headbomb Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 In Morrowind, we had The Apprentice*Fortify Maximum Magicka 1.5x INT*Weakness to Magicka 50% The Atronach*Spell Absorption 50%*Fortify Maximum Magicka 2.0x INT*Stunted Magicka The Lady*Fortify Personality 25 pts*Fortify Endurance 25 pts The Lord*Restore Health 2 pts for 30 secs on Self*Weakness to Fire 100% The Lover*Fortify Agility 25 pts*Paralyze 60 secs on Target, Damage Fatigue 200 pts on Self The Mage*Fortify Maximum Magicka 0.5x INT The Ritual*Turn Undead 100 pts for 30 secs on Target*Turn Undead 100 pts for 30 secs on Touch*Restore Health 100 pts on Self The Serpent*Poison 3 pts for 30 secs on Touch, Damage Health 1 pt for 30 secs on Self The Shadow*Invisibility for 60 secs The Steed*Fortify Speed 25 pts The Thief*Sanctuary 10 pts The Tower*Detect Animal / Key / Enchantment for 60 secs in 200 ft*Open 50 pts on Touch The Warrior*Fortify Attack 10 pts In Oblivion, we had The Apprentice*Fortify Magicka 100pts*Weakness to Magicka 100% The Atronach*Spell Absorption 50%*Fortify Magicka 150 pts*Stunted Magicka The Lady*Fortify Willpower 10 pts*Fortify Endurance 10 pts The Lord*Restore Health 6 pts for 15 secs on Self*Weakness to Fire 25% The Lover*Fortify Agility 25 pts*Paralyze 10 secs on Touch, Damage Fatigue 120 pts on Self The Mage*Fortify Maximum Magicka 50 pts The Ritual*Turn Undead 100 pts for 30 secs*Restore Health 200 pts on Self The Serpent*Damage Health 3 points for 20 seconds (60 points total) on Touch, Cure Poison on Self, Dispel 90 points on Self, Damage Fatigue 100 points on Self The Shadow*Invisibility for 60 secs The Steed*Fortify Speed 20 points on Self The Thief*Fortify Agility 10 points on Self*Fortify Luck 10 points on Self*Fortify Speed 10 points on Self The Tower*Reflect Damage 5% for 120 seconds*Open 40 pts on Touch The Warrior* Fortify Endurance 10 points on Self* Fortify Strength 10 points on Self Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elvinkun Posted October 21, 2011 Share Posted October 21, 2011 And in Skyrim we will have: ...Damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headbomb Posted October 21, 2011 Author Share Posted October 21, 2011 (edited) Now we could go for a few different approaches. We could go for something that aims to mimic the existing lore, regardless of gameplay consequences [aka no one picks The Serpent]. Or for something that aims mimic to existing lore, but keeps gameplay consequences. Or something that follows the general spirit of the signs, but aims for a balanced game play (Oblivion Atronach / Thief were insanely powerful compared to the rest). Or something that reflects the name of the signs, but does not necessarily reflect older sign. Personally I'd go either for something that follows the general spirit of the signs, but try to make them a bit more relevant and balanced to the game. AKA, something like The Apprentice*Big boost to magicka*Weakness to magicka The Atronach*Spell Absorption (30-50% ?) *Stunted Magicka The Lady*Boost to Speech *Boost to Health The Lord*Boost to Wealth (similar to Imperial's increased coin ability)*Boost to Health The Lover*Opposite sex has increase disposition (or simply a boost to speech, if that's not possible / hard to do)*Paralyze spell The Mage*Small boost to magicka*Boost to magicka regen The Ritual*Boost to Conjuration*Boost to Restoration The Serpent*Boost to Alchemy*Poison spell The Shadow*Boost to Illusion*Boost to Sneak The Steed*Boost to speed*Boost to carrying capacity The Thief*Boost to Pickpocket*Boost to Lockpicking The Tower*Boost to Heavy Armor*Boost to Block The Warrior*Boost to 1-Hand Weapons*Boost to 2-Handed Weapons Edited October 21, 2011 by headbomb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhalo321 Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) Now we could go for a few different approaches. We could go for something that aims to mimic the existing lore, regardless of gameplay consequences [aka no one picks The Serpent]. Or for something that aims mimic to existing lore, but keeps gameplay consequences. Or something that follows the general spirit of the signs, but aims for a balanced game play (Oblivion Atronach / Thief were insanely powerful compared to the rest). Or something that reflects the name of the signs, but does not necessarily reflect older sign. Personally I'd go either for something that follows the general spirit of the signs, but try to make them a bit more relevant and balanced to the game. AKA, something likeexc. Yes and no... i am a sucker for complexity so I like the way your going with it but I would definitely switch it up so the signs aren't so simple... the old atronach is a great example of what i like, you can't naturally regain magicka fundamentally changing how most charectors have to work, but as a bonus you can defend against it preposteraously well and even gain magicka off of spells cast at you, of cource the way it was finally worked out was pretty OP, not gonna lie, its still a good conceptual example though. If you wanted just streight up stat buffs that could fall into any other category like race, leveling up or even a back-story mod, but signs those are different, those are a magical gifts from the gods one i sincerely wish Skyrim gives your charector a chance to be genuinely unique threw. If not I'll just have to hunt down/create a mod to make it so ;D Edited October 22, 2011 by blackhalo321 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headbomb Posted October 22, 2011 Author Share Posted October 22, 2011 The problem is to mostly match the spirit of the old ones. If we're throwing out current