Karma System

[The10thJinchuuriki]

Just wanted to re-post this now that the CK has been released. I understand that it's still in a "beta" stage, and still might not be capable of achieving this level of modding, but some of you out there are crazy at what you're able to pull off. So, Here's my idea of how to implement Karma back into Fallout 4

 

As we all know, there's not really a Karma system in place, except for Companions (which I honestly really like). And lately, I've been thinking of how Karma could be implemented into Fallout 4 the way the game currently is, and I think I've come up with something that could work fairly well. The first thing would be to add a Karma tracker, located somewhere in the Stats section (or perhaps have its own tab in the Stats section). The tracker would start off at 0 (neutral), and whenever the player does or says something with good intentions, they'll gain positive karma, causing the karma tracker to go positive. Vise Versa for whenever the player does or says something immoral, they'll lose points, and eventually go on the negative side of the tracker.

 

Gaining Karma would be effected whenever the player successfully persuades someone using something inspiring, sympathetic, or overall helpful, killing legendary bad guys, helping settlements, and so on. Losing Karma, obviously, would be the opposite, in the sense of persuading people by being harsh or mean, talking people into giving you more caps for something, killing innocent people, and so on. Joining a certain faction won't effect anything with your Karma, considering all factions could be argued as good or evil, so it comes down to your personal preference. But, once you officially join a faction, anything good or bad towards that faction will cause you to gain or lose Karma.

 

Now, what exactly does gaining and loosing Karma do? Well, unlike the previous games where it could effect how the overall world sees you, it would be more focused on how your character plays through the world. Each time you reach a Karma milestone (every 10 points in either direction, possibly?), you'll gain a perk (and lose a perk if you go below the requirements of that perk), and get a bonus (and debuffs) in stats. Here are some quick ideas of how each side of Karma can benefit you (these aren't the effects you'll get in order, just random ideas):

 

Positive Karma:

-Increase in Charisma, making persuasion dialogues easier in a nice way, but mean persuasions (including the demand for more caps) becomes more difficult.

-Bartering is cheaper to buy, and you get more caps from selling

-companions can take more damage before falling in combat (debuff - raiders can also take more damage, OR perhaps appear in greater numbers, but not both)

-you can have more companions follow you (I am aware there's already a mod for that, so this perk might be obsolete)

-have people give you some materials for free when you speak with them (random civilians)

-possibly something to do with Settlements, like increase in population size, or stronger settlers (again, I know there are mods for this, this is just an idea)

 

Negative Karma:

-Raiders will sometimes tend to ignore you

-Easier to persuade people in a mean way (including the demand for more caps), but makes it harder to persuade in a nice way

-Raiders and Super Mutants hesitate to hurt you (less accurate)

-Raiders (and maybe Super Mutants as well) will become your settlers instead of normal people (this is more meant for when you have high Negative Karma)

-Increase in stealth, and able to steal things a little bit more easily

-Increase in accuracy (or AP regeneration) due to your maddening killing frenzies (though, this could also be a perk for Positive Karma :\ )

 

Again, these are just ideas, and I realize there might be some imbalance issues, but these are very much subject to change. But the overall idea is that the more positive you are in Karma, the more benefits you'll get out of people and companions, though the drawback being raiders and super mutants want to kill you a little bit more. And the more negative you are in Karma, the less you'll have to deal with raiders and super mutants, though the drawback being that people don't take kindly to you. That's the idea of balance I'm going for, and of course, tweaks, changes, adding, and taking out things are definitely open to thought to really make it feel like 2 different sides of the same coin.

 

If anyone has any ideas, please share, and I'll considering updating and adding it to the description here!

 

And if anyone thinks they can start to work on it now (get a head start kinda thing), and then really bring it home when the CK comes out, please let me know! I would love to track and follow the progress! I hope people find this an interesting (and good) way of implementing Karma back into Fallout, because I sure as hell miss it, and I believe this is a good way to at least bring something back that represents Karma :)

[Fenryr3001]

Eh.Not really a fan of the "the nicer you are the stronger strangers are" thing.I'd suggest just making strangers more eager to help you if someone attacks you.

 

Super Mutants and raiders ignoring you because you are a psychopath doesn't really make sense either.

 

In my opinion it should be

Good:Less caps,but better endings for other people

 

Evil:More caps,but things go to s#*!

 

I also think persuasion should be easier when you are good,and intimidation harder.And vice versa for being evil.

[The10thJinchuuriki]

Eh.Not really a fan of the "the nicer you are the stronger strangers are" thing.I'd suggest just making strangers more eager to help you if someone attacks you.

 

Super Mutants and raiders ignoring you because you are a psychopath doesn't really make sense either.

 

In my opinion it should be

 

Good:Less caps,but better endings for other people

 

Evil:More caps,but things go to s***

 

I also think persuasion should be easier when you are good,and intimidation harder.And vice versa for being evil.

I don't get why people always argue "raiders being nice doesn't make sense". You gotta realize, this is a game where you can freeze time, and even though your gun's barrel is point blank in an enemy's face, you still have a 5% chance of missing...

