Fallout: Hawaii?

[devinpatterson]

The isles would themselves be "vaults" or more accurately an Eden, with terraforming and laser defense grids etc. to keep it "pure" and whole through the ages.

THe main problem I had plotwise was what to do with them; having the player "shake things up" in the capitol of an old world pacific empire just didn't make sense, and having a "rebellion" somehow surviving in the heartland also seemed incredulous, barring the support/tolerance of an incumbent faction/clan. I threw the Nazi idea out there mainly because I'd enjoy plotting a rather large war between them. :P

 

I know this was a while back when I mentioned it, but if I recall correctly you were ok with the idea of a Japanese invasion? Did you ever get a chance to contact brothershogo about assets, he's got some amazing models? I bring it up because an empire vs a empire would probably fit the scale of the war you looking for. The Nazi's being very powerful but very few, would be a completely different kind of war (esp with their alien tech). So I'v just started the thread and after the PM you sent me is Hawaii still the focus or would it be more Nicaragua? Or is it going to cover the whole arena including both locals?

[TrooperScooperMKII]

I'm going to shift to a Nicaragua colonial rebellion against a proxy government, sort of like the NCR re: House/an independent Vegas. Only the HE is "friendlier" with the locals and far more powerful and in a better position to strike back.

A follow up could be an oregon trail type "pirate" expedition in the Caribbean, fighting for/against pseudo-state West Indies Trade companies.

[devinpatterson]

Basically, it would nominally be a satellite state of the Hawaii Empire. IRL Nicaragua managed to "beat" the cold war and throw off a dictatorship and thwart US "intervention" under Reagan- despite being the second poorest nation on earth, it's got a near 100% literacy rate and a stable democracy that elected the first Female Head of State of the Americas... so it's something of a "happy" ending for them.

 

Fallout-version is basically the inverse- they did maintain "independence" but under a pro-corporate dictatorship-empire spanning a good part of Central America. They built a canal linking LakeNicaragua to the Pacific and Caribbean Seas, basically being a second Panama.

 

I'm going for an Aztec-2.0 feeling here- the island in the center would be sort of like Tenochtitlan, expanded greatly (some floating platforms and a cruise ship or two "incorporated" into it a la rivet city) and the player and a crashed squad of Enclave fugitives playing the unwitting role of COrtez (they're fleeing west to Hawaii, get shot down by the BOomers and land for repairs in Searchight- the PC gets the Boomers to repair the ship- so they decide to make a detour far to the south to avoid the NCR and Baja California... thus entering the New Mexica's (New Aztec? Hispanic Empire?) airspace and getting shot down) in the dispute between the "primitive" native tribes and the city/empire in the lake.

 

The Hawaiian empire shows up only by proxy, limited to an an embassy and small coast guard type fleet/militia sent there to "keep the peace" and back up their erstwhile imperial allies (and guarantee the tribute is being paid- their "colonies" are basically a tribute system whereby they support local despots in exchange for goods or labor) but the commander has a grudge against slavery (he started out as a white knight type leader, was forced to put down a "terrorist rebellion" in Africa by slaughtering civilians at the whims of an a**hole patrician slavedriver accompanying him, and eventually kills the evil bastard and does a double coverup of the slave operations and the bugger's death...) and thus has mixed feelings on the whole thing- he might swing either way, reluctantly supporting the ruling class or "having other matters to attend to" and withdrawing his fleet/soldiers just before the rebellion starts.

 

Oh yeah, look at Granadas history- if/when this gets off the ground, I'd definitely like to make a "pirate mod" in the Caribbean, basically operating like Oregon Trail, where you plan an expedition at Home Base by balancing equipment, experience, skills, personalities, etc. of your potential crew members and procure a ship and equipment before sailing out and adventuring... it would be "pirate" themed in the same way that New Vegas proper has a Western theme.

[devinpatterson]

THe rough outline as I'm picturing it: sometime after completing the Boomers' questline, there's a scripted series of "fireworks" over Nellis: an ENclave vertibird tried to land there and got flak for their trouble. One of the engines is knocked out, so they land at searchlight to effect repairs; the player learns of this either by chance (down there) or by asking Pearl what happened.

Anyway, long story short, the player gets the Boomers to fix the engine, rides the VB from Searchlight to Nellis and is- grudgingly- offered a seat on board. They are planning to reach Hawaii, by virture of being "an Eden far away from this s***hole" but their run in with the BOomers speaks against flying over NCR territory or the Baja. THey're/you're forced further south due to continuing mechanical problems (cabin depressurization or something?) and a storm out in the pacific leading the squad leader to suggest a pit stop somewhere. They're in the middle of discussing this when they/you are attacked by UAVS out of Nicaragua, and finally downed by "lightning" striking down nearby (a near miss by killsat balloons, as you eventually find out) and you bail over the FEV jungle.

