rickerhk Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Huh. Looking at a hex editor shows that there's no PNAM entry at all for that INFO in FalloutNV.esm or Fallout3.esm. But there is one in the TTW esm, and it's eight zeros. So your version of xExit is showing it correctly. The version I'm still using (3.0.33) shows a PNAM with 8 zeros all across the three plugins when it actually isnt there at all for two of them. It would be interesting to see if it's just leftover INFOs from FO3 that are like that. Because everything that I've looked at that was made with the NV Geck has the PNAM record in every INFO and the first one is zero filled. The PNAM highlighted here is missing in the game esms: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/55759080/Nexus/PNAM.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatterian Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 Yeah I'm not finding the PNAM in the FalloutNV.esm either. That PNAM is inserted by FNVEdit usually and it won't let you delete it. Obviously it's not needed, and there are thousands of dialogues like that. I just picked one at random. I don't think it breaks anyting... but it's a waste of memory in this game that is sensitive to memory use. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickerhk Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 I hope they aren't loaded. It would be nice to know. This is just a wild guess but I don't think PNAM's are needed by the game during runtime. I think the game loads INFOs determined by their plugin load order and then order in the plugin so PNAMs would be redundant if retained in memory. I think PNAMs are for Geck optimization to avoid having to load the entire INFO stack from the plugin and all the masters when loading a plugin. I think this is why 'can't find prev info' errors in the Geck don't seem to affect them working in the game at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hlp Posted July 6, 2015 Share Posted July 6, 2015 It's not a waste of memory :smile: The engine will not load a null field, just like if it did not exists.As for PNAM, they are loaded by the runtime so they must be used. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatterian Posted July 7, 2015 Share Posted July 7, 2015 OK that makes sense, thanks hlp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoyBatterian Posted September 10, 2016 Share Posted September 10, 2016 I want to revisit this topic a bit. First if you use xEdit and you have not turned off Sort INFO in the settings it will insert null, which at runtime merge can cause problems with the rule of one, provided they are actually used. This leads me to ... Second, the vanilla master files don't use PNAM at all from what I can see, I've been over most of the dialogue now in Fallout 3 and NV and they just aren't used so I don't know what their use is in the engine. I do know if they are wrong then topics may never show up at all which can be massively frustrating to debug. I've discovered this issue recently when working with the companion overhaul for TTW, removing all PNAM inserted by NV GECK fixed all dialogue issues that were occurring so that all the responses were structured exactly as in Fallout3.esm and FalloutNV.esm. The DLC's use them but they seem to be completely at random if they are inserted or not, some are null too. I begin to think this was internal bookkeeping as rickerhk suggests and is only used by GECK in version control mode to properly sort responses and assign formid's in topics when merging. The only thing I've seen in regards to the topic linking from the conversation editor is shared infos in the top level topic. These sub-records should *not* be added to your plugins if they are from the master files. I've encountered two instances where leaving them in will cause the game to hang on plugin load. But this might be related to missing ONAM's which Arthmoor has already reported, this needs to be tested and verified as a bug in xEdit or not. These fields ARE in the official ESM's, but if they are added to user made ESM's this is when the plugin hang will occur. It would be nice if xEdit also listed in the reference tab ONAM's in the header so it would be easier to track this down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManehattanProject Posted September 10, 2016 Author Share Posted September 10, 2016 Right now, part of our tech team is experimenting with configuring a VPN system to emulate an internal network to use the built-in version control system. (We tried using it with stuff like Google Drive or other cloud-based systems, but couldn't get it to work for reasons that are frankly above my head). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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