Falling/"Gravity" Mod Request

[Vagrant0]

About quick dismounts, it is possible. Want to know how? A program for OBSE that does this; When this key is hit, the horse acts as if it has become stopped and you dismount. Simple program. That is one way of doing it. Think outside the box. Mounted Combat uses a similar concept I do believe.

 

When I said, "Any great programmer can make any game a work of art" I meant within the games limitations. Also the fact that great programmers CAN CHANGE THOSE LIMITATIONS. I bet you didn't know that one considering you sure are talking like a pro modder. If you can't back yourself up, then don't bother making a pointless argument.

 

You do quick judgments. Please refrain from posting here again. If you do not want to attempt these mods, then do not post here again. This thread is called "Mod Requests" for a reason, not "Troll the Hell out of Mod Requesters". I respect those that test themselves and prove they have tested rather than the arrogant ones that just walk in and say "It cannot be done" without fully knowing it themselves.

I know what OBSE is, I understand how it works, and what it's limitations are. Please stop assuming that you have any idea what the hell you're talking about. I am one of those modders who just happen to know how to do all those neat little things. I can, and have backed up these claims.

When I said, "Any great programmer can make any game a work of art" I meant within the games limitations. Also the fact that great programmers CAN CHANGE THOSE LIMITATIONS.

Quoted for emphesis, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Stop arguing. Modders cannot reprogram a game period. Modders can only change how some things within that game function. Things which are hard coded simply cannot be changed without changing the game's base code. In order to change the game's base code, you have to break some laws, so this will not happen. Please do your research and learn how OBSE actually opperates. It doesn't change anything within the base program. It merely allows scripting functions to get information and change more things by knowing where in RAM those things are located. It does not actually add anything to the game that wasn't there to begin with.

 

My reason for posting is simple, you asked, and you insulted me.

As for the other mods... READ them PROPERLY before saying they exist already Vagrant0... What is with the idiots these days only taking glances at what is said and assuming they know the whole thing?

I don't make quick assumptions with mods. I spend time considdering EVERY request I see and post on here. If it can be done, I explain how it could be done (as I did in my first post here). If it can't be done, I will say that it can't, and why it can't so that people don't go on an endless list of dreams for something that is not currently possible, and probably won't ever be. Yes, I should have probably sat down in the beginning and pointed out exactly why those mods won't work, but at the time I didn't really want to go into it. It takes alot of time trying to explain why somethings just don't work. Now that we've come this far, I can see that even if I had, you would have just refuted it. Somehow I get the feeling that you don't have the slightest understanding of any of this, and are only going on hopes and dreams based on what unrelated mods have accomplished. The people you have asked are probably either in the same boat, or havn't actually looked at all the things involved with making those mods work. It isn't as simple as "just use OBSE to do some stuff when a button is pressed". What you want done has to be possible first and foremost. As I have already stated, there is nothing viable you can link to a button press, so such a mod does not work. If you cannot generate the effect normally, it cannot be done. If it goes against one of the many hard coded things in the game, it cannot be done. Yes, you can go around those hard coded limits in certain cases, but what you have is usually a poor alternative (dual wield mods). If you still cannot grasp this concept, I, and anyone else who might come along would only be wasting their time entertaining your ideas.

[Szayn]

To me, it sounds like you are saying random things to make you look good. What the hell do you think a game programmer is? That's right, another type of modder. You say you are going to explain, and you don't. Instead you dance around and say things to make it look like it is something special. I seriously doubt you know all of the limitations of OBSE. Don't go assuming you know everything it can do unless you made the program. You can ASSUME that you know MOST of the limitations, but nobody ever knows 100% of the puzzle. In fact, even the main creators might only know about 99% of what OBSE is capable of. Do you really know 100% of everything about OBSE? If you say yes, you are indeed a liar, if you say no, you do not know the complete limitations of OBSE. All you can do is assume based off of the knowledge you know yourself. I do NOT need to know OBSE to know how things work. Just tell me what the basics of the program do and I will be able to question those answers.

 

As for you saying that OBSE edits the RAM for easier access to finding files, I really doubt that is all it does seeing as MountedCombat, Evasive Rolling, Jump Flips, and Shield Bashing are not normally in the game, but OBSE puts them there. The .esps and .esms probably can be configured to edit the hard coded areas in the game of Oblivion if OBSE cannot. If OBSE, .esm's, and .esp's cannot add those in, then what does if they aren't originally part of Oblivion?