 

Like I said in my post, things are bound to change, but I think we can still suspend our disbelief a bit. The concept I'm going for is that the more negative karma you build, the more you become like a raider

 

And I did already mention in the post, that you'd get perks to enhance persuasion in a good way, the higher in good karma you go (and vise versa).

Edited May 26, 2016 by The10thJinchuuriki

[Fenryr3001]

Alrighty then.Why don't we make knives deal blunt damage then?Or making armour increase your speed but lower your defenses?You can freeze time in this game,so the former things aren't that far off?

 

 

One raider doesn't automatically like the other.It's like expecting someone who likes spaghetti to like you because you like spaghetti as well.And Super Mutants seem to just kill everything thats not a super mutant on sight.If I remember correctly,Super Mutants actually attack raiders if they meet.

[The10thJinchuuriki]

Alrighty then.Why don't we make knives deal blunt damage then?Or making armour increase your speed but lower your defenses?You can freeze time in this game,so the former things aren't that far off?

 

 

One raider doesn't automatically like the other.It's like expecting someone who likes spaghetti to like you because you like spaghetti as well.And Super Mutants seem to just kill everything thats not a super mutant on sight.If I remember correctly,Super Mutants actually attack raiders if they meet.

Come on man, I'm at least trying to come up with something. I get that there needs to be "some" logical sense, but it seems like you're just trying to bat down my ideas.

 

And with Super Mutants, you can have super mutants as companions, in both Fallout 3 and 4. So that clearly shows not *all* muties hate humans

 

Also, if you're going to argue "Raiders aren't friends with other raiders", then how are there raider gangs? Why isn't it literally "every raider for themselves"? My idea isn't "raiders from other gangs join you", but more of "you start your own raider group". If that's illogical, then explain how the Viper gang, Fiends, Jackals, and other gangs were ever formed? It's even stated in the Fallout wiki that raiders don't typically attack other raiders. So, if you're going to be evil, why can't you start your own raider gang?

[Stickman939]

Alrighty then.Why don't we make knives deal blunt damage then?Or making armour increase your speed but lower your defenses?You can freeze time in this game,so the former things aren't that far off?

 

 

One raider doesn't automatically like the other.It's like expecting someone who likes spaghetti to like you because you like spaghetti as well.And Super Mutants seem to just kill everything thats not a super mutant on sight.If I remember correctly,Super Mutants actually attack raiders if they meet.

 

Why are you salty at the idea of a reputation/karma system that has been in the last few games?

 

And so what you don't like it? Nobody is gonna care whether or not you download this potential mod. At all.

[OddinMasse]

You know what this reminds me of... where are the groups of mercs and assassins sent to kill you because you pissed off the wrong person? That's one aspect from Skyrim that really should have carried over to this game. Needs more death squads.

[Fenryr3001]

 

Alrighty then.Why don't we make knives deal blunt damage then?Or making armour increase your speed but lower your defenses?You can freeze time in this game,so the former things aren't that far off?

 

 

One raider doesn't automatically like the other.It's like expecting someone who likes spaghetti to like you because you like spaghetti as well.And Super Mutants seem to just kill everything thats not a super mutant on sight.If I remember correctly,Super Mutants actually attack raiders if they meet.

Come on man, I'm at least trying to come up with something. I get that there needs to be "some" logical sense, but it seems like you're just trying to bat down my ideas.

 

And with Super Mutants, you can have super mutants as companions, in both Fallout 3 and 4. So that clearly shows not *all* muties hate humans

 

Also, if you're going to argue "Raiders aren't friends with other raiders", then how are there raider gangs? Why isn't it literally "every raider for themselves"? My idea isn't "raiders from other gangs join you", but more of "you start your own raider group". If that's illogical, then explain how the Viper gang, Fiends, Jackals, and other gangs were ever formed? It's even stated in the Fallout wiki that raiders don't typically attack other raiders. So, if you're going to be evil, why can't you start your own raider gang?

 

Just because a few super mutants are nice,not everyone has to be.It's like saying "those two policemen are corrupt.That must mean that every other policeman ever must be corrupt".

 

Raiders joining your settlement makes sense and I actually like that idea,but them just ignoring you doesn't. Being evil doesn't automatically make you friends with other evil people.Heck,I think Raiders would be MORE eager to kill you.They could see you as a competitor.

 

 

You know what this reminds me of... where are the groups of mercs and assassins sent to kill you because you pissed off the wrong person? That's one aspect from Skyrim that really should have carried over to this game. Needs more death squads.

There is a quest where triggermen are sent to kill you and randomly attack you in Diamond City.

[The10thJinchuuriki]

alright, I guess that does make sense. Other raider factions won't care who you are then, but I am glad we agree have having raider settlers for your own group

[The10thJinchuuriki]

You know what this reminds me of... where are the groups of mercs and assassins sent to kill you because you pissed off the wrong person? That's one aspect from Skyrim that really should have carried over to this game. Needs more death squads.

could be a perk you gain from either direction of the karma system? Depending on the positive or negative karma would determine what type of people would come after you?