Making a Hunting and Survival Mod, Need Input...

[drewsbrew]

Hello all,

I'm starting work on a hunting and survival mod where the main idea is that you get more harvestable goods from animals; you will get more than one type of meat for each animal and you will get a realistic amount of meat too, you will also get internal organs (which can be eaten, and in some cases used to make other types of food-- like using intestines as sausage casings), you will also be able to get bones (which eventually will be used in crafting recipes), you will also get fat (which I would eventually make it usable in fires in the campfires mod by Chesko), blood (which will eventually be used to lure foxes and larger preaditory animals like wolves and bears).

For example, when you kill a rabbit you will be able to harvest a fur pelt which can be turned into leather strips and an entire skinned body which can be cooked whole, or cut into smaller parts; 2 hind legs (vanilla haunches) 2 front legs, stew meat, and maybe even ribs. You will also get the brain, heart, liver, and possibly lungs, a bowl of fat (mesh and textures will be based on Troll Fat), and a jar of blood. Also, after the meat is consumed, you will get the bones. The things that can be harvested from animals will depend on the type of animal; cows, deer, and elk will have tongues for example, some animals will have intestines (which, as I said, will be used to make sausage), some will have stomachs (which can be turned into water pouches), and so on.

 

In addition, the mod will also have new food recipes like rabbit stew for example, although I might not have these right away in the first version... I haven't decided yet. The first version of the mod will strictly consist of meshes and textures for all the new items, and recipes to cook the new food items, there won't be any scripts as I have been having a lot of trouble with my ScriptCompile.bat file, so I haven't even been able to get started learning how to script which is a big part of what's holding up progress on my crime and punishment overhaul mod. Don't worry (for those of you who are waiting on that mod) I haven't given up on it, nor will I.

 

This survival mod will also have new equipment, such as survival/hunting knives (which will eventually be required to harvest/loot anything from animals once I can get started scripting). There will be different knife designs that will be based on the races; there will be an Argonian, Breaton, Imperial, Nordic, Orcish, Redguard, and Woodelf variants for sure... maybe even all the races, I haven't decided yet. Here are quick design sketches for what I have in mind for the Argonian and Breaton knives;

 

 

 

There may eventually even be multiple types of hunting knives for each race. The main question I want to ask everyone is; what races are you most interested in seeing knives for? Also, for all of the die hard Kajiit and Argonian players out there, do any of you have any specific ideas of what a survival/hunting knife for those races should look like? I have literally never played as either of those races, and I don't know a huge amount about them but I want to make sure I get it right in terms of design features.

 

Also, what other features would you want to see in this mod? I'm very early on in the design stages so I am very open to suggestions right now, just keep in mind that I can't do much in terms of scripting at the moment.

Edited May 17, 2016 by drewsbrew

[csbx]

I only really roleplay hunter / survival playthroughs, so I'll offer some input.

 

Given that many people who adopt this style of play use campfire + frostfall + hunterborn + some form of needs mod + (optionally) Hunting in Skyrim, my main question when sizing up your mod is: what would it do that these mods don't ? It looks like Hunterborn is going the path of adding more knife varieties (the least interesting part of that mod in my opinion); it also yields organs and bones that you can craft with. I can see you're trying to add a little more detail there, including adding more recipes. But with the mods listed above, it seems there already is a pretty good variety--at least enough for believability.

 

I think there are gaps in those mods that you could attempt to fill. But my suggestion would be to have a good look at these mods to get a sense of what is missing.

 

The sketches are good. You should follow them through to 3d form.

[drewsbrew]

Thanks for the feedback csbx!

 

I'm planning on making this mod complement Campfires, Frostfall, and probably Last Seed when it comes out. In fact, I'm thinking about making a flint and striker set for starting fires because I don't like that you have to either use a torch or magic to light fires in Campfies. I'm not very familiar with Hunterborn or Hunting in Skyrim so I'll check those out. At a glance though, one thing I can say that will be different about my mod is that everything added will use high quality custom meshes and textures, it look like Hunterborn reuses vanilla models of some things in a lot of cases. I've seen other mods that add some of the things I want to add, but to me the meshes and textures don't always look right, and that is part of what motivated me to do my own. I know that won't be a big deal for everyone though. As far as what other gaps I'll fill, I don't know yet I'l have to take a closer look at the mods first, but since you use those what are some of the gaps you think they have?

