Of UFO’s, Nazis and secret antarctic bases

[devinpatterson]

This looks awesome! You all have really great ideas and I know this will make a really great mod. I would love to help, but I am without a computer for a while. If this is still being made when I get my computer then I would be honored to help out. For now I can be an idea person. I am fairly creative and would love to help.

 

I only have a minute so I havn't looked over your post in detail but a few points;

 

Cool we need/value hte input

 

I think that all of the nazi soldiers you meet should all wear SS uniforms.......

 

I hope to make them as historically accurate as the game resources allow.

 

The armor should have really high DT and give some good effects.

 

Yeah they'll be equiped with intertia shields which are ridiculously powerfull (55DT plus the DT for clothing/armor). Plus they can't be recovered (at least they couldn't be recovered from the aliens when they were killed), although there might be one or two somewhere that the player might be able to use for boss fights or what have you.

 

For weapons there should be Zeta-like weapons but hybrid with nazi weapons like MP40s.

 

Me and TrooperScooperMKII were discussing that on another board, but probably not lasers or plasma. Rather an enhancement of hte actual weapons themselves (ie they may crackle and glow with energy, but would basicly still be balistic weapons).

 

That is all I have to type now but I do have many more ideas. I know you want to make the Nazis evil, which they are, but it would be nice if you could work with the nazis and not always get betrayed by them. If you could show that you are very useful and one tough son of a gun, then the nazis should be smart enough to realize that betraying you will lead to their defeat. Some people don't like to include a permanent friendly relationship with nazis, but I would very much like it. It wouldn't be that much harder if you made the rest of the mod.

 

I'm unlikely too, since I don't want to work up a whole faction just some awesome enemies, but I'll try to keep an open mind. Several people have suggested working with them anywhere from a short time to a long term alliance. But I am loathe to do that...

Edited May 22, 2011 by devinpatterson

[devinpatterson]

'TrooperScooperMKII & MajikMoshos you both have some detailed and interesting ideas, but I'd like to consider them when I have a little more time. That way I can hopefully form an intelligent response instead of just rushing through trying to address parts and pieces of what you've written

[TrooperScooperMKII]

I havn't had time to look over TrooperScooperMKII 's message in detail yet (just stopping in the forums for a minute), but I will probably be keeping everything as close to the real nazis as the game engine allows.....(just the addition of some advanced tech).

I was suggesting that we do something similar to the swastika as what was done to the US flag; cosmetic alterations, but still clearly recognizable as a Nazi symbol.

In any event, they technically are neo-Nazis...

[devinpatterson]

I havn't had time to look over TrooperScooperMKII 's message in detail yet (just stopping in the forums for a minute), but I will probably be keeping everything as close to the real nazis as the game engine allows.....(just the addition of some advanced tech).

I was suggesting that we do something similar to the swastika as what was done to the US flag; cosmetic alterations, but still clearly recognizable as a Nazi symbol.

In any event, they technically are neo-Nazis...

 

From a modding/author point of view I'd like them to be as close to authentic nazis as possible. The nazis have the darkest history of any villains of our recent times and I want to bring that in full force.

From a storyline point of view I believe they would rally around the old symbols being the last of their kind, disjointed in time. Familiar symbols, behaviors, command structures etc would be their anchor in a strange world of the future

 

BTW If I have a little time tonight I'm going to put up a storm trooper field uniform.

 

Also working right now on using zion resources for indian androids in the sunset park. I really wish we could get some hollywood type western store fronts for main street. Those type of store fronts along with a bunch of neon signs is what I really had in mind for mainstreet. I'm having to use pics of historical buildings and re-texturing nifs with brick and brownstown type facings. It's time consuming and tedious (because of the scale for each building each textures bricks have to be different sizes). Plus it doesn't convey the impression I want :dry:

 

I'll try to put up some help wanted posts and see if any modelers can give us a hand.

Edited May 22, 2011 by devinpatterson

[MajikMoshos]

TrooperScooper: I don't really want to spoil, but in MSZ the Lone wanderer brings down a whole mothership at the end - but not the Zeta.

 

Ngin & Dev: Yeah, I was thinking about what sort of weapons they'd have today. Obviously they should have stick-grenades. Also, if they do have flamethrowers perhaps make them function differently to the vanilla flamethrowers. Maybe they work more realistically by firing a molten stream that utterly destroys armour (bonus damage to condition) while making the area it hits act like a pain-zone or something? Now, I'm gonna give ya time to think, but I suggest you do some research into Nazi experimental tech. They had some crazy ideas.

