Extreamly strange startup issue.

[Slavemaster4u]

I have been away for awhile. Just got back. Decided to play a session of FO4. Which was working fine. After launching steam. Steam did a game update to FO4. Have auto update on all games. So, since it did a game update. Started checking all mods to see if any new ones needed. Did all updates of mods. Didn't add any new mods. And didn't change load order. But after updating everything and checking with F4Edit. I tried loading game and got the eternal black screen. Even before start video. So disabled all mods. Except top most mod and DLC. Figured I would do a single mod at a time to see which was causing issue. But game loaded fine with every mod. Done one at a time. With 3 DLC. So then tried 2 mods at a time. everything loaded fine. Long story short. Can only load 15 mods. Doesn't mater what 15. Example: Have the 15 mods at top of mod list activated with DLC. Game loads fine. Then activate mod 16 with those 15. Get infinite screen. Deactivate any one of the first 15 mods, but leave # 16 mod active. Game loads fine. Tried this in quite a few different combinations. 15 runs, 16 kills. Also have 2 additional monitors on with main viewing TV. and on one have system gauges that shows what is happening with each. And on the running processes FO4 never goes above 1gb of ram. At time of infinite screen stops at around 950mb of ram. This in itself seems odd. Because I'm sure game uses more that a GB of ram. Also ram is showing 9% load during game freeze. Processor is at 22%. Graphics is showing 1.6 total usage. So not an issue of lack of system resources. Also did delete my 2 base "ini" files in documents\FO4 folder. And ran launcher. And do have custom.ini locked with info added so mods will work. Not running enb, sweetFX, or any other external graphics programs. Sorry for long post. Just trying to get most info needed for clearer understanding of issue. Also not a newbie at modding or mod use. Started modding game when Morrowind first came out. Now actively modding the Witcher series, DragonAge series, Fallout series, as well as others. Most of which is via PR. So have some knowledge. Just some. But absolutely baffled by this. And haven't read anywhere that a mod limit of 15 was added to newest version of game. Again, all these mods were active and working prior to my leave.

Any advice, info, and\or help with this would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for reading.

 

Edit: Since I have a very small load order. Decided to post it here. This is from "plugins file". Those tabbed over to right are the ones I don't have active but put them in the list so you can see what the load order would be with all mods. This same load order was working.

______ ESM's ______

*DLCRobot.esm
*DLCworkshop01.esm
*DLCCoast.esm
*SettlementKeywords.esm
*ArmorKeywords.esm

____ Put at top of list per author directions ____
*Armorsmith Extended.esp
*Armorsmith Far Harbor.esp
*Armorsmith Automatron.esp

______ Patches ____
*Unofficial Fallout 4 Patch.esp

_____ Cheats _____
*VeryRichMerchants.esp
*AIO SS.esp
*AIO SS Cheap Beacon.esp
*pylonscheap.esp
*HappyMaker.esp
*Items Weightless.esp
*NoFallDamage.esp
*RingOfLowMaintenance.esp
*LightboxPower.esp
Unpowered Spotlight.esp
Water Sources Expanded.esp
Dimensional Storage.esp
Never-Break Power Armor to PC by BMDD.esp
AntiGravityNukes.esp

______ Body _____
JaneBod.esp

______ Armor/Clothing ____
JB - CasualTramp.esp
JB - DomiRaider.esp
Evil Detective Outfit.esp

_____ Homes/Settlements ____
Elys - SettlementBuildMaxSize.esp
SecretStash.esp
DBE - Santuary.esp
Little Piece of Heaven - by CB9611.esp

____ Followers\Companions ____
EFF.esp
CompVictoria.esp

 

As for system specs;MSI motherboard, i7 6core 4.7 processor, GTX Titan x 12gb graphics, 16gb DDR4 RAM, Windows 7 Pro x64 on a 120gb SSD. And have computer set up so all programs are installed to separate 1.5tb D drive, all games installed to 500gb SSD B drive, and all user data goes to 3tb E drive also the backup drive. All internal drives. DVD drive is set to A drive. My system page file is set to 400mb min\max. And page file on E drive set to 30gb min\max for programs\games use. Also have core parking turned off, since this is not a portable computer. Computer is housed in a refrigerated dry box. Have 3 viewing devices. Main is a Sony 42" 1080p with 120 refresh, the other 2 are Sanyo's 32" 1080p 60 refresh. Have the games drive added to anti virus exception list.

