A Suggestion to Prevent Mod Theft

[MasterMagnus]

Isn't F4SE just an .exe anyway?

 

Is everybody gonna hang their hat on an .exe that can be hacked with a hex editor?

 

How long before the pirates start passing around the customized .exe. "Just drop this over any mod with F4SE.exe present and circumvent their hand rolled DRM"

 

Creating DRM that depends on a third party loose file doesn't seem like much of a solution to me either.

[Reneer]

Isn't F4SE just an .exe anyway?

 

Is everybody gonna hang their hat on an .exe that can be hacked with a hex editor?

 

How long before the pirates start passing around the customized .exe. "Just drop this over any mod with F4SE.exe present and circumvent their hand rolled DRM"

 

Creating DRM that depends on a third party loose file doesn't seem like much of a solution to me either.

Except, of course, you can't port that EXE file to consoles.

[MasterMagnus]

Yep, that is a great point.

 

The hacked F4SE would only be good for doing evil things to your PC. ...

[ashtonx]

Yep, that is a great point.

 

The hacked F4SE would only be good for doing evil things to your PC. ...

I'm always amazed that after so much ridicule coming from pcmr, console peasants still put the effort to pretend they know what they're saying.

 

I mean, you'd think that somewhere between thousands of posts ridiculing, explaining etc, some of them would actually stop and think, do some research before saying something dumb. Seriously, sometimes i'm amazed those people even manage to stay alive.

Edited June 9, 2016 by ashtonx

[tartarsauce2]

guess we wouldn't download the hacked f4se here on the PC end :^)
we wouldn't have to :+) (honk honk!)

Edited June 9, 2016 by tartarsauce2

[Jeoshua]

the F4SE option is probably the best idea I can think of (mentioned above). You don't receive anything for having a mod with thousands of downloads on here or beth.net, so thieves don't have a reason to take the time to make the necessary changes required to remove the F4SE dependency, which can be quite complicated if you do it correctly.

 

This.

 

Zenimax has made, and indeed can make, no claims on ownership of the PEX format, any more than they can make claims of ownership of the PA32+ format which the engine itself runs on. Files like these are code, running on a particular format, and don't immediately become the sole property of Zenimax unless created within the Creation Kit. Crucially in this case, F4SE mods must have their PEX created by a third party utility, and acted upon by another third party utility. The Script Extender's PA32+ binary format cannot be downloaded through Bethsoft.net, will not work on PS4, and is not allowed to be run on the XBone. And while you have to provide a PEX file for the engine to run, you don't need to provide a PSC file for the user to read. In fact, not providing the PSC file to Bethesda.net removes the possibility of anyone else claiming any ownership of your source code, because they never had it.

 

So by linking one's mod into F4SE, using the debug code to turn something crucial on only if on PC, and not providing source code for that feature, you prevent the mod from being used solely through Bethesda.net. Anyone wanting to steal that mod would have to actually be a modder to understand what had been done and how to remove it. A decade of experience from the Nexus shows that modders can steal other modders work, but that it is highly unlikely and will be the source of much controversy and public outcry against the perpetrator, and rarely damages the reputation of the person who has been the victim.

 

Using that technique, you could even add a fail state that says that this mod is only supported on PC, or if you're a douchy modder you can lambaste people for downloading a pirated version.

 

As it stands, if any random from the internet can steal a mod and upload it and ask for donations, that sets a low bar for the kind of people we're going to have to deal with stealing our mods. Using the above technique at least assures that any villains that we still get are at least Moriarty level, so at least more interesting.

Edited June 9, 2016 by Jeoshua

[tartarsauce2]

I'd heavily suggest against taunting as revenge is always a good motivator (don't be douchey)
people go to amazing lengths to SPITE each other, but I like it jeoshua :D

[Jeoshua]

I have discussed this a bit with someone, and the thought occurs that the best thing you could put into this protected space and withhold the source code to would be a terminal entry or holotape of the EULA of the game, a list of credits and instructions, a change log, and further modifications to the terms and conditions that the modder expects the user to abide by, all accompanied by a digital signature. Depending upon what those modifications are, they may or may not be legally binding, but withholding the source that would have been required to make that document makes that e-signature valid anyways, and proves that you are the author of that mod.

 

As a bonus, this does not require F4SE, can be used on mods actually intended for Console, and if for some reason you are one of the crazy mad multitude that DOES use F4SE, you can use it alongside any other checks for PC-only or to prevent its removal that you feel you need to put in there, should that be your intent.

 

For more bonus points, give it an item tag of [DRM].

 

Boom.

Edited June 9, 2016 by Jeoshua

[yzerman19]

Console thuggery is so lame...it must be brought to an end.

[Jeoshua]

So I have actively codified the intent behind the discovery that I'm going to credit this thread with giving me the idea for. You're welcome. Link in description.