 

For an example, I'm thinking something along the line of a massive, portable revolver cannon based on the Mauser MG 213, which didn't see much use due to the Nazi's defeat but did inspire a wave of immitators afterwards. This thing would be hooked up to a steadicam-esque rig (Like the Smart guns from Aliens), boast insane recoil and can chew through its condition with a single salvo - while utterly f***ing up anything short of a deathclaw, mutant or power-armoured Nazi. Perhaps for the sake of balance you only get to use it once against some kind of super-tank or flying craft. PA'd Nazis that would otherwise be a threat suddenly become a cakewalk for just a short time as you gleefully tear into them. It's unique, starting at max condition and using 25mm rounds (closet to the 20mm rounds used by the real-life MG 213). By the time you're done it'd become largely unusable. Of course a desperate player could take it with them back to the Mojave Wasteland to repair, but it'd weigh as much as a full set of remnants power armour.

More common weapons could include a successor to the Sturmgewer 44, firing rapid blue blasts but boasting impressive control and reliability. This would be the main weapon used by the SS.

Lesser grunts would use a older model that while powered by a glowing alien cell inside, uses .357 rounds as its main source of ammo instead. Upon reaching a low condition the glow would die down during a faulty reload, requiring a good knock to start up again. I'm thinking it's actual gunfire would be like tracers, either red or blue streaks.

Finally, scouts would have similiar weapons to the Kar98k rifle and MP40, again designed to match a sort of hybrid asthetic.

 

Also, at some point the Nazi's attempted to use flamethrowers that were activated via boobytrap. This would be an interesting method of redirecting the player - deadly streams of fire suddenly blocking their way if they're not careful, forcing them to take another path. The solution to these would involve finding control boxes to cut the power to the pressure pads, but this would require a high science or repair to solve. If you activate the flames though, you're unable to utilise the control boxes. Save-scumming becomes a lot harder in this instance, so the player would have to stick with their mistakes. Alternativley they could use Flame-turrets that work like Heavy incinerators and boast exposed tanks on the back. 'Crippling' the tank causes gas to leak out, thus resulting in a nice explosion that can take out a room full of enemies.

 

Perhaps a vendor could also offer sale and repairs of these weapons upon completion - exclusivley at the 'alien town' of course.

 

I hope I'm not overloading you with too much crap now, so I'll leave you to the rest. Anyway, it's been great so far.

[HECUgrunt]

This is an interesting idea and i think most of the suggestions make sense,however the Nida Scheutlich outfit, I think would have to be modified because their in Antarctica right? That outfit doesn't look very warm.

[TrooperScooperMKII]

I don't know that much about Nazi tech wrt armies, but they obviously knew their way around aircraft, submarines and rockets. Speaking of which, why not have a V-3 rocket somehow? It could be a huge artillery piece involved in the questline (destroy it, disable it, or hijack it) or just a miniaturized mortar launcher.

The Nazis also worked with gauss type weapons, IIRC.

 

As for the crashed ship- how did it get shot down? Did it have a meltdown, or was it pummeled by artillery/cannonfire? That's definitely going to affect what happens with the ship on the ground.

[devinpatterson]

I don't know that much about Nazi tech wrt armies, but they obviously knew their way around aircraft, submarines and rockets. Speaking of which, why not have a V-3 rocket somehow? It could be a huge artillery piece involved in the questline (destroy it, disable it, or hijack it) or just a miniaturized mortar launcher.

The Nazis also worked with gauss type weapons, IIRC.

 

As for the crashed ship- how did it get shot down? Did it have a meltdown, or was it pummeled by artillery/cannonfire? That's definitely going to affect what happens with the ship on the ground.

 

Yeah there is that red rocket in FO3, I wonder if it's in the NV meshes...

 

That's interesting re: the gauss weapons, but I guess it wouldn't surprise me since they had some pretty impressive tech for their time.

 

If your referring to the ship shot down in the DLC it was downed by the lone wanderer in a battle with zeta (still currently in orbit), via mothership zetas death ray.

 

If your referring to the antarctic ship, my impression is;

Its been there for longer than 1600 years (because the intact zeta saucer has been watching earth for 1600 years), probably on the order of 1000's of years. So it wasn't anything to do with man per se, probably a anomaly or malfunction of the ship itself.

 

Also in regard to the antarctic ship, perhaps it interacted with primitive people in ancient times and was the origin of some myths. For example the Sumerian Planet X Nibiru, or the Babylonian Anunaki (that genetically engineered man from monkeys to serve as slaves to the aliens). The nazis recovered ancient arcane info when they raided the European theater for all the occult treasures. Secrets that were guarded for 100s or 1000's of years came into their possession and they were able to piece together the location of the crashed ship.

 

Another major point of interest is mothership zeta itself. If the alien companion is captured by the nazis they will learn (if they are able to comunicate with the E.T.) of mothership zeta and then the sh*t will really hit the fan. Nazis really shouldn't have gigantic ufo's with deathrays, it's just really bad news for everyone. So it's possible that zeta may be the final encounter in the mod (or trilogy of mods), since it is the ultimate prize.