 

Edit 2: Have found that on occasion can load all these mods at once and game starts fine and runs fine. Other times may take several tries before it will start. Other times it will only start if I disable all but 15 mods. Totally random. Whenever I launch the game, don't know what it will do or not do. Even with NO changes to system, hardware, or game. Will run then won't run, or will only run with 15 mods. Any 15 on my list. Totally confusing. But definitely not a graphic card or mod issue. Since it will run then won't. So narrowed down to a game issue.

[AceGoober]

First off, with all due respect, the load order you posted is messy at best. There are duplicates in the first part; some showing enabled, others showing disabled. Please clean it up and list exactly what you have enabled and disabled.

 

Second, where is Fallout 4 installed to?

 

Third, have you ever ran LOOT on your load order? Doesn't look like it to me.

 

Fourth, are you using NMM or Mod Organizer beta? I use NMM so if this is a MO install then troubleshooting will be somewhat limited as I don't use MO.

 

Fifth, are each of your mods updated to the latest version with compatibility patches applied for the DLC?

[Slavemaster4u]

AceGoober; Thanks for reply.

First, must apologize for the DLC listed twice. Started to manually type the list, then switched to copy\paste from plugins file. Those that are stared are active, those at bottom are not active. This should of been obvious to you, since FO4 requires the star now because of it being available to console users. So anything not starred will not load.

Second, as stated above, all games are on the D drive, including FO4. As for load order, your not making since. I have only 6 categories of mods and they are in order. ESM's, then the unofficial patch, then cheats, then body, then armor\clothing, then homes\settlement, and follower mods last. So load order is correct. The only exception being "Armorsmith mods) author instructed to put at beginning of load order, so I did. Game runs fine with any 15 kept in same order. Sometimes I can get the game to load all mods, but mostly, it's just 15.

I do not use mod managers, never have. And has worked perfectly for me for 15+ years. As stated above been modding since Morrowind. If you learn the right way to install mods you won't have problems that mod managers have. Such as not installing loose textures or meshes with a mod. Just installing the esp. As a staff member of Nexus, you know what I'm speaking about. If not will gladly post links that show this issue happens often with NMM, including newest version. I do use TESEdit (FO4Edit) for cleaning, and it does let me know if there is a load issue. I do a lot of private request modding for about 6 games. And therefore check the forums on a regular basis. Lastly, as again stated above, all mods and game are newest. Will edit above and remove the duplicate DLC.

Now, since you asked several questions that were already stated in the post, wondering if you even bothered to read it all. I know it is long, But, had I not given that info, it would have been asked for. So most of your reply was a waste of your time, since answers to your questions are in the first post. You must be having a bad day, I have them too. But I don't dump my bad attitude from bad days on others. I will remain respectful of you, hope you can do the same for me. Thanks

 

Edit: Another typo; games on B drive not D drive.

[tartarsauce2]

did your update take you from version pre 1.5 to post 1.5 of fallout 4?
that messed up people a while ago and if it did then you'd better look into that and maybe even get newer versions manually or something, and look for any potential issues with compatibility

as an example of things I noticed for myself having issues there.... when I didn't realize there were limitations to running plugins... I learned the hard way that NMM is 255 runs, 256 kills

16 is a multiple of 2 or 4 or 8 or whatever
don't know if that'll help anyone at all

Edited June 11, 2016 by tartarsauce2

[Slavemaster4u]

did your update take you from version pre 1.5 to post 1.5 of fallout 4?