 

For your information, I know what I am talking about. I know what I am saying. You are just avoiding the fact that I have valid reasons and are bashing me for the thoughts I am having. Being a perfectionist, I ask questions that get towards a lot of aspects about one thing.

 

Yes, I am a perfectionist, that is why things happen when people like you run amok saying things that may or may not be true... Note: I said MAY or MAY NOT. When someone says that, or something along those lines, I have the urge to find the "May not" part.

 

No, the people I asked are not on the same boat as me. In fact, they made mods using OBSE and they wish to remain anonymous.

 

As for dual weapons, there is a group of OBSE modders trying to mod new animations into the game where you can attack with your offhand much like shield bash, but instead you deal damage rather than knocking them back.

 

If you understand me, then you should know this; When requesting mods, people ask for mods that vary from another one of the same type. This means, more than one mod can be made for the same thing in the game. This means, the mods I requested were in fact, NOT MADE. None of them were. That is why I called you an idiot. Understand now?

 

Before assuming someone doesn't know what the hell they are talking about, first find out what their mindset is like, then try to find out if that is their way in finding questions and answers to things. Alright?

 

If you understand that, I will take back what I said and even apologize to you about it. I have a habit in not telling people how I think beforehand, so these situations happen a lot. Rather, I don't even know how I think a lot of the time myself... -_-

 

So tell me, how did Jump Flips, Shield Bashing, Evasive Rolling and MountedCombat/MountedSpells come about?

[ninja_lord666]

So tell me, how did Jump Flips, Shield Bashing, Evasive Rolling and MountedCombat/MountedSpells come about?

Jump Flips? Flipping while jumping? In Vanilla Oblivion, someone with a high acrobatic skill can do a back flip, which is a part of the Vanilla Oblivion evasive rolling. Someone with a high acrobatics skill can press the jump button while blocking to roll left, right, or forward or do a back flip. I don't know what you're talking about, but rolling and flipping are in Vanilla Oblivion. As for the mounted spells, the person put an activator on the horses head and had the spells shoot out from there, just like how those dark welkynd stones shoot out spells at people passing by, except that instead of being automatic, it's controlled by the cast key.

[Abramul]

Generally, it's a good idea to determine someone's standing in the community before you insult them. If you're fortunate, you will not have any questions I could have helped you with.

[Szayn]

Generally, it's a good idea to determine someone's standing in the community before you insult them. If you're fortunate, you will not have any questions I could have helped you with.

 

Generally, it's a good idea to look at how many posts someone has and when they joined before you start a rant as well. Vagrant was the one who started the argument to begin with. Frankly, someones standing does not determine a thing, that only means that you think people are not equal, in which case I will disregard to begin with. People are equal regardless of their standings.

 

@ninja_lord: Finally someone comes in and actually acts like a modder. Thanks for explaining those ones, but what about shield bashing and melee combat while on a mount?

[Abramul]

I said nothing about post counts or join dates. By 'standing', I refer to the fact that Vagrant has as good a claim as anyone to the title of "Resident Script and AI Expert".

 

As for the "everyone's equal" bit... If you mean something along the lines of "New members are entitled to the same degree of courtesy as anyone else", then I'll agree with that. But everyone is not equal in terms of skills and knowledge. I wouldn't bother asking Malchik for scripting help...but if I was doing a story-driven quest mod, I'd certainly want his opinion on it!

[ninja_lord666]

@ninja_lord: Finally someone comes in and actually acts like a modder.

I...was actually taking Vagrant's side.

[Vagrant0]

Generally, it's a good idea to determine someone's standing in the community before you insult them. If you're fortunate, you will not have any questions I could have helped you with.

 

Generally, it's a good idea to look at how many posts someone has and when they joined before you start a rant as well. Vagrant was the one who started the argument to begin with. Frankly, someones standing does not determine a thing, that only means that you think people are not equal, in which case I will disregard to begin with. People are equal regardless of their standings.

 

@ninja_lord: Finally someone comes in and actually acts like a modder. Thanks for explaining those ones, but what about shield bashing and melee combat while on a mount?

I didn't start anything. Read my first post in this thread again.