 

Also we should consider area 51 as a target of interest for the nazis. I know a area 51 DLC hasn't been officially announced but I think we all know there will be one. I don't want to step on the toes of the forthcoming DLC, but it would be odd to have them visit anywhere near the mojave and not check out dreamland.

 

You know what else might be cool. If all the nazis awoke from the cryogenic sleep ghoulified. I mean the only way you can make nazis scarier is if they are undead. But not feral, just as intelligent and dangerous as when they were alive, but with the ghoulish appearance. Might also help in the storyline since the area was nuked with 3 separate bombs.

 

 

 

Well the crashed ship and nazis also relate to conspiracy/internet lore that is kid of intersting. So I thought I'd just jot down some of the stuff I came across researching the nazi antarctic link;

 

One is that the earth is hollow and a entrance into it exists in the antarctic. Depending on what page you check there is everything from "there is a whole world inside the hollow earth with it's own sun" all the way to "colossal subterranean caverns" which I guess is sort of the hp lovecraft mountains of madness view. The nazis have set up a empire in the hollow earth.

 

The second is that the aliens are in the hollow world. They have either set up base 1000's of years ago (ie it was atlantis, until the poles changed and catastrophe struck) or they are a reptilian native of earth and not really aliens at all, perhaps the humonoid descendants of the dinosaurs that escaped underground before the impact event that caused the extinction. They are millions of years ahead of us technologically, but had a civilization wide catastrophe and their race is dying out. They are attempting to use human DNA to continue their races existence. The nazi's have joined the aliens

 

So all that crazy (but cool) stuff I typed above is just a little piece of the stuff I'v run across with the antarctic nazi thing.

Edited May 23, 2011 by devinpatterson

[devinpatterson]

This is an interesting idea and i think most of the suggestions make sense,however the Nida Scheutlich outfit, I think would have to be modified because their in Antarctica right? That outfit doesn't look very warm.

 

True, for the germans in the antarctic. The majority of them are far below the ice in the saucer, but for the unlucky few on the surface they will need winterized gear.

Edited May 23, 2011 by devinpatterson

[MajikMoshos]

I don't know that much about Nazi tech wrt armies, but they obviously knew their way around aircraft, submarines and rockets. Speaking of which, why not have a V-3 rocket somehow? It could be a huge artillery piece involved in the questline (destroy it, disable it, or hijack it) or just a miniaturized mortar launcher.

The Nazis also worked with gauss type weapons, IIRC.

 

As for the crashed ship- how did it get shot down? Did it have a meltdown, or was it pummeled by artillery/cannonfire? That's definitely going to affect what happens with the ship on the ground.

 

Yeah there is that red rocket in FO3, I wonder if it's in the NV meshes...

 

That's interesting re: the gauss weapons, but I guess it wouldn't surprise me since they had some pretty impressive tech for their time.

 

If your referring to the ship shot down in the DLC it was downed by the lone wanderer in a battle with zeta (still currently in orbit), via mothership zetas death ray.

 

If your referring to the antarctic ship, my impression is;

Its been there for longer than 1600 years (because the intact zeta saucer has been watching earth for 1600 years), probably on the order of 1000's of years. So it wasn't anything to do with man per se, probably a anomaly or malfunction of the ship itself.

 

Also in regard to the antarctic ship, perhaps it interacted with primitive people in ancient times and was the origin of some myths. For example the Sumerian Planet X Nibiru, or the Babylonian Anunaki (that genetically engineered man from monkeys to serve as slaves to the aliens). The nazis recovered ancient arcane info when they raided the European theater for all the occult treasures. Secrets that were guarded for 100s or 1000's of years came into their possession and they were able to piece together the location of the crashed ship.

 

Another major point of interest is mothership zeta itself. If the alien companion is captured by the nazis they will learn (if they are able to comunicate with the E.T.) of mothership zeta and then the sh*t will really hit the fan. Nazis really shouldn't have gigantic ufo's with deathrays, it's just really bad news for everyone. So it's possible that zeta may be the final encounter in the mod (or trilogy of mods), since it is the ultimate prize.

 

Also we should consider area 51 as a target of interest for the nazis. I know a area 51 DLC hasn't been officially announced but I think we all know there will be one. I don't want to step on the toes of the forthcoming DLC, but it would be odd to have them visit anywhere near the mojave and not check out dreamland.

 

You know what else might be cool. If all the nazis awoke from the cryogenic sleep ghoulified. I mean the only way you can make nazis scarier is if they are undead. But not feral, just as intelligent and dangerous as when they were alive, but with the ghoulish appearance. Might also help in the storyline since the area was nuked with 3 separate bombs.

