2016-05-12 Patch SDK Changes

[DerBK]

the game will just ignore any DLC shenanigans... its the same as when you start a new game and check the box to play related missions to the Alien Hunters DLC. If the checkbox is marked, the code will use those values, if not, will ignore them

 

You say that as if you know that for sure.

 

You are aware that any typos or unrecognized names in the SupportedFollower lists of units used to cause CTDs until the last patch fixed that?

This is exactly the same situation.

[LeaderEnemyBoss]

The addition of buckets is rather confusing to me, since they dont solve any of the problems we have with mod incompatibilities. We still cant add stuff to Inclusionlists, mission schedules, or buckets now without removing something first. As long as we have to remove stuff before we can add something, incompatibilities will happen. Its even more of a headache, because until now you could just choose to ignore other mods. But since DLCs use the same .ini-edits that we use, we will have to take into account what they do.

 

Also MaxCharactersPergroup is still not fixed for aliens :(

[DerBK]

Also MaxCharactersPergroup is still not fixed for aliens :sad:

 

Aliens are also not able to mix and match in their pod like Advent are, all aliens followers will always be the same. This shortcut in alien pod generation (that i believe was taken to make alien pods less chaotic) is responsible for also skipping over MaxCharactersPerGroup. It also makes pods in games with increased enemy squad size look terrible, because you always get a leader and four identical followers. :/

 

That restriction is a huge pain in my virtual butt. And since it's anchored in the native code, we can't even reach it. Annoying.

Edited May 17, 2016 by DerBK

[LeaderEnemyBoss]

 

Also MaxCharactersPergroup is still not fixed for aliens :sad:

 

Aliens are also not able to mix and match in their pod like Advent are, all aliens followers will always be the same. This shortcut in alien pod generation (that i believe was taken to make alien pods less chaotic) is responsible for also skipping over MaxCharactersPerGroup. It also makes pods in games with increased enemy squad size look terrible, because you always get a leader and four identical followers. :/

 

That restriction is a huge pain in my virtual butt. And since it's anchored in the native code, we can't even reach it. Annoying.

 

 

Well .... there may be a way. A "pseudo" highlander mod that ignores the selected mission data of the game entirely and instead implements its own spawning mechanism. I already did slight alterations to spawned enemies in a mission in my riftkeeper mod, its actually pretty easy. I used it to add my enemy to the final mission while circumventing the use of missions.ini. A more competent person could probably write a completely new spawnsystem.

 

What I know so far:

- pods get generated during the mission caching

- mission caching happens either at the start of the tactical mission, or as soon as the mission is clicked on the map when a shadow chamber is present

- mission caching can be initiated manually via screenlistener. One can also add or remove encounters after caching is complete. It should even be possible to remove or add single members to generated pods.

- the next thing I want to try in my mod is to check, if too many riftkeepers spawned in a given mission, and replace them with something different manually

 

 

EDIT: "pseudo"-highlander because while a mod doesnt need to be highlander to mess with pod spawning, it probably shouldnt be done by more than one mod at a time because bad things will happen.

Edited May 17, 2016 by LeaderEnemyBoss

[Hyperplexed]

Typos in code break things? Other flash news: Earth revolves around the sun, and water is wet! This is not the same situation at all! This is about game design and development. Besides, I already pointed out... there's already an option in game to disable/enable the missions related to Alien Hunters, I would assume that, that very same code is being used for ppl who don't own the DLC, but, I can be wrong ofc, and XCOM2 devs are just having a huge brain fart, by not using the code ALREADY implemented, to disable this specific content.

 

Developing expansions and DLCs for already existing games, is a cornerstone in game developing, I'm sure a dev team such as the one from Firaxis, with lots of experience in game development and releasing content DLCs for already existing games, surely have enough experience to think on how to develop, and forsee these issues. Any game from any major development company already has these concerns when developing expansions/DLCs. Heck, even I, that only do mods, have that concern, why wouldn't the team that developed the game have too? This is not a bug, its not something that got slipped away because that specific scenario didnt happened, don't compare both situations as if they were the same, because they are not... besides, who in their right mind would maintain 2 different sets of code? I'm sure that would only create more problems, rather than fix them.