The pilot is the last to jump, and you don't meet up with him (or know for sure if he made it out) until a lot further on, basically I'm picturing him riding a hacked UAV down after in Strangelove style.

THe first priority for the player and his "group" is to get to the crash site, which is also in the general directon of Lake Managua. After trekking across the jungle (it wouldn't have any fast travel markers and such, basically all terrain and critters, with a few tribal villages thrown in for good measure) and reaching the crash site they find a message from the pilot and grab some gear, making their way down Lake Managua.

 

Managua is a s***hole; polluted by FEV and rads, it was an isolated "research" station for the local empire's navy (old US equipment) plus a few other "military" targets.

 

The highlight is basically about a "cloning" facility that the player encounters. One big mindscrew, it starts out as an unnervingly pristine (so white it glows on the inside) set of sterile hallways, beds made etc. basically looking like it's just been deserted... eventually the player encounters the "infected" which are silent and scarred (no clothes/armor, custom skin textures) and carrying "dirty syringes" or scalpels etc. as weapons- quite weak with a mild poison effect, the main part of it being the natural fear of needles. SOme of them are "dressed" in the patient gown from OWB; some of these have suicide vests/collars, and will drop live grenades upon death (and/or charge the player and explode) the only way to tell for sure is that they wouldn't have a weapon in hand.

 

IF possible I'd like for the player to be cloned, and kill said clone in an arena or something. It would be utterly ambiguous whether or not you're playing the "original" and perhaps a perk (cogito ergo sum?) would back that up. Anyway, you steal a barge and take a ride down Tipitapa river, dodgingBull sharks (sharks with lasers? It must be so!) all the way. Speaking of which IRL these bull sharks can jump the rapids of the San Juan River like salmon o_O and thus get to/from the Caribbean to Lake Nicaragua....

[devinpatterson]

I'm starting to go through the thread (thought that even if HE is no longer the center I should still read the whole thread for backstory/context), as I'm working on a exceedingly painful script. So I'm just gonna fire out some questions from your last posts and then I'll probably need clarifications from various parts of the thread.

 

I'm going to shift to a Nicaragua colonial rebellion against a proxy government......The Hawaiian empire shows up only by proxy

 

So do you plan on dropping the empire vs empire war from the mod and leaving it as back story (or future work when the player reaches HE)?

 

I'm going for an Aztec-2.0 feeling here- the island in the center would be sort of like Tenochtitlan

 

If you were to make structures similar to Tenochtitlan (but you know, steel and glass), those geometric shapes look relatively simple. I'm guessing they'd be less work than most buildings.

 

http://www.kqed.org/assets/img/arts/blog/Tenochtitlan2.jpg

 

I might be going off on a tangent that doesn't even apply, but, here goes anyway.....

 

So I snagged a s-load of heavy metal magazines (the graphic mags, not the musical genre) when I was a kid. One of the stories I really liked was the Nikopol Trilogy by Enki Bilal (later made into a movie). I can't remember much of the details, but if I recall correctly in the future a "version" of the Egyptian immortals and their rule, have returned after two massive nuclear wars. They watch over the city in a giant floating pyramid of glass and steel.

 

 

In actuality they are simply highly advanced humans (genetically engineered and cyber technology) that have the Egyptian gods attributes (Horus for instance has a hawk head, Anubis a jackal etc.). The character/personality/purview follow closely their gods namesakes. For instance Horus is a a positive force and generally champions and aids the humans. Anubis's purview is over the massive cryo complex where the sick, dying and prisoners are stored. But many of the other "gods" are much less charitable and have little regard for most humans. Notably Set who in a vein similar to the actual Egyptian deity was not a good cookie for the Egyptians.

 

Though they are physically imposing (stronger, faster and far more intelligent than normal humans) their real power comes from their big brother style technology that lets them constantly stay several steps ahead of the humans and their rebels. Their weakness is their extreme hubris and the tendency to underestimate the normal humans.

 

In the story he's (Horus) been deposed and finds a human astronaut returning to earth after decades in deep freeze. He (astronaut) finds France ruled by a fascist gov of these gods. If I remember right, Horus uses the astronaut to overthrow the "gods" rule and restore humanity to self governance.

