Is America becoming Socialist ?

[Burnagirl]

Is the United States beginning to adopt European Socialism ... whereby the "State" takes care of it's population, like health issues as a prime example ?

You watch a movie like "Sicko", in which you cannot but cheer a nation like France (especially) and the other European nations for taking care of

their people.

But on the other hand you watch baffled as the richest nation on earth ignores it's people and let's them fend for themselves.

Well with the current President that seems to be changing.

 

President Obama - the "Peoples President" - is trying to alleviate the suffering of the common man in the US of A ... yippee, I hear you say but on the flip side of the coin

his Wall street friends who are running the countries finances are sinking the nation further into debt.

 

Is paying higher taxes to support someone elses health problems really your problem or should they pay for it themselves ?

Because this is the root of socialism - you taking care of your neighbor.

Do you trust your politicians enough with the way they are currently spending your money to take more of your money ?

Also is European socialism all that bad, after all, you've got to take care of each other right ?

But how far should you have to go ?

Is there perhaps another way where you can have your cake and eat it ?

Lastly, is a Socialist America a bad thing ?

 

A footnote :

 

Believe me if they start with one socialist program you can be sure that there will be more to follow and you will pay for it one way or the other.

 

I'm not an American but after you look at how the current worldwide economic crisis began you cannot help but wonder as to whether or not the

New Administration is going to break the back of the world economy or not .... perhaps if that happens then the Euro might just rise to the

occasion and become the "new worldwide currency of trade".

As a business woman it makes me think ... wtf.

[Surenas]

Depends on your understanding of socialism in general and European socialism in special.

For me as a European it's out of the question. A chimera.

 

 

Take your protein pills, boys

http://www.abload.de/img/anne9hol.gif

[ginnyfizz]

It's quite simple. The cost of social welfare programmes/Socialist government has a habit of running out of control. It certainly has in Britain where we are more or less bankrupt and facing savage cuts to keep afloat. It's all lovely in theory, but in practice I cannot see Americans putting up with the level of taxation that would be needed to keep Obama's Socialist oriented programmes going. So in theory yes, if Obama was allowed to carry on as he has done America could become Socialist, but with a bit of luck he will get caned too hard at the mid-terms to do much more damage.

[Burnagirl]

Depends on your understanding of socialism in general and European socialism in special.

For me as a European it's out of the question. A chimera.

 

 

Take your protein pills, boys

http://www.abload.de/img/anne9hol.gif

 

Absolutely agreed, the United States should do everything in it's power to resist this poisoned carrot.

 

South Africa is currently facing and has faced a massive amount of socialist issues where you find that a mere 5 to 10 percent of the nation

is now carrying the rest.

Most of the skilled professionals have left the country and the influx of over 4 to 5 million illegal migrants have left the limited amount of jobs

for the locals a near perfect zero.

The failed Socialist governments of Angola and Mozambique have left their nations in ruin and the dictatorship to our north - Zimbabwe - has

all but driven itself into the grave ... it's no wonder that South Africa calls it the "long-drop" (toilet) of Africa.

The rest of Sub-Saharan Africa is trying to get into our country but there is only so much honey to go around.

[Paxan_1]

This is a question you can't answer in a general way. I'm German so i have my personal point of view and i think these health care program is a very good thing.

 

Btw, i think in a social country (not socialist!) all people have the right for a human an liveable life and it should be a kind of responsibility of the "rich" people to support the "poor". Don't get this wrong, i'm a wealthy girl and i don't need to take much care of money, but it is okay for me if i have to pay more tax in percent than a worker with a yearly income of 20000€ or less.

We are living together in one country and in one world.

 

Like Bob Ritter in Clear and Present Danger said:

Gray! The world is gray, Jack!

[Balagor]

You might as well ask; "Would North Corea go capitalistic"? Lol

well, I am not American, but I do know American cultur this far, that I would say "No". As far as I know, America was build by pioneers, and on the foundation that you take care of your self. I do not say Americans do not help each other, and others, on the contrary, they do indeed. To my knowledge from friends who have been there, Americans are very caring and helpfull, when needed, but they don`t like controlled aid, caring or sharing forced upon them by a goverment. So even when Mr. Obama has good intentions, he needs to turn the minds of the Americans, and that, I think, can not be done during a presidency. Not even 4 more years.

[Burnagirl]

This is a question you can't answer in a general way. I'm German so i have my personal point of view and i think these health care program is a very good thing.

 

Btw, i think in a social country (not socialist!) all people have the right for a human an liveable life and it should be a kind of responsibility of the "rich" people to support the "poor". Don't get this wrong, i'm a wealthy girl and i don't need to take much care of money, but it is okay for me if i have to pay more tax in percent than a worker with a yearly income of 20000€ or less.

We are living together in one country and in one world.

 

Like Bob Ritter in Clear and Present Danger said:

Gray! The world is gray, Jack!

 

My personal opinion is that basic "right to life" issues like the American health care system should become entrenched in law and perhaps a pension scheme for the elderly - males & females - at the age of 60 to 65.

But that is where it should end.

[Aurielius]

My personal opinion is that basic "right to life" issues like the American health care system should become entrenched in law and perhaps a pension scheme for the elderly - males & females - at the age of 60 to 65.

But that is where it should end.

I am not exactly sure of what you mean by "Right to Life". We guarantee Life, Liberty, and the pursuit of Happiness in the constitution but that does not correlate to what I think you are proposing. Americans by and large do not mind assisting of their own accord but have a tendency to resist being told they have to.

Socialism is much like the camel's nose in your tent, it starts out with the nose but eventually ends up with the entire camel in the tent and you out in the desert. So I'll stand with the original intent of the framers, we will provide you with the freedom to make your own way but are not required to buy the ticket to your destination.

[grannywils]

Although I get your point, Ginnyfizz, I heartily disagree that it is quite simple, and I don't really see the U.S. going in the direction that you do. But I understand why you feel the way that you do.

 

I'm more in the boat with Balagor on this one, and I like what Paxan_1 had to say as well.

 

 

But I really would like to hear from Burnagirl on 1. where you believe the current worldwide economic crisis began, " I'm not an American but after you look at how the current worldwide economic crisis began you cannot help but...."

 

and 2. why you think that Wall Street are Mr. Obama's friends. " I hear you say but on the flip side of the coin his Wall street friends who are running the countries finances are...."

 

I think those are both such broad statements that they require a little background. I have posted a unfortunately lengthy document on the this debate forum under the Coffee Party thread regarding what I believe to be the real origin of this country's and pretty much the rest of the world's current economic crisis, and I think it is well worth reading.

 

I will try to go back and find it on my computer so that I can post a link rather than making everyone go and read this monsterous document; but it is fascinating reading.

 

As far as Wall Street cronies, my belief is that Mr. Obama has been left with a monumental crisis, and must, and I do mean must deal with Wall Street and with banks if any of us are going to stay afloat. I would hesitate to call them his "friends" or anyone's friends to put it more clearly. But anyway, I would be interested in your theories on the above

 

 

[Balagor]

@Aurielius

Living in a country where social act (sounds better than "socialism" in American ears) is a habit, I will say no to the camel metafor. Probably because we didn`t start with the nose, but had all the camel all the time. But we did not end up in the desert with nothing. Our country has prospered, and for all people living in it. No one tells us what to do, except our laws of cause, and they are very similar to yours.