[DerBK]

Typos in code break things? Other flash news: Earth revolves around the sun, and water is wet! This is not the same situation at all! This is about game design and development. Besides, I already pointed out... there's already an option in game to disable/enable the missions related to Alien Hunters, I would assume that, that very same code is being used for ppl who don't own the DLC, but, I can be wrong ofc, and XCOM2 devs are just having a huge brain fart, by not using the code ALREADY implemented, to disable this specific content.

 

Developing expansions and DLCs for already existing games, is a cornerstone in game developing, I'm sure a dev team such as the one from Firaxis, with lots of experience in game development and releasing content DLCs for already existing games, surely have enough experience to think on how to develop, and forsee these issues. Any game from any major development company already has these concerns when developing expansions/DLCs. Heck, even I, that only do mods, have that concern, why wouldn't the team that developed the game have too? This is not a bug, its not something that got slipped away because that specific scenario didnt happened, don't compare both situations as if they were the same, because they are not... besides, who in their right mind would maintain 2 different sets of code? I'm sure that would only create more problems, rather than fix them.

You clearly did not get yet what i was saying.

 

How about you shift back a gear or two and read again before making an even bigger ass of yourself.

[davidlallen]

Thanks for the info about the incompatible change to missions.ini. For Hostile Territory (the one with the human enemies), there was only a small part of the mod I could accomplish with -/+ in the ini file. We have discussed in a few other threads about the limitations of that (mixing leaders from mod A with followers from mod B). I wonder what problem they were solving with buckets, it doesn't sound like it solves that problem. Once two mods (or one mod and one dlc) start editing the same section of the ini with -/+, the results will rarely be correct.

 

I wound up doing a lot of my key changes to the mission.ini data structures using uc in a screenlistener. Although ini file editing is nice, I feel it runs out of steam fairly quickly. I recommend thinking about editing the mission data using uc instead.

[DerBK]

Eh, the bucket thing does help a bit.

Thanks to it, the mission schedules don't need to be updated with additional entries.

It also adds the functionality of "choose one of these pods at random at this spot" where you were only able to define one pod before.

 

Just imagine if the DLC had to edit the mission schedules to fit the rulers in. That would've broken a lot more mods because it's higher in the hierarchy.

 

 

But yes, it doesn't help as far as mod conflicts are concerned. And we have to treat the DLC as a mod, i guess.

[LeaderEnemyBoss]

Eh, the bucket thing does help a bit.

Thanks to it, the mission schedules don't need to be updated with additional entries.

It also adds the functionality of "choose one of these pods at random at this spot" where you were only able to define one pod before.

 

Just imagine if the DLC had to edit the mission schedules to fit the rulers in. That would've broken a lot more mods because it's higher in the hierarchy.

 

 

But yes, it doesn't help as far as mod conflicts are concerned. And we have to treat the DLC as a mod, i guess.

 

Quote from the gamefiles (XGGameData) regarding encounter buckets:

 

"The list of possible encounters and the conditions under which they are permissible. When evaluated, the first eligible encounter in this list will be selected."

 

So no randomization it seems.

 

The DLC could just add the ruler after mission caching happened. This would probably a pretty clean and compatible solution. Find the boss pod, roll a dice, decide whether to replace it or not.

Edited May 17, 2016 by LeaderEnemyBoss

[DerBK]

 

Eh, the bucket thing does help a bit.

Thanks to it, the mission schedules don't need to be updated with additional entries.

It also adds the functionality of "choose one of these pods at random at this spot" where you were only able to define one pod before.

 

Just imagine if the DLC had to edit the mission schedules to fit the rulers in. That would've broken a lot more mods because it's higher in the hierarchy.

 

 

But yes, it doesn't help as far as mod conflicts are concerned. And we have to treat the DLC as a mod, i guess.

 

Quote from the gamefiles (XGGameData) regarding encounter buckets:

 

"The list of possible encounters and the conditions under which they are permissible. When evaluated, the first eligible encounter in this list will be selected."

 

So no randomization it seems.

 

The DLC could just add the ruler after mission caching happened. This would probably a pretty clean and compatible solution. Find the boss pod, roll a dice, decide whetether to replace it or not.

 

 

Okay, so no randomization. Great. There goes my idea how to easily make some more interesting alien pods -.-