 

Long story short, I don't know anything about Aztec gods, nor about the tech level your describing (I'm just going off of what I saw in HE, with the terraforming and laser defense grids). But it might be cool to have some "living gods" in (Aztec style/mythology) for your Aztec 2.0 scenario (due to genetic engineering, fev, cybertech, what have you) that are the seat of power. If they are advanced enough technologically they would make formidable opponents as would their 1984 tech. The player too could be aided by Horus to overthrow his corrupt brethren.

 

If the tech level is wrong, just ignore all the above....

[TrooperScooperMKII]

 

 

So do you plan on dropping the empire vs empire war from the mod and leaving it as back story (or future work when the player reaches HE)?

THe latter, mainly, planty of colonial "visits" beforehand to highlight the power/reach of the senate, so when you show up and expect a Star Wars level tyranny but you find squabbling patricians with delusions of grandeur, you're perhaps a bit disappointed (or miffed) that these petty bandits could somehow conquer the world, pretty much on the sole basis of having survived the war intact. :tongue: So when the Caesar (presumably) comes along and rants about how ineffectual and pitiful the "Senate" is (and how an autocrat could get things done) you could justify supporting his brand of tyrannny vs. the extant oligarchy (or go the other way, under the belief that a stronger central gov't would be even more oppressive/corrupt than what already exists).

In that vein, what other locales would be feasible/enjoyable followups? THere's the valley of Quito which could be a "failed" (or "unintentional") Eden-Enclave, the Incas to Nicaragua's Aztecs; given the location and probable isolation, one could easily imagine a more "primitive" and highly insular society than in Nicaragua, the elite (assuming there are any) descendants of tourists/the "vault people" or such becoming inbred xenophobe hyper-nationalists, ruling over or alongside nativists.

 

If you were to make structures similar to Tenochtitlan (but you know, steel and glass), those geometric shapes look relatively simple. I'm guessing they'd be less work than most buildings.

 

http://www.kqed.org/assets/img/arts/blog/Tenochtitlan2.jpg

 

Steel, Glass, and stone (or facades that look like stone, anyway) they'd have a strong "nationalist" bent (i.e. the Black Panthers for Latin America) on both sides of the asylum, left and right and the "moderate" ruling class would presumably channel that & see themselves as heirs to the sungod or Montezuma or something..

 

I might be going off on a tangent that doesn't even apply, but, here goes anyway.....

 

So I snagged a s-load of heavy metal magazines (the graphic mags, not the musical genre) when I was a kid. One of the stories I really liked was the Nikopol Trilogy by Enki Bilal (later made into a movie). I can't remember much of the details, but if I recall correctly in the future a "version" of the Egyptian immortals and their rule, have returned after two massive nuclear wars. They watch over the city in a giant floating pyramid of glass and steel.

 

 

In actuality they are simply highly advanced humans (genetically engineered and cyber technology) that have the Egyptian gods attributes (Horus for instance has a hawk head, Anubis a jackal etc.). The character/personality/purview follow closely their gods namesakes. For instance Horus is a a positive force and generally champions and aids the humans. Anubis's purview is over the massive cryo complex where the sick, dying and prisoners are stored. But many of the other "gods" are much less charitable and have little regard for most humans. Notably Set who in a vein similar to the actual Egyptian deity was not a good cookie for the Egyptians.

 

Though they are physically imposing (stronger, faster and far more intelligent than normal humans) their real power comes from their big brother style technology that lets them constantly stay several steps ahead of the humans and their rebels. Their weakness is their extreme hubris and the tendency to underestimate the normal humans.

 

In the story he's (Horus) been deposed and finds a human astronaut returning to earth after decades in deep freeze. He (astronaut) finds France ruled by a fascist gov of these gods. If I remember right, Horus uses the astronaut to overthrow the "gods" rule and restore humanity to self governance.

 

Long story short, I don't know anything about Aztec gods, nor about the tech level your describing (I'm just going off of what I saw in HE, with the terraforming and laser defense grids). But it might be cool to have some "living gods" in (Aztec style/mythology) for your Aztec 2.0 scenario (due to genetic engineering, fev, cybertech, what have you) that are the seat of power. If they are advanced enough technologically they would make formidable opponents as would their 1984 tech. The player too could be aided by Horus to overthrow his corrupt brethren.

 

If the tech level is wrong, just ignore all the above....

"Gods" with superior biology/science (any sufficiently advanced tech is indistinguishable from magic, Arthur Clarke) and god-sized egos... one of my favorite forms of conflict. :devil:

Sounds a bit like Stargate, IIRC they did something similar, with Ra (?) as the main alien villain.