[Shivala]

I recently began starting a survival playstyle and I love it. I use Campfires + Frostfall + Hunterborn. Hunterborn is a work of art to be honest, some experienced modcreators say it is masterfully made. That said, there are many variaties of playstyles, so maybe you can bring new things to the table. Personally I think there is room for more AI improvement for animals. Or at least a mod that combines it all. I already increased the speed and distance of detection of my deer for instance, because at first I could outrun them. Now I really need that one aim - one shot - one kill. (Very tough at level 1)

 

*This is also inspired from a recent real-life run in with a deer, when we saw eachother from a good distance there was no way I could ever outrun a deer, they are wicked fast*

Edited April 8, 2016 by Shivala

[YukiNoOkami]

Hunterborn is a work of art, especially with that taxonomy power that adds compatibility with other mods, because otherwise Bellyache's Dragons become Ice Wolves. XD

 

I have ideas for 2 or 3 versions with the same models, I guess is what I'm getting at here:

1: Replace the Hunterborn knives with your custom models and add them to the appropriate racial lists and act as Hunterborns knives with 1 or two custom/unique ones that you can find around the world.

2. Unique Racial Dagger version where it just adds 1 of each into special locations (Imperial knife in the Blue Palace, Khajiit knife with Ri'saad, Nord knife in Palace of the Kings, Altmer in the Thalmor Embassy?, Argonian knife from Madesi?, Redguard knife from Saadia?, Breton knife from Belethor?, Bosmer knife from the Drunken Huntsman?, Dunmer knife from Solstheim?, Orcish knife from Dushnikh Yal?) and then maybe a Dragonborn knife in High Hrothgar made out of Alduin's claw/tooth/bones because that'd be badass.

3. Add them alongside the Hunterborn knives and maybe take inspiration from the More Interesting Loot for Skyrim mod, because it has some racial enchantments. It could be like 'Bosmer Hunting Knife: This knife is fairly good at skinning and butchering from carcasses. It seems to be more useful in a Bosmer's hands, however.'

 

As for the more in-depth part of your hunting mod, I'll just say that trying to make a mod one step above Hunterborn is going to be a lot of work, but if you're in for it, do it. We can always use variety and different things on the Nexus. Just because its already done doesn't mean you can't put your ideas out there :D

 

 

I'm starting work on a hunting and survival mod where the main idea is that you get more harvestable goods from animals; you will get more than type of meat for each animal and you will get a realistic amount of meat too, you will also get internal organs (which can be eaten, and in some cases used to make other types of food-- like using intestines as sausage casings), you will also be able to get bones (which eventually will be used in crafting recipes), you will also get fat (which I would eventually make it usable in fires in the campfires mod by Chesko), blood (which will eventually be used to lure foxes and larger preaditory animals like wolves and bears).

For example, when you kill a rabbit you will be able to harvest a fur pelt which can be turned into leather strips and an entire skinned body which can be cooked whole, or cut into smaller parts; 2 hind legs (vanilla haunches) 2 front legs, stew meat, and maybe even ribs. You will also get the brain, heart, liver, and possibly lungs, a bowl of fat (mesh and textures will be based on Troll Fat), and a jar of blood. Also, after the meat is consumed, you will get the bones. The things that can be harvested from animals will depend on the type of animal; cows, deer, and elk will have tongues for example, some animals will have intestines (which, as I said, will be used to make sausage), some will have stomachs (which can be turned into water pouches), and so on.

Alright, I like this idea so far. More crafting and recipes and ways to incorporate the wildlife of Skyrim is always welcome, in my book.

Would you make animal fat compatible with the mods Hunterborn chose as well as using the fat as Campfires fuel? Wearable Lanterns and Lanterns and Candles

Blood would be an interesting addition. Maybe some potions using that blood, or recipes for buffs from Hircine?

All I can think is that you have a lot of fiddly little items that animals are breaking down into. Hunterborn kept it simple a bit with bones especially: Large Animal Bones and Small Animal Bones. Too many niche items and there won't be enough motivation to keep it in their load order. Brains, lungs, intestines might be pushing it, unless you really want that sausage, then intestines might be ok. Bowls of fat should only come from animals that actually have fat. Mudcrabs, Foxes, Rabbits, Wolves, and Goats shouldn't be too fatty, whereas Bears, Deer, Trolls, and Mammoths should be fairly fatty. Are you going to let the player collect materials like meat, blood, and fat from Dragons or have the option?