I'm afraid that isn't how the world works. When you're jumping, your legs are only working against the weight of your body, anything in access is used to determine your velocity up. When you land, your legs are not only taking the force of your weight, but all the downward velocity that goes with it. You don't realize it when you're jumping 2-3 feet in the air because your velocity down isn't very high. There is a point where no matter how strong and agile your legs are, when you fall you will break them due to the buildup of forces.

 

As for your mods, most are either already done, or cannot be done. While it is possible to lessen the effects of gravity, it works uniformly on everything, even clutter. The speed which you have to be moving to take damage is hard coded into the engine, the only thing which can be adjusted is the rate that you aquire that speed.

That is primarily in reference to the name of this thread, and the first part of your post. I didn't have any interest in sitting down and catagorically explaining in what way the other ideas were already done, or cannot be done because the title of the thread was about a gravity mod, not a horse mod, or your mod ideas. It was only after you attacked me for what you assumed to be an uninformed statment that I made any actual mention of those ideas. If you wanted to discuss other things, you should have probably made that clear, or made a different thread. For someone who is a perfectionist, you should have probably made your original statment more clear if you did indeed want to discuss these mods in detail, rather than just listing them as an afterthought.

 

How my first post here can be constituted as a rant is beyond me. If anything, your response

As for the other mods... READ them PROPERLY before saying they exist already Vagrant0... What is with the idiots these days only taking glances at what is said and assuming they know the whole thing?

Is the first rant worthy quote in this thread, and it is a clear attack against me. It's your own words, do you even read them? You got a fair assessment to begin with, I talked to you in a respectful manner that is no different from how anyone else is talked to. For this you insulted me, and in rant form dismissed everything that was said. You got respect in the beginning, you wiped your ass with it, it's only appropiate that I respond.

 

That said, I should probably clarify here and now what I mean by "cannot be done". I tend to generalize with these things since it takes so long to sit down and explain things. I regularly spend several hours a day around here, either helping with ideas, or suggesting ways that they can work. When they won't work, I simply say that they cannot be done since this is usually the case. "Cannot be done" is a broad statment, this means that either it cannot be done currently, or it cannot be done in any way which anyone else would want to use it. I cannot see the future, I cannot know everything. I am Human. I do however have a greater than average understanding of game mechanics and how things actually work. Just because I say it cannot be done does necessarily mean that it can't eventurally. Except in the case of your fast dismount idea, which I have already spent time explaining specifically WHY it cannot, and will never be done. Let me elaborate with an anology.

 

Modding is like someone becoming the United States President. Simple mods are a case there you have someone already in office running for a second term. Complicated mods are more like someone new running for office. In either event, both require certain factors to already exist which allow them to be elected. Since everyone may not be familiar with the system, they are essentially, electoral vote (scripting), age (AI), and natural born citizen (game mechanics) as the factors which are determined by the constitution. These are your hard coded limits. Additionally, experience, gender, religion, and dosens of other factors play a role, but are not set in stone, and can change over time (this is what OBSE does). Your typical semi-groundbreaking OBSE mod (like flip jumps, evasive rolling, wall climbing, current dual wield mods) is much akin to a woman becoming president. It is still dependant on those hard coded factors, but has managed to get around one of those minor factors that might have stopped it along the way. A Mormon president, the same deal, just not as likely since there would be more involved with getting the electoral vote. A mod like shield bashing, or mounted combat would be along the lines of a non-native person becoming President. Even though it states in the constitution that they cannot be elected, they can become President due to chain of command. These mods don't change the rules, they just find ways around them. They would still have to be able to accomplish getting to a position high enough up to become possible, within those rules. Even if they become president, their ability to function in that regard probably won't be as good as what anyone would really want. Still following? Ok, now your fast dismount mod would be something along the lines of a Mexican grown turnip becoming president of the united states. Even if you could somehow get the electoral vote for a turnip to get elected, or get around the citizenship requirements like the mods mentioned, you still need to be able to get it to that point within the rules. That turnip would still need to be elected to a high enough position within the hard coded restrictions.

 

The thing is that the action you want linked to a key, in and of itself, isn't possible.

