FoA clothing request.

[devinpatterson]

Am I the only one here who sees some major potential for factional conflict between the Brotherhood and the Followers over their searches for tech - and maybe the possibility for alliance?

 

So perhaps an alliance with the Brotherhood could prove lucrative? I don't know if this should go in this thread or the Dawn of Steel thread or here, but I think that it's a point worth discussing.

Definitely worth exploring. I think if the BOS travels the path that the newblood (like for example veronica) espouses, the followers would be a powerful ally. Assuming we continue to develop the basics we sketched out, of that plot line (in regard to helping build bonds with teh populace, infrastructure etc) the followers would have a wealth of information and know how to share and a common goal of the two factions should bring them a closer alliance or at least respectful cooperation. On the other hand if it's Hardin......well it all goes down the cr*pper.

 

As for their conficts with the BoS, the tech that the FoA is after is of little or no vaule to the BoS. The BoS wants weapons, they want armor where the FoA want history, medicine and things that will help stabilize the wasteland. I don't see much of a problem unless the FoA start stepping on the BoS's toes such as sending scavengers in to a (unknown to the FoA) occupied BoS bunker looking for tech.

I tend to think along the same lines, but there are some exceptions worth considering. I wasn't aware of this (as I didn't play the original fallout games), but the BOS is big into medical tech, so there may be some competition there. Another aspect is the followers previous alliance with the NCR. I don't think that's nearly as a big a factor in the Mojave, but in the core region the BOS and followers may be warring factions owing to their (previous) support of the NCR. The Mojave BOS is obviously atypical in their attitudes toward the NCR (at least under McNamara) so that bad blood may be mostly forgiven or forgotten by now.

 

In addition although no one is quite as rampant at collectiong pre-war (mostly military or combative tech) as the BOS, the followers may collect some of their own if they are, as you point out, peace loving but not pacifists.

 

I also think that something that we all forget is that the FoA are anarchist, they act in a way as to defy controlled system such as the NCR or BoS opting instead to have no defined hierarchy and lead from a place of natural selection. Julie Farkas wasn't elected to lead, the Mojave FoA chose to follower her.

Hmmm I'd like to read up on that when I get some time. I'm curious if they are truly anarchists or simply eschew dogmatic power structures.

 

I also see an opportunity to bring them under the Viva NV umbrella for a altruistic focused courier, especially if they have a very loose system of leadership/organization. I think the Ind courier (and possibly a NCR courier) could form some strong faction alliance or even merge to further the followers pursuits to aid others.

[dark9834]

Second paragraph from the FoA wiki page.

"Forgoing preaching in favour of humanitarianism, the Followers are generally welcomed by the inhabitants of the wasteland. Wherever they go, the Followers seek to provide services to those in need, namely medical care and agricultural instruction. Those in positions of power often regard them as seditious anarchists; though such accusations are not entirely without truth, the organization as a whole has no interest in seizing power"

 

Third paragraph

"Although pacifists by nature, the Followers will not hesitate to defend themselves against attackers, and will take up arms against those who threaten their ideals. Often times they will be seen with hired guards adding much needed protection and firepower to their organization."

 

Sixth paragraph

"Although pacifists by nature, the Followers were determined to stop the Master's plans by any means necessary, even if it meant resorting to armed conflict. They began secretly gathering intelligence on the organization that could prove useful in the upcoming showdown, using one of their members to infiltrate the organization and spy on them."

 

Ninth paragraph

"Ideologically, the Followers' principles bear some resemblance to secular-humanism. Above all else, they support pacifism and cooperation, and oppose those who seek to subvert these principles. Though they loathe violence in all forms, they will defend themselves against those who seek to take their lives or otherwise jeopardize the future of humanity "

 

Just some highlights for you guys.

[MarchUntoTorment]

A few notes, since quoting still isn't working for me -

 

1. The BOS are actually interested in basically all past tech - they've got a very significant interest in medical tech, for starters, including advanced cybernetics. It's also mentioned by Veronica during her quest that they have an enormous assortment of industrial and agricultural information that could revolutionise the Wasteland, but the Brotherhood steadfastly holds to their isolationist ideals.

 

2. I'm with Devin on the Hardin thing - McNamara would be open to cooperating, but Hardin never would. That's basically a given.

