kitsuneshoujo Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Theres a difference between being distinct and being totally fugly. I could have done better concept art for their elves than whomever Bethesda hired... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 I still fail to see this Klingon thing... Klingons have brow ridges, caused by bony plates which develop over their brow and forehead. This results in a protruding, often jagged growth on the forhead and causes a deeper expression of the eyesockets and a heavier look to the brows. TES Elves have vertically drawn brows, where the musculature connects to the skull around the ridge of the crown rather just above the ears. This results in a more vertically drawn expression, slanting the eyes and eyebrows and often giving the illusion of a longer skull and face. They are two completely different features... If anything, they look like Romulans. I mean, seriously, if you're going to draw comparisons to other fictional species, at least know what your talking about... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nic1357890 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) Bethesda is just too damn good at ruining their own lore How can they ruin their own lore, they created it, they decide what direction it goes in and your personal dislike is never going to change that. And then there are the posters in this topic saying that its a "problem" that needs "fixing". Really, if you see the art direction in Elder Scrolls as a broken part of the games then maybe you should be playing something else. Edited November 22, 2011 by nic1357890 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 http://media.giantbomb.com/uploads/1/17166/1259074-mw_01cb.jpg http://i124.photobucket.com/albums/p31/LadyPhaedra13/ClearDunmerEyes/EyesDunmerReplacer2.jpg http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20110920115441/elderscrolls/images/8/81/SepLnUp_Dunmer_b4 Which one of these looks closer to the concept artwork from above? The concept, FYI, is over 12 years old and was part of the transfer from the pixilated Daggerfall generation to the 3D generation of TES. Also, can someone please explain to me how http://www.selfsimilar.org/images/garn/garn9-1t.jpg Looks better than http://images.wikia.com/elderscrolls/images/8/8c/SepLnUp_Altmer_b1%26c1.png I mean, really... I fail to see anything of this 'ugly' vibe people seem to be getting. At least they don't all look like a cross between Urkel and Paris Hilton in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsuneshoujo Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) Its a matter of opinion Lachdonin, if youre going to try and argue people into thinking the way you do, you will fail miserably, Wood and high elves look ok, its the dark elves that look horrible. Your second link is a pic from a mod, so it doesnt count in your argument. Finally: Ok not klingons but romulans, sorry. Bethesda is just too damn good at ruining their own lore How can they ruin their own lore, they created it, they decide what direction it goes in and your personal dislike is never going to change that. And then there are the posters in this topic saying that its a "problem" that needs "fixing". Really, if you see the art direction in Elder Scrolls as a broken part of the games then maybe you should be playing something else. It's called retconning, and its a sign of a bad writer if you are doing it constantly. Blizzard is guilty of this. Maybe you should get off your high horse? Who are you to tell us we should be playing something else if we dont like something? That's why Bethesda allows us to mod there game. If we dont like something, were allowed to change it. Edited November 22, 2011 by kitsuneshoujo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ginnyfizz Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Well I am in the "Gaaah they are hideously ugly" camp here. And by the way having looked up some Celtic/British mythology, which along with the Anglo Saxon and Norse stuff was what a certain Professor Tolkein drew from, elves were traditionally TALL and fair of face (it was the piskies, spriggans, goblins and knockers who by tradition were stunted). No, I am not saying that this is Elder Scrolls lore strict before some Morrowind fanperson jumps down my throat. I am saying that as a Brit of mainly Celtic and Norse heritage, this is why my personal vision of elves is the way that it is. Given that, and the view of Elves as an ethereal, mostly higher kind of being, I can quite see why Beth were trying to make them look different, but in my opinion they have made them look monstrous, whether Klingon or Romulan they are still pretty hideous. Some of the texture mods have gone some way to address the issues, and I have had what I consider to be a success with a very fetching but definitely elfin Bosmer;- http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l255/janepreddy/TESV2011-11-1603-22-43-03.jpg Once we get the CK I hope to be able to give the Bosmer fangs, as one bit of lore I read