In addition, I the mod will also have new food recipes like rabbit stew for example, although I might not have these right away in the first version... I haven't decided yet. The first version of the mod will strictly consist of meshes and textures for all the new items, and recipes to cook the new food items, there won't be any scripts as I have been having a lot of trouble with my ScriptCompile.bat file...

Textures, Meshes and Recipes are all I need usually for my food. I just need it to work with iNeed. Others are probably going to want a RND patch for that.

You could probably just get away with minor food buffs like vanilla Skyrim until you get a good idea for other buffs. You might want to look at how the authors of Babette's Feast - Improved Cooking, Gromit's Cooking Recipes, and Herbal Tea chose to do their buffs, if you haven't already.

This survival mod will also have new equipment, such as survival/hunting knives (which will eventually be required to harvest/loot anything from animals once I can get started scripting). There will be different knife designs that will be based on the races; there will be an Argonian, Breton, Imperial, Nordic, Orcish, Redguard, and Bosmer variants for sure... maybe even all the races, I haven't decided yet.

There may eventually even be multiple types of hunting knives for each race. The main question I want to ask everyone is; what races are you most interested in seeing knives for? Also, for all of the die-hard Khajiit and Argonian players out there, do any of you have any specific ideas of what a survival/hunting knife for those races should look like? I have literally never played as either of those races, and I don't know a huge amount about them but I want to make sure I get it right in terms of design features.

Argonians are more of a tribal people in terms of style. They're very savage in Black Marsh, if you've heard the stories of the Dunmer being killed en masse by the lizards. They tend to keep in isolated groups and worship the Hist, strange trees that grow in Argonia/Black Marsh. I personally like to think that their style is more Aztec/Incan/Mayan in nature, with bright colors, geometric patterns, feathers and extravagant jewelry. It might help to look up Central American Native culture aspects to get a feel, if you want. Or look up Elder Scrolls Online for some racial armor/weaponry, though its good to generally take anything from ESO with a grain of salt, as it broke from Elder Scrolls lore almost entirely, but there are some good ideas in there.

Khajiit are more interesting stylistically. I've found that Khajiit clothing is Gypsy-like--well a lot of their culture is Gypsy-like--but their weapons are more Egyptian/Persian/Filipino in nature. Khopesh, Kukri, Scimitars, other curvy swords. I imagine that Redguards and Khajiit have similar roots in clothing and weaponry, due to being in desert-y areas. There's a site that I found through Beyond Skyrim: Filipino Weapons Peruse for something that appeals to you. :)

If you want, I could help draw some up. :3

Also, what other features would you want to see in this mod? I'm very early on in the design stages so I am very open to suggestions right now, just keep in mind that I can't do much in terms of scripting at the moment.

Maybe some rituals? Blood magic? Something similar? Blood Warpaints - equippable warpaint buffs?

Armor/weapons made of bone? Dragon stuff is cool, but if that's the only thing you can make out of bone, with all these dead things around you, that's kinda lame. I'd like maybe a Fox set, a Deer set, a Wolf set, and a Bear set. With animal pelt headdresses, bone armor plates and tooth/claw necklaces, etc. :3 Cooler alternatives to the generic Fur armor, I guess. :D

Hunting Perk tree through Campfires? Something similar to the Wayfarer Tree in Perkus Maximus, but for people who don't want a full overhaul to perk trees or are using a perk mod other than PerMa.

Hunter of Hircine quests? Something to do with hunting animals for the Prince of the Hunt. Something similar to the Glass Bow of the Hunt or whatever it is. :D

I'm sure I'll have more ideas later. I'm pretty good at ideas. :D

[drewsbrew]

Thanks for the feedback YukiNoOkami

 