 

 

 

Well the crashed ship and nazis also relate to conspiracy/internet lore that is kid of intersting. So I thought I'd just jot down some of the stuff I came across researching the nazi antarctic link;

 

One is that the earth is hollow and a entrance into it exists in the antarctic. Depending on what page you check there is everything from "there is a whole world inside the hollow earth with it's own sun" all the way to "colossal subterranean caverns" which I guess is sort of the hp lovecraft mountains of madness view. The nazis have set up a empire in the hollow earth.

 

The second is that the aliens are in the hollow world. They have either set up base 1000's of years ago (ie it was atlantis, until the poles changed and catastrophe struck) or they are a reptilian native of earth and not really aliens at all, perhaps the humonoid descendants of the dinosaurs that escaped underground before the impact event that caused the extinction. They are millions of years ahead of us technologically, but had a civilization wide catastrophe and their race is dying out. They are attempting to use human DNA to continue their races existence. The nazi's have joined the aliens

 

So all that crazy (but cool) stuff I typed above is just a little piece of the stuff I'v run across with the antarctic nazi thing.

 

Why not have it that the Nazis actually figured out a way to cure ghoulification? I think I like the idea of huge hidden caverns underneath antarctica, now transformed into a Nazi community. The problem I have with the ghoul idea is the gamebryo's lack of diversity when it comes to ghouls - they're pretty much discoloured, noseless humans. This is in contrast to their old appearences where every Ghoul looked pretty different in the ways they fell apart.

 

Brain Fart: How about the Nazi's build a mini V-2 Rocket launcher that's used by a major boss - some kind of tank or whatever that would fire rockets at you, which would first rise high into the sky before coming right back down. You'd have the chance to shoot these down, subtley training the player for when the Nazis finally launch a huge Rocket that you'd have to pour all sorts of pain into - this is where the Experimental Revolver-Cannon could come in, using coils to accelerate its projectile at a rate fast enough to destroy the missile. It's target would be the Alien homeworld, the missile exploding like a MIRV to rain death-nukes all over the planet and kill off the alien race. Failing would cause ET to kill you in a rage.

 

Now...a trilogy you say? It's probably a bit early to start thinking about that, IMO your story would be great the way it is - self contained. However don't let that dissuade you. Since Antarctica is chapter 1, you should work the 'alien town' as a sort of hub for the trilogy. The crashed ship in the mojave could be like a base for the courier and the ET, with the occasional new companion joining in (a reformed Nazi?). If the final chapter is a return to Zeta, how are you gonna work in the human characters? Many of their items can't be used in New Vegas. Plus, there's the issues of voices. I can see Sally, the young girl, having grown up in that time (think as a larger child, older looking face with an adult outfit to give a sort of 'teenager' look), and Somah wears an outfit already present in NV, but what about Kago the samurai, Paulson and Elliot? I could imagine that perhaps they picked up new outfits - Kago's new outfit could combine aspects of his Samurai apparel with modern gear, Elliot would keep the armoured leggings but ditch the upper half of his armour for just the undershirt (with some kind of Anchorage-symbol underneath) while paulson...well, he could wear a retexed 'Republican' outfit and modified hat, coupled with a unique Sequioa.

 

Perhaps you could build this in a different way - you fight Nazis, save each Zeta member one by one, and by the end of the fight of them becomes a permanent companion before you commandeer the ship. Maybe at some point you can fight during a tense spacewalk, stuck in a clunky spacesuit and with nothing but a weak-ass recharger rifle to fend off jetpack Nazis. Anyway, If i remember correctly, the Lone wanderer supposedly destroyed Zeta's death ray - I'm guessing the weapon system used in fighting the other mothership mustn't have been as potent, and limited to ship-to-ship combat only. Otherwise Zeta should've been destroyed in one strike - you could blow a pretty noticeable crater into the planet's surface using the Death Ray just before you destroy it, so I can imagine the damage caused to a single ship. Anyway, I'm pretty sure there was a Fallout 3 mod that let you command a full crew in Zeta? Imagine working up from that - using the ship to attack various Nazi Satellite bases (converted from pre-war Space Bases) before landing on the Moon to fight the SPACE-FURHER! (okay, maybe not serious about that last part.)

 

But then what about Part 2?

 

Part 1: Antartica

Part 2: ???

Part 3: Zeta!

 

Maybe area 51 would be interesting - so far none of the announced dlc are set there, but I guess time will be the judge of that. What would the Nazis find so interesting though? A fully functional Mothership? Working Death Rays (as opposed to the destroyed Zeta Death Ray)? Perhaps their only manner of actually tracking and landing on board Zeta is through something at Area 51.

 

I'll leave it at that - sequel ideas don't need too much thought right now so concentrate on this current chapter, but keep the sequel potential in mind. You should come up with a clever sequel hook for the end though - perhaps the big bad makes his escape no matter what? You'd also have to figure out how your choices are carried over...

Edited May 23, 2011 by MajikMoshos