that messed up people a while ago and if it did then you'd better look into that and maybe even get newer versions manually or something, and look for any potential issues with compatibility

 

as an example of things I noticed for myself having issues there.... when I didn't realize there were limitations to running plugins... I learned the hard way that NMM is 255 runs, 256 kills

 

16 is a multiple of 2 or 4 or 8 or whatever

don't know if that'll help anyone at all

Haven't even looked at the exact version #. Know it is newest since steam did the update. And did a file validation right after update. I do this with all update of all steam games. And as stated can run any combination of 15 mods. Game starts and runs smooth. But freezes as soon as 16 are tried. And this is not consistent either. Sometimes, after 3 or 4 tries I can get the game to load all mods at once. And game runs fine. I have been launching the task manager so often that I added the app to my taskbar. Not sure what your #16 comment is about.

 

Edit: The 255 limit you mention for NMM. Not sure if that is true for NMM, but do know Skyrim has a limit of 255 mods.

[Sharlikran]

SettlementKeywords.esm if this is the original file v0.8 it's not compatible with 1.5.157 or higher. Also if you are using any SK v0.8 patches they will cause issues with your settlement menus. Shouldn't cause your issue but something to consider.

[Slavemaster4u]

SettlementKeywords.esm if this is the original file v0.8 it's not compatible with 1.5.157 or higher. Also if you are using any SK v0.8 patches they will cause issues with your settlement menus. Shouldn't cause your issue but something to consider.

Using "SettlementKeywordsExpanded 1.5_v1.30-12226-1-30" which I believe is newest version. And have no mods requiring patches.

[Slavemaster4u]

SettlementKeywords.esm if this is the original file v0.8 it's not compatible with 1.5.157 or higher. Also if you are using any SK v0.8 patches they will cause issues with your settlement menus. Shouldn't cause your issue but something to consider.

Sharlikran; Directing this to you, pertaining to TESEdit (FO4Edit). I was editing a plugin with FO4Edit and made a mistake (which I fixed). But of interest was the error details. Which list system and game specs. The specs showed FO4 has a memory max of 850mb. And I have noticed that every time the game freezes. Task Manager is showing game frozen at around 850 - 875mb. Are you aware of this memory cap? And if so, do you know of a way to change it? If you need a screenshot of the TESEdit error details. Will gladly make another mistake and take a screenshot. Just let me know.

 

Edit: Do know that we had to use a memory hack for Skyrim. But that was because it was 32bit and wouldn't read ram above 2gb. FO4 is 64bit so should be able to read and use full ram.

[AceGoober]

@Slavemaster4u

 

Apologies if we got off on the wrong foot earlier. It wasn't intended. With regards to your issue...

 

Fallout 4 will use all available RAM if the game with a boat-load of texture mods requires it. If you are freezing around 850MB then that tells me there is:

 

- faulty RAM module

- timing issue (CAS, RAS, tRAS, etc)

- possibly CPU to RAM ratio

 

The first thing I would do in a situation such as yours is to shut down the system, unplug the power cord, press and hold the power button for at least 10 seconds to dissipate any remaining capacitance charge, fully remove every stick of RAM then reseat and test.

 

The second action I would take is to check the timings to see if what the memory modules are factory set for versus what the motherboard is reading them as.

 

Regarding VRAM usage, when running in DX11 mode, the equation is VRAM - O/S - background processes = available VRAM.

 

When running FO4 in DX9 mode with a nVidia based graphics card, the most VRAM FO4 will use is 4096 VRAM - O/S - background processes = available VRAM.

 

I run ENBoost with the enblocal.ini VideoMemorySizeMb=16384 as I do run a lot of texture mods. The equation is VRAM + RAM - FO4 - O/S - background processes = available VRAM + RAM.

 

For me the equation looks like this: VRAM (12288) + RAM (16384) - FO4 (8192 - increased to be safe) - O/S (2048) - background processes (2048) = available VRAM+RAM (16384).