 

3. The Followers are hardly well-defended - the extent of their firepower seems to be a small number of guards with double-barrelled shotguns and bolt-action rifles. While not entirely without armament, they're a far cry from the amount of force that can be exerted by an organisation like the Brotherhood, who are and remain the third-most-powerful army in the Mojave - an alliance with whom would allow the Followers to act with functional impunity, regardless of the wishes of organisations like the Legion and NCR.

 

4. They're not anarchists - while perceived as such, the NCR's main objection to them (and their reason for calling them anarchists) is because they refuse to submit to NCR authority. As it is, they appear to pretty much be the Wasteland's equivalent of the Red Cross - a non-partisan organisation dedicated to humanitarian causes who refuse governmental association.

 

5. The Brotherhood's stake in this is largely, I'd imagine, public legitimacy. The Brotherhood have really terrible public relations, which aiding the Followers would likely help with. With the backing of the Followers, the Brotherhood would be able to operate much more openly and with much greater public support. This is, of course, assuming that the NCR are either allied with the Brotherhood, or have disappeared.

[dark9834]

To continue beating a dead horse... :laugh:

 

1. A tid-bit from the wiki

"New Vegas the main Brotherhood is strongly paranoid, it not only seeks to preserve technology, but actively remove it from outsiders, is disinterested in nonmilitary assets, and engages in little if any work to actually improve their tech."

I do concede the point that if the BoS thought the FoA had something of worth that they would actively try and take it from them through what ever means necessary. so in turn the BoS would be a equal threat to the FoA just as the NCR.

 

2.I also agree that if McNamara could be convinced/forced to lessen the BoS commitment to the Codex or at lest leave it more open to interpretation like Veronica wants.

If they were to take on the mind set of Lton's pride from the Capital wasteland (Fallout3) or loosen their standerds for entry into the brotherhood like that of the Midwestern BoS (Fallout Tactics /non-canon) that the FoA and the BoS could benefit from one another.

 

3. The FoA are a powerful faction based in the Main NCR territories. The problem for the Mojave branch is that they are heavily under supported by the main branch back in the Boneyard. A note from the wiki (again) " Following their separation from the NCR government, the Followers(the mojave branch which is stranded in NCR territory ) are lacking in the resources and manufacturing capabilities needed to provide the supplies they need to carry out their humanitarian mission." A barrier that could be overcome through the actions of the Courier, quests and etc.

 

4. To clarify my claim that the FoA are anarchistic let me link a wiki page for
Anarchism http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarchism
I'm not talking about chaos loving, fire bomb welding, rebels without a cause.

 

5.As it stand the West coast brotherhood has no design of even any concern for what the rest of the Mojave thinks of them, their mentality a close to that of the Outcast (Fallout3) Religiously devoted to upholding Maxson's vision even if is a death sentence.

 

etc.

Edited April 11, 2015 by dark9834

[devinpatterson]

1. The BOS are actually interested in basically all past tech - they've got a very significant interest in medical tech, for starters, including advanced cybernetics. It's also mentioned by Veronica during her quest that they have an enormous assortment of industrial and agricultural information that could revolutionise the Wasteland, but the Brotherhood steadfastly holds to their isolationist ideals.

1. A tidbit from the wiki

"New Vegas the main Brotherhood is strongly paranoid, it not only seeks to preserve technology, but actively remove it from outsiders, is disinterested in nonmilitary assets, and engages in little if any work to actually improve their tech."

I think part of this seeming contradiction might be attributed to the difference between tech (ie physical, technological items) and technology (knowledge). We do know that they seize items they consider inappropriate for wastelanders and other factions ("their patrols began monitoring trade along I-15 and 95, seizing any items of technology they deemed inappropriate" nv endings). And they do have interests in areas that we don't immediately associate with military tech (although they are related and fall into teh military sphere....IMHO) "the Brotherhood had a monopoly on power armor, supercomputers, and advanced medical technologies such as cybernetics."-bos homepage on the wiki.

 

Another aspect that may be muddying the waters is the "scope" of military tech. When we hear military technology we tend to think of armaments, but take the army corps of engineers as an example of the range the military covers. They'r part of the dept of defense/US army, and although they provide support to military infrastructure (facilities, fortifications etc) they're also engaged in public works on a massive scale and have a wealth of engineering knowledge. So the BOS could have access to a dizzying array of training publications that covers the knowledge we typcially associate with teh military (spec ops, weapons, military intelligence etc) but also areas of knowledge that arn't typically associated with teh more combative aspects of the military (finance, engineering, military law etc).

