spoiler "Being a Warden is NOT a Punishment..."

[SpellAndShield]

We all know that scene where Alistair has a temper tantrum over Loghain being made a warden. He says being a warden is not a punishment. Is it not? I strongly disagree!

 

First of all, you are almost never told what being a warden entails...what will happen to you; it is all done in secret.

 

More importantly, it is a "death sentence" (as Alistair says); you are sentenced to die a slow death od rot and decay by dint of the taint (to which you are not truly immune), perhaps madness as well....

 

Punishment, semantically speaking, implies something for which one must be punished and it might not always be the case that a grey warden is 'punished' but in the of Loghain it IS a punishment. He has been sentenced to a slow and wretched death by becoming a warden.

 

Once again, Alistair is off the mark....

[chibievil]

i strongly have to agree with you on that, i always wanted to hit alistair when he yells at me at that point, but never gotten the option to.

 

theres also one last detail he never mentions unless your in a relationship with him. 'its rare for grey wardens to have children'.

[danscott84]

I agree to a point, but I don't think it's entirely a punishment. I don't like the secrecy (sp) behind becoming a Grey Warden, but they are basically the special forces of the age. They should all know going in that they could die at any time, and that even during peacetime they will always be fighting something. And, except during the current time, wardens are held in high esteem. I get the impression that Ferelden is the exception to this because of the action by Sophia Dryden against the ruling king of her time. So whether they die slowly because of the taint, or quickly in battle, they will die. The punishment would be if they are conscripted and forced to join. However, even conscripted they have to be talented. Duncan tells the Dalish warden that he does is not because of charity, but that he thinks he/she has the potential to be a warden. And also in the case of the city elf, I get the sense they only conscript when desparate, like during a blight. He does not conscript your mother because there was no need at the time.

[CrapsterZ]

City Elf's mother wasn't around to be conscripted... I think.

 

Anyway, the Grey Wardens don't see it as a "punishment", when it comes to the taint. They see as a necessary sacrifice on their part in order to achieve the greater good. So no, it would only seem like a punishment, but ultimately they come to terms with it. It's a lot like giving something up (lifespan) in order to gain something else (ability to end the Blight). And seeing as how the Blight in DAO was ended within a year (compared to the rest!), it seems like a fair deal.

[SpellAndShield]

City Elf's mother wasn't around to be conscripted... I think.

 

Anyway, the Grey Wardens don't see it as a "punishment", when it comes to the taint. They see as a necessary sacrifice on their part in order to achieve the greater good. So no, it would only seem like a punishment, but ultimately they come to terms with it. It's a lot like giving something up (lifespan) in order to gain something else (ability to end the Blight). And seeing as how the Blight in DAO was ended within a year (compared to the rest!), it seems like a fair deal.

 

It sure ain't no reward.

[Shacary]

depends on how you view it, Like Zev alluded to, Death happens, if not by disease, famines or wars, then darkspawn or predators like Vaughn. I think all the groups, the one that might mind the worst would be the noble families, since they have the ability to expect more of the good life so to speak, the other origins... well the dalish is dead if not becomign a gw, so in that case it extends their lives.

For the city elf, he did not take her Mother, not becuz she was dead, but becus Valendrian urged him not to, that she belonged with her family . She was killed by a human whilst in the city, who knows mb Vaughns dad was a predator too?! But honestly what life coudl she expect having killed that rat Bas..... I mean, not much, the GW might seperate her from loved ones , but it is a chance to live beyond anything she might have expected, especially since her betrothed passed on at the same time.

the casteless? same thing, I was like YA take me away Duncan, however sad i was at leaving my sis, [ wished we had the option to take her with us and mb deposit her in some place on the surface.] o well.

the noble dwarf really had no choice either, death then or later down the road if she survived the blight, i think the humans same boat.

And for those that were hungry, poor, kinless, and hopeless of betterment,. well its a godsend. And not a punishment at all.

Im sorry I still feel that Alistair's reaction to making Loghain a GW is appropiate. He trusts and Loves you and u betray the GW family, as riordan said , defend one another , like kin in paraphrasing. He is reacting to the betrayal u perform, the his hero / mentor Duncan, the lives of all those loghain sacrificed as tho they were lil more than pieces of dirt, those he sold and tortured , the HN's murdered kin, crow assassination and the killing of the king! Lets not forget that he himself hired Jowan to poison Eamon. O no, Hitler might have been a great leader once, but that does not excuse him for his heinous warcrimes . { add anyone in there that has historical connotations, of similar atrocities. }

still it is a game and there are no wrong choices , but ALISTAIR Rulez! lol [ totally a fangirl! wish my boyfriend could talk like him! ,mmmmmmmmmm!]

