, Vespasian and Aurelius stand out so? These men stand out because of the contrast of their rule to the other more malicious Emperors. The Roman Republic was replete with good and honorable leaders, the Roman Empire not so much so, though I am sure that if there were any surviving Carthaginians they might argue that point of view.

[SpellAndShield]

If you are an American (as I am) then you need not speak of things in the hypothetical. We have an Empire that spans the entire globe, in more than 130 countries. The seat of rulership is in Washington and it is ruled by varied special interests with close ties to the military. We are definitely a slightly more benevolent empire than those which preceded ours but generally speaking I find empire as a concept distasteful. Not many people know this as there is much mythology surrounding the founding of the USA but our country was founded as a nascent empire and overflowing with racist mythology such as that of the superiority of the Teuton...etc.

[Aurielius]

If you are an American (as I am) then you need not speak of things in the hypothetical. We have an Empire that spans the entire globe, in more than 130 countries. The seat of rulership is in Washington and it is ruled by varied special interests with close ties to the military. We are definitely a slightly more benevolent empire than those which preceded ours but generally speaking I find empire as a concept distasteful. Not many people know this as there is much mythology surrounding the founding of the USA but our country was founded as a nascent empire and overflowing with racist mythology such as that of the superiority of the Teuton...etc.

I would substitute American Hegemony for Empire, multinational corporations not the 'Military Industrial Complex" are the driving force in the nation. If there is a seat of power it"s New York City with it's attendant economic muscle. Americans like to perceive ourselves as benevolent even when we act solely out of self interest and are incredulous when this self perception is not shared. All world powers act in their own interest or they do not stay world powers for very long.

We have radically different views on the founding principles of the USA, the founding fathers were of British descent and used the model that they were familiar with a constitutional monarchy. We are actually the second British Republic the first being Cromwell's Protectorate, so if there is any hidden agenda it has it's roots in the Dissenter Tradition of that period. Unlike the Restoration we had the sense to remove hereditary power of kings permanently.

[SilverDNA]

<P>

First I only want to say that only picked up an 'old idea' and and 'old problem' the only thing I deserve for the post above is that I did a little work and posted one good comment at the right spot and as it seems to me with the right words because of the positive reactions.

 

</P><P>I have bad news in rethinking about the child emperor and senate and good news.

 

</P><P>Bad news first:

 

It seem to me that the discussion went into the wrong direction, when reading the following posts of my post about a child as emperor. And the only one to blame is my self, because I did not drive the argument fully in the direction I wanted. In reading carefully the following posts I've found out that the empire it self was more important in this discussion than the life of a single child. And this was not my intention and now I want to repair the damage I have done and apologize to my following posters for that and clarify the original intention to it's full intent. The original Idea is to bring a child to power of an world empire, but without harming the child in any means. There's my failure. If a child is emperor and rules till childhood is ended, then what happens to the former child emperor after his/her reign? Well I thought of that and problems of child stars came up my mind. What about the parents, how should they be treated? Can a child with this responsibility and former power, life on normally after the reign? No I think. It is nearly impossible in that way.

 

</P><P>Now there is the good news:

 

In rethinking I came up with a possible solution for that problem and still have a child emperor and a childhood senate. (But this was tricky and so is the solution all in all. No, it is not a completely new solution, it is something that was overlooked by me at first as well I admit.) YES WE CAN have an child emperor and a child senate with out harming the children in any social and psychological way I can imagine. For a Day! And is happening in a lot of countries around the world was well as in the UN once in a year. Everybody should see the drawback now. And I found out another interesting solution for this problem too. Can we make elections every day a year? I think there we would be hard pressed, but a supercomputer could. The system is simple the Supercomputer is watched by more than one programmer (three or more) and officials (at least three), all from different countries. Every day and the whole personnel changes completely. The computer election for tomorrow the next emperor by first determining the country and the then a child at an age of at least 3 or 4 in that country with the whole address where he/she lives. The childhood senate is elected the same way but not by the same supercomputer, but by computers in every country thous the country has an Representative in the senate. The emperor would be responsible to global decisions, the senate for local country related decisions. Now there comes the best part of it. A executive from the same country as the child (well studied in child sociology and he/she should have a staff at his/her proposal) is given the responsibility to go to every child thous elected with a decision list the on tomorrow day. On that day the Parents are Informed that the child has been elected but not the child (no pressure for the child). The child should be questioned in a proper, simple way for a child (playfully I would think best but not forced to make decisions.) The child should work in his speed and liking with the executive still unknowing what is going on. Answered questions/decisions are removed from the list for the next day. A decision from one senate can be only overruled by the decision of the emperor but a fair number of senate members can overrule the emperor. I Know that the names and address of the children must be kept secret from public to protect them. Yes I know that this would be a shadow empire, but I think a fairer one than this (ah... let''s call it) 'dung' we have all around the world now.

 

this time I hope that I'm failure free and again helpful in that matter.

 

SilverDNA

</P>

[SpellAndShield]

<P>

First I only want to say that only picked up an 'old idea' and and 'old problem' the only thing I deserve for the post above is that  I did a little work and posted one good comment at the right spot and as it seems to me with the right words because of the positive reactions.

 

</P><P>I have bad news in rethinking about the child emperor and senate and good news.