 

They may have areas of deep knowledge in many subjects, but simply be disinclined to to apply it, focusing on more practical applications of combat. So long story short, I think you both could be right. The BOS my very well confiscate inappropriate technological items and technological knowledge/know how they consider dangerous in others hands, but there are many areas of advance technology (items and knowledge) they wouldn't consider a threat or are not overly concerned with another faction having. In addition teh Mojave chapter is probably much more flexible (as demonstrated by their truce with teh NCR) than the core BOS in regard to other factions and advanced weaponry, as well as more likely to make use of their knowledge base for the benefit of other others (under McNamara).

[dark9834]

I think we're kind of losing focus though this discussion is about how we can enhance the FoA so that they a more noticeable and active part of the Mojave Wasteland.

 

Things like Quest lines, Npcs, Perks, Companions, Items, Weapons, Locations, and Armor.

 

What can we do to breath more life into this awesome faction that has been forgotten.

[devinpatterson]

What can we do to breath more life into this awesome faction that has been forgotten.

 

On the more predictable front, I'd like to see a mission to scavenge a advanced medical facility (medical research, military teaching hospital, etc) to prevent the deaths of a large group of innocents (from plague or some other infection, possibly an outbreak of spores from vault 22 technology). This would be a very dangerous environment which justifies there still being valuable items to recover. I was thinking something along the lines of a zombie apocalypse flick, but other critters rather than ferrals (or a variant of the ferals) could be substituted. There would be a very limited time to retrieve teh medical supplies before people start dropping. The idea of a medical research facility (with military contracts) or Military research facility would allow heightened security (for a greater challenge. Bots, turrets etc ) and experimental atrocities (some of which may still live on). If the quest involved a group of your fellow FoAs it would be even more challenging protecting them. If we built up some fellowship between the player and npc before the quest, we could use that human connection to increase the tension of the mod. Perhaps even including some choices that would require sacrificing some of your compatriots or the innocents back home will perish. A morally challenging dilemma.

 

I'd like to kill two birds with one stone and reinforce lore regarding the Legion while performing missions for the followers. I think that falls into two broad categories; 1. Humanitarian relief and 2. stopping the Legion (possibly the greatest threat to peace in teh southwest). The first category is pretty straight forward, we see an example of it at Nipton. The legion concept of "total war" (killing woman and children to break the enemies spirit, for example) will leave horrors across the wasteland and followers can aid survivors and refugees.

 

The second is more ambitious and a bit of a different take on most of our fallout quests. If the followers have a philosophy that the ends justify the means, they may try almost anything to stop the Legion. Infiltration for information or sabotage, after allowing oneself to be "captured" by legion forces, might be deemed worth the risk. Assassination or even mass homicide wouldn't be off the table. A couple of scenarios come to mind.

 

Serving as a slave with medical services opens up some opportunities to kill a lot of legion forces via subterfuge while aiding prisoners and slaves.

 

Or perhaps the Legion has found a live warhead and is preparing to transport it to a population center. The player may have to make the choice between sabotaging it or detonating it for maximum effect among legion forces.

 

There are probably a lot of variations, but the common thread is that this would be a dialogue heavy mod requiring a lot more gray matter than muscle fiber. There could still be some combat but it would be more akin to a few assassination or stealth kills to protect your cover, and be few and far between (until near the end). In addition if your infiltrating the Legion, there will be actions teh player will be forced to take, morally dark, maybe even soul haunting actions to be accepted......for the greater good. Moral ambiguity, and balancing the scales of suffering will be a key internal conflict.

 

Might be hard though, as it's not your typical mod and may not gain much traction. It will also have to be written well to pull off since it's all about the story. And dialog heavy mods are much more tedious and time consuming.

 

Anyway a few ideas to start.

[dark9834]

Definitely hunting down tech and field medic relief efforts are a must. I also really liked the digging wells ideas or maybe working out a deal with Goodsprings for fresh water (they are good people, high rep could mean free water.) Another must would be building a library or even a school house and not only starting it out establishing supplies and protection etc.