FalloutSnip (TESVSnip for Fallout 4)

[VarekRaith]

Sigh...

It seems we're about to repeat the same mistakes we did with Skyrim mods before the release of the CK.

That took nearly a year and a half to fix.

Please, let's not do this again.

 

 

[coffinbag]

Varek, the mistakes have already been repeated. the only fix for this, is if bethesda started releasing the CK at launch. but even then the mistake would still be made, its not people making the mod, or even people using the mod. its impatient people who ignore warnings and then complain that their save is borked, i treat them the same way they treat warnings, completely ignoring them.

[MoonbiterLS]

Varek, the mistakes have already been repeated. the only fix for this, is if bethesda started releasing the CK at launch. but even then the mistake would still be made, its not people making the mod, or even people using the mod. its impatient people who ignore warnings and then complain that their save is borked, i treat them the same way they treat warnings, completely ignoring them.

 

Well, to be honest i think Bethesda are to blame for delaying CK launch. People want to play the game at launch, and for these games people expect mods. So by delaying CK, they are making community resort to makeshift tools and potentially harm their savegames.

 

Of course nobody expects big mods from the start, they take time to make. But having a CK for simple mods like settlement limits, settler number, merchant inventory refresh time, settlement boundaries, additional items for settlements are all easy enough and straightforward to make if we only had CK.

 

And now people are forced to either play unmodded game (texture replacers being obvious exepction) with horrid UI, stupid limits for settlements etc. for MONTHS or risk their savegame getting corrupted. Either way, it's a choice between two evils. Playing unmodded game for someone who has played TES series or Fallout3/NV with mods is risking driving people away entirely.

 

And so it brings us back to Bethesda. They must realize what a huge factor mods are in making their games so popular. So they should do everything in their power to let people mod and enjoy the game, rather then delaying CK and in result getting a bunch of frustrated people.

[nonoodles]

BGS has no obligation whatsoever to rush out the CK or make it available from day one, and anyone with a scrap of sense would prefer them releasing the kit when it's good and ready, not a minute before. Believe me, that they bring a kit out at all is a huge favour, not a duty. No, the only people we can blame is ourselves for being in such a tearing hurry even when plenty of voices are telling us to exercise caution or patience.

[LordGrievous]

BGS has no obligation whatsoever to rush out the CK or make it available from day one, and anyone with a scrap of sense would prefer them releasing the kit when it's good and ready, not a minute before. Believe me, that they bring a kit out at all is a huge favour, not a duty. No, the only people we can blame is ourselves for being in such a tearing hurry even when plenty of voices are telling us to exercise caution or patience.

I personally wouldn't buy a Betheseda game if I knew they weren't going to make/support mod tools. Their games are a lot more popular than they would have been if they hadn't released the tools. Its not a favor, it's a business strategy.

Edited November 23, 2015 by LordGrievous

[bls61793]

BGS has no obligation whatsoever to rush out the CK or make it available from day one, and anyone with a scrap of sense would prefer them releasing the kit when it's good and ready, not a minute before. Believe me, that they bring a kit out at all is a huge favour, not a duty. No, the only people we can blame is ourselves for being in such a tearing hurry even when plenty of voices are telling us to exercise caution or patience.

 

So, I really want some history on this stuff: what was the big problem with TESV snip in Skyrim? I've heard there were a lot of problems with save games, but I've never solidly heard what the big issue was. Currently I have made a mod for Fallout 4 solely with FO4Edit, and it appears to work fine. Granted I haven't extensively tested it. But I'd like to know for my own future reference.

 

P.S. My personal opinion is that if you play with mods you are inviting yourself to have a messed up save game. It's just one of those things that's possible to happen. Good modding tools and mod authors help reduce the likelihood of this, but at the end of the day, there are no guarantees.

I think if modders want to Mod now, fine... do it. But people downloading mods NOW should be aware that the official mod tools have not been released, and that playing with Mods always comes without a guarantee (and that unofficial mod tools are more likely to break things than the official tools.)