lore, and making every sign from scratch, each with one advantage and one drawback, that could "work" to, but it wouldn't be very lore-friendly, which would sort of defeat he purpose of bringing birth signs back [iMO]. As for complexity, it's hard to come up with things other than skills/stats boosts without having played the game and see what we have to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhalo321 Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) As for complexity, it's hard to come up with things other than skills/stats boosts without having played the game and see what we have to work with. Sure? Its practically the same game (mechanic wise) as Oblivion with a few of the mainstream mods so any idea for an Oblivion birth sign should transfer over well enough to Skyrim.. and I don't really see Cyrodile lore as a big factor to people. If the changes to signs brought about a dozen cool abilities and ultimately more entertaining gaming experience everyone should call that ideal... people that are playing it for the experience gets the best they can get, the lore-bound dire hards that likes the old lore and wants those signs can copy and pasta mod their original buffs back into Skyrim :) win-win Edited October 22, 2011 by blackhalo321 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
headbomb Posted October 22, 2011 Author Share Posted October 22, 2011 As for complexity, it's hard to come up with things other than skills/stats boosts without having played the game and see what we have to work with. Sure? Its practically the same game (mechanic wise) as Oblivion with a few of the mainstream mods so any idea for an Oblivion birth sign should transfer over well enough to Skyrim.. and I don't really see Cyrodile lore as a big factor to people. If the changes to signs brought about a dozen cool abilities and ultimately more entertaining gaming experience everyone should call that ideal... people that are playing it for the experience gets the best they can get, the lore-bound dire hards that likes the old lore and wants those signs can copy and pasta mod their original buffs back into Skyrim :) win-win There's a lot of different things from Oblivion for the perspective of game mechanics. Dragon shouts for one. Perks for the other. Attributes are gone. Complete magic overhaul. The point of having birthsigns would be to bring back an important aspect of the TES lore. If people want unrelated buffs, they have access to the console, and can give themselves whatever they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blackhalo321 Posted October 22, 2011 Share Posted October 22, 2011 (edited) There's a lot of different things from Oblivion for the perspective of game mechanics. Dragon shouts for one. Perks for the other. Attributes are gone. Complete magic overhaul. The point of having birthsigns would be to bring back an important aspect of the TES lore. If people want unrelated buffs, they have access to the console, and can give themselves whatever they want. unrelated buffs?? ok.. I guess you could say they are mostly unrelated to lore but thats my point.. most people would pass up bits of old lore for better gameplay. I honestly don't see what your trying to prove though... sure signs are part of lore but that means they aren't flexible and ever improving like every other part of the Elder scrolls? and no from every thing I have seen the game is extremely similiar. I did say mechanic wise and in that respects dragon shouts are nothing new for the elder scrolls, Oblivion signs/race/item buffs had cooldowns and did pretty good spell effects(mostly damaging) and from what I have seen and heard dragon shouts are mainly just moves with cooldowns that do pretty good spell effects (mainly damaging)... Perks... really?? flip threw the perk lists/setups.. they are small and constrained allowing minimal customization. You also might notice all the bonuses you can get are copied and pasted from the ones you got in Oblivion for going down the bar as you leveled, meaning it changes little to nothing when it comes to mechanics and magic is the only thing really changed and in most respects seems to have been finally balanced (since you can't make your own god spells like before) but again.. magic is still conceptually entirely the same.. spells/trees will end up working exactly the same as before (conjuration-get a skeletons or atronachs destruction-do a lil' dmg illusion-frenzy/calm/rally exc.) the biggest twist might just be effectiveness of the trees but that probably won't null a sign idea. Sooo nothing that would change a sign mechaninic from working. Off the top of my head a onesign of the bloodhound you revel in the blood of the fallen, gain 1/2 of the damage each of your critical swings do in life, gain 1/3 of your total life back after a kill, your health regenrates extremely slowly, potions and rest barely heals you. special ability: blood frenzy, enter a state of wild disaray (either after taking a big hit or after activating, or a combination of the 2), gain a few bonuses to damageyou possibly lose control of your movement and attacks for a few seconds if you stop attacking anyoneyour health bar doesn't drop for 10? seconds untill the damage catches up with you and you take 1/4-1/2 of the total damage stopped that would work in Oblivion would still work here... or even the old token tower one were you could go invisible and unlock up to hard locks once per day would still work just fine... Edited October 22, 2011 by blackhalo321 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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