[danscott84]

City Elf's mother wasn't around to be conscripted... I think.

 

Anyway, the Grey Wardens don't see it as a "punishment", when it comes to the taint. They see as a necessary sacrifice on their part in order to achieve the greater good. So no, it would only seem like a punishment, but ultimately they come to terms with it. It's a lot like giving something up (lifespan) in order to gain something else (ability to end the Blight). And seeing as how the Blight in DAO was ended within a year (compared to the rest!), it seems like a fair deal.

 

Next time you play as a city elf, talk to Duncan before going to the wedding ceremony. He tells you Valendrian persuaded Duncan not to conscript you mother, and that since there was no blight and no urgency he capitulated. This is also where you find out that your skills are known outside the alienage.

[RustyBlade]

City Elf's mother wasn't around to be conscripted... I think.

 

Anyway, the Grey Wardens don't see it as a "punishment", when it comes to the taint. They see as a necessary sacrifice on their part in order to achieve the greater good. So no, it would only seem like a punishment, but ultimately they come to terms with it. It's a lot like giving something up (lifespan) in order to gain something else (ability to end the Blight). And seeing as how the Blight in DAO was ended within a year (compared to the rest!), it seems like a fair deal.

 

Next time you play as a city elf, talk to Duncan before going to the wedding ceremony. He tells you Valendrian persuaded Duncan not to conscript you mother, and that since there was no blight and no urgency he capitulated. This is also where you find out that your skills are known outside the alienage.

 

For even more details, talk to Duncan again before going to kill Vaughn and then talk to Valendrian. Valendrian will all but kiss your backside trying to apologize for meddling. He thought that since it worked with the CE's mom that it would work for the CE-PC and was not expecting the consequences of his meddling to be so dire.

 

*wonders if Valendrian can be kicked in the lake... :whistling:

[SpellAndShield]

depends on how you view it, Like Zev alluded to, Death happens, if not by disease, famines or wars, then darkspawn or predators like Vaughn. I think all the groups, the one that might mind the worst would be the noble families, since they have the ability to expect more of the good life so to speak, the other origins... well the dalish is dead if not becomign a gw, so in that case it extends their lives.

For the city elf, he did not take her Mother, not becuz she was dead, but becus Valendrian urged him not to, that she belonged with her family . She was killed by a human whilst in the city, who knows mb Vaughns dad was a predator too?! But honestly what life coudl she expect having killed that rat Bas..... I mean, not much, the GW might seperate her from loved ones , but it is a chance to live beyond anything she might have expected, especially since her betrothed passed on at the same time.

the casteless? same thing, I was like YA take me away Duncan, however sad i was at leaving my sis, [ wished we had the option to take her with us and mb deposit her in some place on the surface.] o well.

the noble dwarf really had no choice either, death then or later down the road if she survived the blight, i think the humans same boat.

And for those that were hungry, poor, kinless, and hopeless of betterment,. well its a godsend. And not a punishment at all.

Im sorry I still feel that Alistair's reaction to making Loghain a GW is appropiate. He trusts and Loves you and u betray the GW family, as riordan said , defend one another , like kin in paraphrasing. He is reacting to the betrayal u perform, the his hero / mentor Duncan, the lives of all those loghain sacrificed as tho they were lil more than pieces of dirt, those he sold and tortured , the HN's murdered kin, crow assassination and the killing of the king! Lets not forget that he himself hired Jowan to poison Eamon. O no, Hitler might have been a great leader once, but that does not excuse him for his heinous warcrimes . { add anyone in there that has historical connotations, of similar atrocities. }

still it is a game and there are no wrong choices , but ALISTAIR Rulez! lol [ totally a fangirl! wish my boyfriend could talk like him! ,mmmmmmmmmm!]

 

Why does it always seem that the staunchest supporters of pretty boy Alistair are women? :whistling:

 

I think Alistair has good qualities but I also see the bad; he is self-involved, whingy, etc.

 

Death happens sure, but there are different ways of dying and some are worse than others. Rotting away from the darkspawn taint is one of the worse ones....

[RustyBlade]

Every form of refuge has its price. The wardens don't wait to rot away from the taint, they go to the deep roads and die in a glorious battle. Job has its upside too, you get to watch that b**** Isolde die at the hands of a blood mage, you get to be a hero, you get the respect (or at the very least fear) of all, you get to have sex with most of the party while Alistair remains a virgin, you get kisses from pretty maidens, etc. Could be a lot worse, you could be stuck as a casteless, you could be made tranquil, you could be rotting in a Denerim dungeon, you could be slowly carved up and eaten by darkspawn, etc.

 

Is the glass half full, half empty or just the wrong size glass?