 

 </P><P>Bad news first:

 

It seem to me that the discussion went into the wrong direction, when reading the following posts of my post about a child as emperor.  And the only one to blame is my self, because I did not drive the argument fully in the direction I wanted.  In reading carefully the following posts I've found out that the empire it self was more important in this discussion than the life of a single child.  And this was not my intention and now I want to repair the damage I have done and apologize to my following posters for that and clarify the original intention to it's full intent. The original Idea is to bring a child to power of an world empire, but without harming the child in any means. There's my failure. If a child is emperor and rules till childhood is ended, then what happens to the former child emperor after his/her reign? Well I thought of that and problems of child stars came up my mind. What about the parents, how should they be treated? Can a child with this responsibility and former power, life on normally after the reign? No I think. It is nearly impossible in that way. 

 

</P><P>Now there is the good news:

 

In rethinking I came up with a possible solution for that problem and still have a child emperor and a childhood senate. (But this was tricky and so is the solution all in all. No, it is not a completely new solution, it is something that was overlooked by me at first as well I admit.) YES WE CAN have an child emperor and a child senate with out harming the children in any social and psychological way I can imagine. For a Day! And is happening in a lot of countries around the world was well as in the UN once in a year. Everybody should see the drawback now. And I found out another interesting solution for this problem too.  Can we make elections every day a year? I think there we would be hard pressed, but a supercomputer could. The system is simple the Supercomputer is watched by more than one programmer (three or more) and officials (at least three), all from different countries. Every day and the whole personnel changes completely. The computer election for tomorrow the next emperor by first determining the country and the then a child at an age of at least 3 or 4 in that country with the whole address where he/she lives. The childhood senate is elected the same way but not by the same supercomputer, but by computers in every country thous the country has an Representative in  the senate. The emperor would be responsible to global decisions, the senate for local country related decisions. Now there comes the best part of it.  A executive from the same country as the child (well studied in child sociology and he/she should have a staff at his/her proposal) is given the responsibility to go to every child thous elected with a decision list the on tomorrow day. On that day the Parents are Informed that the child has been elected but not the child (no pressure for the child). The child should be questioned in a proper, simple way for a child (playfully I would think best but not forced to make decisions.) The child should work in his speed and liking with the executive still unknowing what is going on. Answered questions/decisions are removed from the list for the next day. A decision from one senate can be only overruled by the  decision of the emperor but a fair number of senate members can overrule the emperor. I Know that the names and address of the children must be kept secret from public to protect them. Yes I know that this would be a shadow empire, but I think a fairer one than this (ah... let''s call it) 'dung' we have all around the world now. 

 

this time I hope that I'm failure free and again helpful in that matter.

 

SilverDNA 

</P>

 

Ausgezeichnetes Englisch! :thumbsup:

[Ihoe]

Well, the debate has really digressed from the topic, but I can't keep myself from replying to SilverDNA.

 

In your constitution, where the laws allow children to overlook a shadow empire, there are a few paradoxes. First, go ask a juvenile with the term "child" applying to them, and ask them what it takes to build an empire or any other form of question regarding empire or shadow empire, they mumble, now if they were taught the answers, they will repeat them like a parrot. They are unable to rationalize or develop any form of strategy simply because their mind has to grow. Treating an empire of adults by a child will be very flippant. Unless the Empire is made of children. And children will grow up and no matter how they were brought up, some will turn to badguys, some will be nobodys, some others will be naive idealists and others philanthrophists, now this child has to deal with both the nuisanse of badguys and the critism of idealists, is a child ready to do so? Since all the training that he has done is compatible to the mind of a child and he was not developed. Say, a gang goes on a crime spree and a swift solution is needed by the emperor, unless there is a chief of police and a child one to prevent corruption, and then it's also the same case. What will they choose, either a wrong solution Or the help of an adult, which will result in power being in the hands of the adult.l, thus making the power system corrupt.

 

Now I can't imagine a child choosing his loyal staff... Bobby, because he's my friend. Tammy because I like her, and execute Billy for calling me Fat...(sobs). Ofcource they will always choose wrong. And the Adults will choose fro them, and children can't hack computers now can they? Only educated people of 13+ age will do so, and they are not children, they are teens and a menace. Power bestowed upon a teen...

 

Without any offence mate, I think this whole Idea is Juvenile, since artists have a lot of influence on people who like them, this Idea simply became famous. It certainly looks good in a Good social system when we think of it, but unfortunately it is impossible in reality. No matter how good it looks, kinda reminds me of the hippiesof 70's...

 

Now, in a social system which has reached "Social Equilibrium", I repeat "Social Equilibrium" there is little to no need of an empire or especially a child emperor. Since all the systems are compatible, all the groups are compatible with the system, therefore a Simple UN will be enough as a Fringe between systems, and since they are in an equilibrium, there will be no conflicts, just like a bug-less or debugged program. I would be happy to continue this debate in the subject of social equilibrium, on the whole basis of a world wide Union or Empire.

[SilverDNA]

It's a theoretical answer to a hypothetical problem how the "hypothetical empire" could work in the here and now. And my hypothetical solution strongly relays on tricking an innocent child to give a simplified answer to the questions politicians argue on and on because in the innocent answer there is more often than not a truthful and simple solution. Look into the Innocent eyes of a child and the truth will hit you like a hammer back. (And the same goes for the answers of a child.) In my thought model there are up to 365 emperors a year (regardless of sex, nationality and social status. Those things that divide us, to be only human.) and a multiplication of up to 365 times the heads of the UN, but economical it is still less than the upkeep of the reality we have. It is a simple base thought model witch I provided for further development.

 

(A shrewed mind could even say, that we're modding us an an empire up here.) :laugh:

 

And in thinking out of the usual box I came up with a possible (and I thought acceptable) solution witch I tried to develop further to that what I had in mind.

 

I want to express that I greatly respect that you have another opinion/solution in your mind. Any critics to my thought model, helping me to improve it. I believe the thought model could be working. Thank you for your opinion.