[devinpatterson]

In that vein, what other locales would be feasible/enjoyable followups?

 

Your probably asking the wrong guy. I know very little about north American history much less south American.

 

THere's the valley of Quito which could be a "failed" (or "unintentional") Eden-Enclave, the Incas to Nicaragua's Aztecs; given the location and probable isolation, one could easily imagine a more "primitive" and highly insular society than in Nicaragua, the elite (assuming there are any) descendants of tourists/the "vault people" or such becoming inbred xenophobe hyper-nationalists, ruling over or alongside nativists.

 

Or take a much darker path. Even though point lookout was a relatively small pop center (compared to say DC) it still got hit hard from the residual fallout. They actually mutated worse than most humans in the DC wasteland. I have no idea why that would be, but if you follow a similar line with native Incan descendants (I guess that'd be the Peruvians and areas close by) you could have them regress mentally and physically, like the point lookout inhabitants. Maybe have them fall back into their ancient beliefs (including human sacrifice).

 

Then have these ramshackle tourist resorts (are there many/any in that area?) Occupied by the descendant refuges from North American (maybe some European blood?) tourists. Better armed, technologically advanced etc, but a minuscule minority barricaded in their resorts (converted to fortresses) that havn't left in generations. I know some of the tourist resorts in Mexico are massive, on par with small towns. No idea about the area we're discussing, but in fallouts overly capitalistic and opportunistic/imperialistic America, I could see business men marching right in wherever they see a potential money maker.

 

 

the "moderate" ruling class would presumably channel that & see themselves as heirs to the sungod or Montezuma or something....."Gods" with superior biology/science (any sufficiently advanced tech is indistinguishable from magic, Arthur Clarke) and god-sized egos... one of my favorite forms of conflict. :devil:

Sounds a bit like Stargate, IIRC they did something similar, with Ra (?) as the main alien villain.

 

Yeah essentially using the peoples own traditions/beliefs against them. Is there a big enough delta/difference in technology between the oppressed Tenochtitlan population and the HE oppressors for them to pull of the mantle of god hood? If so it might be a good direction.....people tend to like mythology thrown into present/future settings.

[greenknightfury]

As to why the Point Lookout folks were mostly more mutated than DC locals: If you read the medical pamphlets/ notes you discovered there was an odd disease spreading through the population there prewar that had symptoms just like the mutations they had, deformities, weird swellings, hostility and such. The radiation and isolation/inbreeding just helped it along so only those born immune to it (like the kid in the cave and a few others) weren't like that. Most of the "normal" folks you met with had been travelers that went there (the cultists the guy running the one store).

[greenknightfury]

Definitely endorse the idea of some "techno-gods", post-apoc fiction tends to have them and it seems perfectly fitting that you could find a few somewhere on Fallout Earth.

 

A couple of advanced Zax comps in a valley full of primitives could play "war games" with their own little religious armies...perhaps they or some highly tech advanced vaultdwellers would be a good way to do this..just using some tribe(s) in a large mountain plateau/valley that they use their superior knowledge and tech to rule as gods. A scenario grows in my mind!! (we need to find a good placement for it though)

 

A isolated plateau/valley(s) has been blessed by the Gods walking among it's people:

 

1.) God of the Dead: A ghoul that was, Pre-War, an eminent scientist forced to run far from civilization when his very unpopular politics made him a target for elimination. Secretly constructing over time a hide away in caverns far from cities so that he would have a safe place to hide out, his home is now considered the Underworld by the tribals nearby, and his vast array of tools, weapons and various things he has created in the 200-odd years since running, marking him as a god to the same tribals. (The caverns could have been/be nearby old Uranium mines, that and some materials he's been exposed to during his work without a proper lab safety setup explaining the ghoulification.

 

2.) The new gods: more recently new gods have emerged from the forbidden place/mountain/cave. Anyone that went there was killed by spears of light or thunder sounds which struck so mightily it tore holes in their flesh and turned some of their flesh to metal (lasers and guns of defense systems). Now their strange appearance and wondrous abilities have let them become the masters of the people.

[TrooperScooperMKII]

I'm considering starting a new thread later for the colony aspect; need to get my thoughts in order...

Anyway, a quick zeppelin model; I intend to add an observation "deck" between the bottom two fins in back, and some suites either on top or bottom in the middle.

http://img809.imageshack.us/img809/3818/zeppelina.png