I have talked to modders about these and they said they were good ideas and could probably be done, but some might be extremely difficult if they didn't know what they were doing.

could probably... as in they didn't take the time to really think about all the factors involved, and don't really know themselves. You get on my case because I say when things cannot be done, because as far as I know, and can see, they can't, but don't get on their case for giving you a sense of hope without taking the time to sit down and explain how.

I never said these guys were my friends either. I thought you would have assumed that I wasn't friends with them when I said "I emailed them about one of their mods and they became quite pissed", which shows you only think within your own set of guidelines.

You really didn't say much of anything about these people. You only said that you talked to them. At any rate, in this regard, you're right, I assumed that since you asked them for feedback, they were friends, or atleast frendly enough to spend more than 5 seconds with your requests. This obviously wasn't the case, and I withdraw any statements I may have made against these people since their judgement is totally understandable. This post alone has taken more than 30 mins to write... Add that to my previous posts, and you've already gotten more of my attention than 95% of the people around here. And considdering how much time I put in around here, that's saying alot. Unlike these people you just decided to message, I did considder all the factors. If you asked again, they would likely agree with me on my assessments. You've said it yourself, you don't know scripting. More over, dispite what you may believe, you have very little understanding of any of this, your posts have proved this. You are the one who cannot accept anything other than their own view. I'm done wasting my time on you. If you had bothered to read and understand before posting, I could have probably instructed you in how to adjust those mods which aleady exist, and are possible to your needs. You should probably learn how to pick your battles better, or looking like less of an asshat when someone goes against what you think and understand.

 

You may not realize it, but while you've been here saying how I'm quick to make judgements, and don't considder how something previously thought impossible isn't, I've been in another topic working on something which is just that. And this isn't anything new. The reason why I spend the time I do around here is not to bolster my own ego, it is to help people get their mods working. I enjoy tackling things which are challenging, and explaining how they could be accomplished, and if you spent the time actually looking around, you would see this clearly.

[Jumonji]

Come on, someone call someone a nazi so we can be done with this thread.

 

Enough already.

 

-Jumonui

[Szayn]

Trying to compare a game and the real life in the way you did is not even close to how it works... Coding for games surpasses the technology of which can be made in real life. Coding can create weapons that destroy several thousand solar systems. This is an example.

 

We can create the American President in the game. Game modders are the gods of games. Anything in a game is possible with the right knowledge and right group, that is if the game engine that was created beforehand allows it, otherwise the game engine would need to be changed in order for such newer mods to exist. Besides, Bush is a president that has been hated by a lot, which is far unlike the game. Don't take me wrong, but I do not hate you or despise you at all. Just because you don't see a way from your point of view doesn't mean it is impossible... You might be thinking with OBSE alone while I am thinking of general modding in its' entirety... That would be one misunderstanding we both had of each other.

 

Yes you did start off by talking to me in a respectful manner, however at the time I thought you were harassing me and disregarding me and my request of mods. This whole thing started because of a couple of misunderstandings. For those reasons, I have to apologize. So...I am sorry for making this happen.

 

Me and you both have stated the term "There are ways around them" in this topic... In a real sense, you have probably tried several ways around but ended up failing each time and concluded that it was not possible within those limitations. That is what that statement you said there said to me after reading everything you had posted over these past few days.

 

You didn't explain it all the first time you said you explained it. I have compiled everything you had said towards it and decided to put it into my own words.

 

Firstly, your character, when mounted, is considered the same creature even though when looked upon, they are clearly two separate beings.

Secondly, the only way a mod would be able to activate such a script would be if modders changed some of the hard coded areas of the game, which is illegal to do without proper consent from Bethesda.

Thirdly, OBSE is a program that alters the RAM pathways to enable quicker access to loading files. I didn't quite get this statement because OBSE seems to do more than just this because of the fact that it allows for specific button presses that edit the gameplay, much like a hack, however, if you meant to put in, OBSE is a program that alters how the RAM is loaded within the game to obtain a faster loading time for files and allows for extra hotkeys within the game to trigger some hidden animations that are already located within the game coding, then you would have had me... I don't know if I would have been able to say anything after that because it explains the characters movements within the coding, it explains what modders would need to do, and it explains what OBSE does.

 

So yea, I think I have the gist of it. As for when you quoted and placed "Perfectionist" into what you said, that statement you quoted was not mine. In fact, it was Jumonji's and he didn't say he was a perfectionist heh. Thought I should clear that up.