Learning from others and Etiquette

[lamaros]

What is the general philosophy among people here regarding how you acknowledge other people you have learned and borrowed from when you produce a mod?

 

I am currently trying to create a mod (http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=630931801) that is first and foremost a rebalanced difficulty/design of the tactical game (maybe strategy layer elements later), and have been slowly looking at way to bring that to a realisation. I have general goals and aims, as well as specific ways I hope to make the changes.

 

For those specific changes that I know how to do there is no interaction with my question here, but there are a few other areas where there is interaction:

 

1. Where I know what I want to do, but I'm not 100% how to do it until I've seen how someone else has done something similar.

 

2. Where I see an idea I hadn't thought of, and see how it could aid in my goals.

 

3. Where others have found a way to do something significant that I'd like to do, but which I can't find a different way to do myself.

 

In the first case I consider the situation a teaching example, and while I am learning from others I'm not really using their work and don't think it needs to acknowledged.

 

In the second case I'm still doing the work myself, but I'm also borrowing ideas or parts of ideas from others. How significant an idea does it have to be before you say "Ok, I should acknowledge them"?

 

In the third case others are able to generate an effect I would like to use in some way. What I have done so far with such things is ask the creator if they mind me using some of their code, and then acknowledging them in the mod, either in the mod files themselves, the mod description, or by adding them as a contributor to the mod in the workshop (as with EladDv's code for NCE).

 

I'm wondering what might happen in the future if there is some code that is useful, but that the creator might not be as open or easy to contact about. To what extent is it ok to borrow and re-write or repurpose other people's ideas and work for your own uses?

 

What are everyone else's thoughts on this?

Edited February 25, 2016 by lamaros

[Deleted32045420User]

As far as i am concerned, as long as you acknowledge that your work has borrowed some of my code in the description it's all ok, no need to get me in contributors as long as we didnt talk(which you should ALWAYS try to do with someone else's work) and decide otherwise together. i am not after a lot of fame in the general community (but after some limited recognition in the modding community as a helpful guy to have around) really as long as i am on the same page with the other people on the other side i am going to "allow" anything done with my code- you dont need my permission really to mess with my code and i'll always be there to help if anyone have any questions.

 

Now on my philosophy is that code is open source but you should mention where you've gotten the code from at the 3rd instance, the first and second one are more of an inspiration and less a use of code and thus i am not considering the original modder really responsible for code i wrote, i would post a "thank you, i've used this in my X mod"

[davidlallen]

Here is how it works in most modding communities I have been involved in. To some extent, every mod except the first few is based on the techniques of previous mods.

 

If you would like to straight out reuse assets (entire code classes, or graphics) from other mods, you must contact the author and get permission, and then you really should credit them in your mod. In case the author has dropped off the face of the earth, and you have made a reasonable effort to contact them, then you can *probably* reuse the asset, but you should definitely still credit them in your mod. Credit here means a prominent mention in the splash screen or the description. See my Armor Variety mod for one example; I reused the advent armor assets from Dor with his permission.

 

If you have learned some techniques from other modders, either from forum posts or from reading their published code, you should probably credit them, but it doesn't have to be as prominent. If you got one technique of UIListener from one person's mod, you don't have to religiously track each place. For a modder, it is nice to get a shout-out as an inspiration, just like appearing in the dedication of a published book.

 

If you have made up some new techniques, then you should write a guide or at least a forum post with what you learned, so that you can be credited by the next modder.

 

With any luck, we will not soon see a situation where money gets mixed in. If modders can charge for mods, then there can be all kinds of arguments about who contributed how much, and the whole thing will be a mess. So far the game companies appear to recognize this (Skyrim paid mods lasted what, two days?) I don't think we need to worry about that.

[mccordrm]

On my mod page at Steam, I clearly acknowledge where I grabbed code or an idea, with links to their page.

[Zyxpsilon]

Com'on... we're all just a bunch of Modders (of various skills & talents) that enjoy the same game here. It's the community of thoughts and shared ideas that lead to fantastic results.

 

As much as i'd love proper recognition for anything i create (past & future), it's the natural effect of our modern www and how freedom of association works. The trick is (or was -- already) to be quick (ironically, the release title of my first XC2 mod) enough to hold the major trigger that drives the unknown invisible crowds towards copy/cat attempts that can go both ways; better or worst.

Then, i can safely claim the current summit of a few HUD elements (Classes & Ranks colored) for XCom2 -- presently. :wink:

 

I went VERY public with two more major projects (GeoscApps & LAByrinth) in the last few weeks and i'm well aware of the risks. Anyone could plunge straight in similar ideas and beat me to the punch -- that's for sure. Yet -- here i am, staring at online Proofs preciously held in a binary stone monument named Nexus. Scan through it if you must and you'll find plenty of wild stuff signed by a proficient Red Spider member. And that's the point... reality is better than thinking aloud.

 

Soooooo, here's my policy (since you asked) --- DO what you must, as qUIckly as possible! :D

 

And just let the birds sing or flyby while praying they won't eat your lunch. :ninja:

Edited February 25, 2016 by Zyxpsilon

[lamaros]

Cheers for the replies all.