[LordGrievous]

 

BGS has no obligation whatsoever to rush out the CK or make it available from day one, and anyone with a scrap of sense would prefer them releasing the kit when it's good and ready, not a minute before. Believe me, that they bring a kit out at all is a huge favour, not a duty. No, the only people we can blame is ourselves for being in such a tearing hurry even when plenty of voices are telling us to exercise caution or patience.

 

So, I really want some history on this stuff: what was the big problem with TESV snip in Skyrim? I've heard there were a lot of problems with save games, but I've never solidly heard what the big issue was. Currently I have made a mod for Fallout 4 solely with FO4Edit, and it appears to work fine. Granted I haven't extensively tested it. But I'd like to know for my own future reference.

 

P.S. My personal opinion is that if you play with mods you are inviting yourself to have a messed up save game. It's just one of those things that's possible to happen. Good modding tools and mod authors help reduce the likelihood of this, but at the end of the day, there are no guarantees.

I think if modders want to Mod now, fine... do it. But people downloading mods NOW should be aware that the official mod tools have not been released, and that playing with Mods always comes without a guarantee (and that unofficial mod tools are more likely to break things than the official tools.)

 

Basically you use TES/FO4Snip to directly edit records by their hex values. This can cause savegame corruption by introducing data into the game that it doesn't expect.

[nonoodles]

You can dig around for the exact figures, but as fun as modding is, console sales outstrip pc sales. Bethesda doesn't regard PC as their largest market. Obviously, with their plan to bring console modding, we might see more active support for modding as a whole. Even so, and regardless of what one feels, there's no obligation to go to the trouble of giving us an official kit/releasing it early. The CK is pretty much a version of what the devs use to make the game, stripped of 3rd party features they can't legally release to us, and rebuilding the tool for us probably takes time.

 

There's a lot of reading material on TESVSnip over on the Skyrim side of Nexus - sorry, bad time for me to dig up links so you'll have to do the searching, or not if you don't want to. If FO4Edit is out, should be relatively safer.

 

edit: horrendous formatting.

[bls61793]

 

 

BGS has no obligation whatsoever to rush out the CK or make it available from day one, and anyone with a scrap of sense would prefer them releasing the kit when it's good and ready, not a minute before. Believe me, that they bring a kit out at all is a huge favour, not a duty. No, the only people we can blame is ourselves for being in such a tearing hurry even when plenty of voices are telling us to exercise caution or patience.

 

So, I really want some history on this stuff: what was the big problem with TESV snip in Skyrim? I've heard there were a lot of problems with save games, but I've never solidly heard what the big issue was. Currently I have made a mod for Fallout 4 solely with FO4Edit, and it appears to work fine. Granted I haven't extensively tested it. But I'd like to know for my own future reference.

 

P.S. My personal opinion is that if you play with mods you are inviting yourself to have a messed up save game. It's just one of those things that's possible to happen. Good modding tools and mod authors help reduce the likelihood of this, but at the end of the day, there are no guarantees.

I think if modders want to Mod now, fine... do it. But people downloading mods NOW should be aware that the official mod tools have not been released, and that playing with Mods always comes without a guarantee (and that unofficial mod tools are more likely to break things than the official tools.)

 

Basically you use TES/FO4Snip to directly edit records by their hex values. This can cause savegame corruption by introducing data into the game that it doesn't expect.

 

 

Okay, but my question really is... does TESV/FO4Edit work as expected? Because if it does, then its no more dangerous than the CK if you know what you're doing. I don't tend to use TESSnip because of the fact that it seems a whole lot easier to mess things up in it, but... if the 3rd party tools (xSnip and xEdit) don't introduce random data into your .esp, it should work just as good as the Geck... so long as you don't go effing with hexes until you are 100% sure you know what they're doing...granted... there is always the possibility for human error (but that can occur in the CK or GECK as well).

[bls61793]

 

 

If FO4Edit is out, should be relatively safer.

Yea, there is a version of FO4Edit out now, and it seems to work just as good as TES5Edit does on my Skyrim stuff.

Edited November 23, 2015 by bls61793