suggested that they are rather unpleasant little cannibals. My OB Bosmer have fangs. But my main beef is because I play as females, and with the limitations of the facial sliders and the exaggeratedly gaunt and haggard proportions that they have given us, the Dunmer and Altmer females look very masculine. The chins are WAY out of proportion, one of the distinguishing features of a female face is a generally shorter chin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nic1357890 Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 But Bethesda aren't guilty of retconning with Skyrim. The only game in which they at least partially did that is with Oblivion. Looks to me like some people didnt play Daggerfall/Morrowind and now they have this idea in their heads of how TES elves "should" look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wraith Darkholm Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) Theres a difference between being distinct and being totally fugly. I could have done better concept art for their elves than whomever Bethesda hired... Its a matter of opinion Lachdonin, if youre going to try and argue people into thinking the way you do, you will fail miserably, As you stated, it's a matter of opinion, and no one person can fully persuade another; one's persons fulgy is another's flower. That's the beauty of Beth making a construction set...people can make their game as enjoyable as they want. Edited November 22, 2011 by Wraith Darkholm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitsuneshoujo Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 (edited) Wow she looks really cute! Can I have a copy of your save game? An early one if you have it. ^_^ As you stated, it's a matter of opinion, and no one person can fully persuade another; one's persons fulgy is another's flower. Tha'ts the beauty of Beth making a construction set...people can make their game as enjoyable as they want. I am not trying to argue anyone into thinking the way I do, if thats what you are implying. I also was not accusing Lachdonin of doing it either, you might have noticed that I also used the word "if" in my quoted comment. ;) But Bethesda aren't guilty of retconning with Skyrim. The only game in which they at least partially did that is with Oblivion. Looks to me like some people didnt play Daggerfall/Morrowind and now they have this idea in their heads of how TES elves "should" look. I didnt say they were retconning their lore. Someone else asked why it was bad to change their lore if they want to (since they made it), that was my answer. Edited November 22, 2011 by kitsuneshoujo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lachdonin Posted November 22, 2011 Share Posted November 22, 2011 Its a matter of opinion Lachdonin, if youre going to try and argue people into thinking the way you do, you will fail miserably, Wood and high elves look ok, its the dark elves that look horrible. Your second link is a pic from a mod, so it doesnt count in your argument. The second pic is an eye mod, the actual facial structure and skin tone are all within the regular game. However, if you'd rather - http://images.wikia.com/oblivion/images/0/0a/TypicalDunmer.jpg The point still stands, it looks nothing like the concept art on which the Dark Elves are built. It's called retconning, and its a sign of a bad writer if you are doing it constantly. Blizzard is guilty of this. Maybe you should get off your high horse? Who are you to tell us we should be playing something else if we dont like something? That's why Bethesda allows us to mod there game. If we dont like something, were allowed to change it. Yes, Bethesda allows us to mod the game. They allow 'us' to put in Drow, Demons, anthromotphic dogs, faeries and any of thousand things which are completely and utterly absent from the universe. That doesn't mean their part of the game. There never was a retcon, there was an artistic shift back to the original, distinctive races. There was a decision to sacrifice customizability for representing the unique features of each of the races, and to bring them back to the point where they are different at a glance. If anything, it could be argued as a retcon of a retcon, because they USED to look like this, then it changed, now its changed back. Of course, i should probably ask, what type of elves do you like? The prettier-than-thou pointy eared super models? The child like Elfquest Elves with oversized, slanted eyes? The Doe-like Dragon Age elves? I freely admit that it's all a matter of interpretation, and you are free to disslike what TES elves look like in favor of creatures that belong in lace and on pin-up posters. However, its falicious to claim that Bethesda 'changed' their elves and 'broke' their own lore, when in fact all they went back to the original imagery and lore, none of which ever changed in the first place. All that changed was the technical model used to represent that lore and imagery. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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