Burnagirl Posted November 26, 2010 Share Posted November 26, 2010 Cleopatra without a doubt, she was rich, powerful and must have been incredibly intelligent and beautiful to have hooked both Julius Caesar and Mark Antony ... and managed to keep her kingdom independant, well for a while anyway, unfortunately she met her match in Emperor Augustus. David Ben-Gurion the first Israeli Prime Minister, the man who led Israel in victory in the "six day war" where Israel defeated a number of Arab nations single handedly.Winston Churchill, the greatest speech maker (next to Hitler) who held a vastly superior Third Reich at bay and is in my mind one of the greatest leaders who ever lived. I was also fascinated by Hitler and wondered what type of a person he was and so after purchasing "Triumph of the Will", the propaganda documentary of the third reich's 1934 Nuremburg Party Rally, and a number of other documantaries on the man I came to the conclusion that he was insanely singleminded in his dream of empire but he made the same error Napoleon did, he attacked both east and west at the same time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DariusMoranda Posted November 26, 2010 Author Share Posted November 26, 2010 Cleopatra without a doubt, she was rich, powerful and must have been incredibly intelligent and beautiful to have hooked both Julius Caesar and Mark Antony ... and managed to keep her kingdom independant, well for a while anyway, unfortunately she met her match in Emperor Augustus. David Ben-Gurion the first Israeli Prime Minister, the man who led Israel in victory in the "six day war" where Israel defeated a number of Arab nations single handedly.Winston Churchill, the greatest speech maker (next to Hitler) who held a vastly superior Third Reich at bay and is in my mind one of the greatest leaders who ever lived. I was also fascinated by Hitler and wondered what type of a person he was and so after purchasing "Triumph of the Will", the propaganda documentary of the third reich's 1934 Nuremburg Party Rally, and a number of other documantaries on the man I came to the conclusion that he was insanely singleminded in his dream of empire but he made the same error Napoleon did, he attacked both east and west at the same time. Good work! :) I own Triumph Des Willens as well,by Leni Riefenstahl, even though I totally oppose national-socialism, it is truly a masterpiece of propaganda. And yes, it shows right there, how Hitler was one track minded and obsessive, you can see the hunger in his eyes, hunger for power, the most absolute one. Cleopatra is an interesting choice, surely one of the most prominent females in politics, she used her beauty and charm to defeat the mighty ROme without any blood spilled in the process. It was a revolutionary and daring way to deal with very hard situations in which Egypt was in those days, as a pray among the pack of wolves. Brave thing to do and a great sacrifice of one's dignity and persona. Interesting to mention along with this subject, when it comes to the speeches, I have read numerous writings about it and watched many documentaries about great narrators, and I was stunned that most of the great politicians and leaders in the 20th century copied one single man. Experts say, as it is to believe their judgement , that the most powerful narrator with the most outstanding motivational speeches was Grand Duce Benito Mussolini, once a leader of fascist Kingdom Of Italy. I am fluent in 6 languages, but very weak when it comes to latin group, therefore, my first clash with his speeches was unfortunate without subtitles, but I just wanted to see what was a big deal about him, because he literally made Hitler and Hitler took most of his style in every way. So I watched and even though, I couldn't understand one single sentence all together, he looked so powerful and charmingly arrogant at the same time , that he actually 'made me' to watch until the end. And his speeches were pretty much balanced unlike Hitler's speeches, where you could hear pure obsession and urge on open calling on war. Mussolini looked pretty bizzare and twisted to me, as some kind of a dark neo-roman emperor. Strange character, overall. Churchil was a beast of a politician, he knew exactly wha he was doping , 10 moves in front, very calculated and witty character. Though, he earned my dislikes for some decisions he made towards slavic people, his accomplishments and long rule can't be denied, he was one of the two who could oppose to Hitler and his black hordes. David Ben - Gurion is not a familiar name to me, but I will look it up a bit for sure. It is always good and fun to learn new things, especially in when it comes to history, in my case. Good post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaosblade02 Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 You know I actually read Mein Kampf, Hitlers book just to get some kind of insight into the mind of someone like this, from their own words. I think he was a cultured and intelligent man, but I do think he was also mentally ill and demented, which did nothing but encourage his fanaticism. I actually thought some of his paintings were very good, very surprised he was turned away from art school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheCalliton Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 No leader should be positively remembered through war... That's due to many reasons, one being anyone with a bunch of soldiers and guns can win a fight. If you have the other side out numbered in technology and in numbers, AND you have a good strategy point. Also, if your a general commanding a army, you did not act alone. You shouted some orders, and gave long distance orders to certain groups. You might of planned some stuff big deal... Modern war leaders aren't that great, by modern I mean WW1 and up. Now all you have to do is know whats where. You don't have much purpose for strategy. I mean hell, the US didn't even try to win the war with strategy, we just launched a nuke at civilians. Good leaders don't come from propaganda, lies, and violence. Good leaders come from people who rise from the means of good morals and peace. That's why I said Gandhi, not because he killed a bunch of people and took over some land. Because he was able to protest against a evil without bloodshed, and did it in ways that were harder then just going out and shooting people.Vlad The Impaler is sadly known for his wartimes and brutality, but to Transylvania, he is a hero! He stopped the turkish, and had a great economy, crime rate was low, and yet he was