You have a lot of great ideas I really like (some of which were/are already in the works as far as planning). I get what you mean when you pointed out that there may be too much complexity, too many misc items to collect, etc. I've thought about dialing it back a little, but it's something I go back and forth on. The main reason why I started to work on this mod was because I eventually plan to make a mod (or a series of mods) called 'Weapons and Armor of Tamriel' which at its core would be weapon and armor sets from all the regions of Tamriel outside of Skyrim. All of the down-to-earth stuff; iron, steel, leather armor, fur armor (where it makes sense) etc. As far as Valleneood, they really don't use a lot of metal in their weapons and armor, and they certainly don't use wood. According to this info, most of their weapons are made from stone and bone. Now here is the catch as far as making the mod; I don't want weapons from Vallenwood (or anywhere else for that matter) showing up in Skyrim which leaves me two options; 1) make them craftable or 2) make players use console commands to get them. I don't like option 2 at all, so they have to be craftable, which means animals in Skyrim need to drop bones. Which is exactly what got me started on this mod. Originally I was just going to make animal bone meshes and textures to use in the Vallenwood weapons and armor mod, but then I started thinking some people may want to role play as a Wood Elf who still follows the Green Pact, which would mean they couldn't waste any source of meat-- including organs. But then it started to seem like you'd get more meat from animal organs than the rest of it, which is when I decided to add more cuts of meat for each animal... that and it seems strange to me that if you kill a rabbit, you take the time to skin it, throw the pelt away for some reason, cut one hind leg off, then carry on? OK... Don't get me wrong, I know why Bethesda didn't waste time and resources making a super in-dept hunting/gathering system; it's not a main focus of the game and they have a timeline and budget. But I'm a mod author, I don't have to worry about a deadline or budget.... that said though, unless I can find a use for all the stuff I want to create, it's kinda pointless... it's jut junk that can't be used for anything which kind shoots the whole role playing thing in the foot. Anyway, I digress.

 

 

Your Ideas I Like;

As far as hunting knives go, I like your idea about having one knife for each race hidden at various locations around Skyrim. I was already thinking about having multiple variants of hunting knives for each of the races, what I think I'll do is I'll have an 'ultimate/master hunting knife' for each of the races that will be hidden at various locations, and several that are craftable. I also like the idea of having unique race specific enchantments on each of the knives, and I would probably base those on different hunting philosophies/strategies/methods for each of the races.

I also really like the idea of using blood in potions or as part of magic rituals to get buffs. I also want to make it so vampires will be able to drink animal blood in place of human blood if they choose, but animal blood wouldn't be as satisfying so they'd have to drink a lot more of it.

I really like the idea of having more Hircine quests! I'll probably do that, though I'm not sure when that will be done.

 

Already in the Works;

Animal pelt headdresses/fur armor and tooth and claw necklaces were things I was already planning on adding to this mod, however bone armor is a great idea I hadn't thought of. That would be a good way for me to use up all those bones I want to make.

Having a hunter skill/perk tree is something I would eventually like to have, and maybe even a cooking skill too, but as far as whether it will be added to campfires or not, I don't know. I'd love to do that, but I guess I'd probably have to talk to Chesko about it.

 

Requests/Suggestions/Questions and Everything Else;

As far as making the animal fat compatible with other mods like wearable lanterns and such, I suppose I can do that too, although I'd have to use that mod first to get a feel for it. I'm a big fan of Chesko's work but wearable lanterns isn't a mod I've used before.

As far as collecting meat and other things from dragons... I don't know yet, I'm still thinking about that one.

I plan on making this mod compatible with Last Seed for sure, and just for the sake of being accommodating I'd like to make patches for iNeed and RND as well, but I don't know how to do that yet.

 

If you're interested, I have actually done a little work on this mod besides just planning and concept art...

 

Here is the mesh and textures for the animal fat in 3DS Max;

 

http://orig03.deviantart.net/fb6e/f/2016/126/9/9/animalfat_by_drewsbrew-da1krzu.jpg

 

And here is a chicken egg retexture;

 

http://orig13.deviantart.net/ede8/f/2016/105/1/3/chicken_egg_by_drewsbrew-d9z1ltc.jpg

[drewsbrew]

Just another quick update, I recently discovered I was using a fairly old version of Campfires (I was using version 1.4, the current version is 1.7.1) anyway I downloaded the new version and I also discovered that Chesko has made a Campfires DevKit, and even posted tutorials for it on his website. Basically, the point is I can use the DevKit tool to add a hunting skill to the mod and I think even make the animal fat useable as fuel for campfires so those are features I will probably include in the first version of this mod. For those of you who are waiting on this mod/following progress, etc. you may want to keep an eye on my DeviantArt page because I'll be posting concept art for armor and weapons there. So far I plan to add rabbit, fox, wolf, bear, sabercat, and mammoth fur armors (which optionally can be upgraded to bone armors) and a deer/elk hide armor (which can also be upgraded to bone armor).

[Shivala]

Nice! Love to see your progression, the animal fat mesh looks really cool.

[drewsbrew]

Thanks Shivala, glad you like my work. Hey, I meant to ask you, how did you change the speed and detection range of deer in the CK? I don't know a huge amount about the CK myself, still learning a lot of things...