betrayed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnagirl Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 (edited) Grace O'Malley (1530 - 1603) - Irish Queen of the Clan O' Maille, and then Pirate and finally friends with Queen Elizabeth herself. Grace and her clan turned pirate after her husband from an arranged marriage proved to be a poor leader, she took a group of men and began her pirating career off the Irish coastrather than see her people starve. And I quote " .... Through out her long life (she lived to be about 73) she not only captured ships and extorted money from others for safe passage she even met with Queen Elizabeth. No one knows what they talked about but the Queen helped Grace out tremendously by letting her family out of jail and basically making her a privateer for England.". Check out her story on wikipedia, amazing gal. Edited November 27, 2010 by Burnagirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginnyfizz Posted November 27, 2010 Share Posted November 27, 2010 In England, you've got a group of people seemingly determined to return the nation to the 16th century ideals of that the rich can afford anything, and the poor must live in huts by the thames, what with their planes to triple university fees-which were hardly cheap to begin with.....And in Greece, you've got a nonfunctional "nation" that only still exists because of it leaching the bank account of it's many allies. ROFL, Vindekarr, what you fail to understand is that in England the government is having to face reality and swing the axe at public finances PRECISELY so that we don't end up like Greece. I would certainly go for Winston Churchill. He made mistakes, some of them dire. But in the end he combined being a great war leader and patriot with having a conscience and a heart. As well as a wicked sense of humour. I can never admire leaders such as Hitler, Stalin and Vlad Tepes, for whom brutality and lack of compassion was the be all and end all, they positively gloried in it for its own sake. Cleopatra, oh yes, she was a consummate politician and diplomat, using her feminine wiles alongside her high intelligence to keep her throne for many years amidst both national and international plotting. Although I hate to disappoint you, but coins and engravings struck during her reign seem to indicate that she was beaky rather than a beauty, possessed of animal magnetism rather than looks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DariusMoranda Posted November 27, 2010 Author Share Posted November 27, 2010 Grace O'Malley (1530 - 1603) - Irish Queen of the Clan O' Maille, and then Pirate and finally friends with Queen Elizabeth herself. Grace and her clan turned pirate after her husband from an arranged marriage proved to be a poor leader, she took a group of men and began her pirating career off the Irish coastrather than see her people starve. And I quote " .... Through out her long life (she lived to be about 73) she not only captured ships and extorted money from others for “safe passage” she even met with Queen Elizabeth. No one knows what they talked about but the Queen helped Grace out tremendously by letting her family out of jail and basically making her a privateer for England.". Check out her story on wikipedia, amazing gal. I enjoyed wikipedia entry on Grace O'Malley, rather exciting and colorful life, it is really interesting to read about such female strength to par with the guys in their own thing. It deserves an admiration. Kudos to you @ Balagor I completely agree with you on the Hitler/Ghandi comparison. Hitler entered to politics with tremendous passion and emotions which were on the edge of madness if not madness itself, that passion was his most powerful weapon and his biggest weakness in later years. He rushed for victory and died in the process, because he had his heart open, which led him to paranoia , psychosis and complete insanity and delusion. Perspective politician he was, but his blatant idea of national socialism and racism and the brutal practice of the same denies all of his early accomplishments. I see Ghandi as more of a spiritual leader then a skillful politician, Ghandi had patience and calm, calculated mind, but he , as well, had his emotions involved in his work, which is a no-no. I think he did great things for his country, but I don't think he could have survived longer then he lived, in the sea of politic charks back in the day. Nonethless , both of these men did what they thought it was right at that moment and were good for their people, at some point. Though, in Hitler's case, no one misses him, lol. Darius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marharth Posted November 28, 2010 Share Posted November 28, 2010 Someone mentioned Hitlers art. I honestly completely forgot about that, I haven't heard that in a few years... The reason I don't like Hitler, is because he came to power by blaming a common enemy in a time of weakness. That's like stomping on someone when there down, its just weak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burnagirl Posted November 28, 2010 Share Posted November 28, 2010 (edited) Surenas - I myself vote for Princess Snow White, for she had seven guys at hand to please her. That's great, eh? Well my dear girl they are dwarves, tiny, short, little men where's the fun in that, unless of course if you meant that they were helpful in doing the dishes and washing the clothes etc.Then the thought struck me, hey, surely a dwarven female would be a better bet than her stunted counterpart but then after looking at pictures of dwarfen women I decided that that was a big no-no as well.Now maybe if they were fairies, heck yeah, Snow White and the seven fairies .... Hmmm perhaps then I could ....... this is all just hypothetical of course. Edited November 28, 2010 by Burnagirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Surenas Posted November 28, 2010 Share Posted November 28, 2010 (edited) Surenas - I myself vote for Princess Snow White, for she had seven guys at hand to please her. That's great, eh? Well my dear girl they are dwarves, tiny, short, little men where's the fun in that... Well, whenever man comes face to face with me, the big boy turns into a willing dwarf :wub: Is that different for you over there? Too bad :wacko: Though seven at one blow, that's still above my head, therefore my favorite is Princess Snow White... Men cluster to me like moths around a flame And if their wings burn I know I'm not to blame_ Marlene Dietrichhttp://www.abload.de/img/anne9hol.gif Uh-huh, oh yeah, uh-huh! Edited November 28, 2010 by Surenas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts