What the actual f

[AlexSlesh]

So, you know, there are a lot of ugly rubble in settlements. The ones, you can't scrap and can't select via console. I'm sick of it. Especially ugly piles of dirt in general's privat quaters, in the Castle. So, I opened CK and removed these ugly piles of crap. Created a new plugin. Load the game - ugly crap is gone. But... FPS is 30! Without plugin - 60 fps. So, bethesda, what the actual f...? Why you want me to look at your ugly "creations" so much? I'm annoyed as f...

[sLoPpYdOtBiGhOlE]

LMAO, I'm laughing with you and not at you.

 

Check out the Skylight Drive-Inn movie projector if you want to see a useless waste of how many pieces can be used to create something of no use. lol

 

I swear it's made of nothing less then 150 individual parts (more like 200+ parts) and 80+ percent of the parts that make the projector will never be seen, eg: internal parts in the projector.

Now that's the most useless clutter I've seen in the game so far. lol

 

Other useless clutter like the 3 candles you see littered in cells that is made of 17 parts (not including the flame fx in that count either)... lol

 

If your wanting to click items in the console without the no object AV message then add or set the value in your Fallout4.ini under the [General] section:

bUseCombinedObjects=0

This will let you select items in the console.

 

Really if your wanting to get rid of clutter on the fly while playing, maybe try Scrap Everything, Place Anywhere and BMW, between the 3 you can scrap, delete clutter, debris and anything else that displeases you anywhere in the game world while playing.

 

But I do see where your coming from when you say about the uselss clutter, in most cases it just overdone in areas that just don't need that type of cluttering.

Not to mention the amount of layers of clutter that are used in some areas is beyond a joke.

Edited July 29, 2016 by sLoPpYdOtBiGhOlE

[spacefiddle]

I'm curious as to why he'd get an FPS drop after *removing* items. You mention how many parts and pieces are used in the random nonsense, but it seems like getting rid of them would speed up rendering, not slow it down, yes?

[Dielos]

Did you run the game with the CK open and the render window active? That thing eats incredible amounts of resources. I've had extreme lag after editing something in the render window, and closing the CK solved it...

[ElPolloAzul]

In theory, removing objects from the world could certainly cause an FPS drop precipitated by rendering. Computer graphics practitioners and researchers have gone to great pains over decades to try to assure the pipeline exerts as little effort, in general, as is practically possible on needlessly rendering surfaces which, for whatever reason, are not going to make it into the frame. Some of these techniques go by the name of "hidden surface removal" or "culling", and these processes are almost always necessary just to get the right image, because many objects are at least partially opaque! Even if you avoid the later transformation and shading and post-processing costs of "wasted" rendering, the culling process itself is obviously not free. But... if it is cheap enough with reference to the complexity of the parts of the scene it is "hiding" (you could be concealing potentially expensive features like out-of-the-ordinary bump mapping, billboarding/decaling, complex surfaces, complex lighting source interaction, fancy reflections, volumetric lighting / "godrays", particle systems, simulated dynamic textures or active displacements, expensive interpolations, etc.), culling retains its benefit. And, so, when you remove the clutter interposed between yourself and the surfaces incurring this expense, you are suffering from these costs now - since you don't have a reason to cull. Getting a particular estimate of how the budget for a particular system with particular trade-offs in terms of features and approximations is affected by a high-level change like removing some rocks in a specific part of the world seems like a "non-trivial" problem to request to be solved, even if you had decent internal knowledge of the system and its performance on the average machine and firmware+software configuration.

Another possible suspect does not concern rendering / computer graphics at all, but is in fact related to its "inverse problem", vision. Unlike you, NPCs are not equipped with a highly evolved and delicately trained computer for solving general-purpose vision problems useful for navigation; and we are not currently equipped to build them one in software, at any (monetary or performance) price! So to chase you around and such, we cheat the process a bit by calculating for them "navmeshes" / "walkmeshes" / "meadow maps" (creating a network, or "graph", that the computer can search through to find shortest paths between points in the world; since there are meant to be tangible obstacles in most video games, with the possible partial exception of "Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing", most naive solutions don't work). The CK, for example, is capable of automatically precomputing / "baking in" navmesh but the automation has some flaws (it doesn't do well at stairs, and it doesn't always optimally assign points in the network to points in virtual-physical space). But even if a scenery kit artist (or level designer, or modder) explicitly designs navmesh, it is meant to be precomputed so that the automatic process (which takes time) doesn't have to be redone all the time a path is requested. Obstacles move in the world, so to keep valid navmeshes, you have to dynamically repair them from time to time (requiring, as in the offline pre-process, techniques from computational geometry) -- i.e. sometimes moving or disappearing things "cut" navmesh which then needs to be patched. It could presumably be that if you have not recomputed the navmesh in the CK for this area after having removed the clutter, the dynamic navmeshing system or potentially some other technique used in the engine for pathfinding in the absence of preloaded navmesh is becoming expensive somehow, recomputing too ardently, in this particular space.

On the other hand, it could be some confounding thing which is more obvious.

The CreationKit's renderer, while it doesn't seem to have as many fancy lighting effects etc. enabled as the in-game one, definitely slows everything down for me "considerably"*. If you do have the CK in the background and especially if the Render window is active and visible, I expect there will almost certainly be a perceptible* FPS drop in Fallout 4.

* To put it nicely.

[Dielos]

Amazing answer, ElPolloAzul! :laugh:

[lelcat]

It's normal for Fallout 4 to run slow if the CK is running. Unless you got a very powerful pc. That is normal for any large development tool.

[Perraine]

I do use the Scrap Everything mod, plus I run the game with bUseCombinedObjects=0 - It does give me a slight performance hit to start with, but particularly in settlements, it ends up being a godsend!

 

It's funny you mention Starlight Drive-In, because I noticed the Settlement Budget was almost half used when I first activated that workshop. 1 hour of deleting and/or scraping totally useless and superfluous crap (how many pieces of "road" are simply slapped straight on top of the ... err.... road, which looks EXACTLY the same underneath? Or "Debris Decal" on top of ... debris, or "Grass" on top of ... grass?) The budget damn near went into negative numbers! I had to build a sprawling 3 story Walled Palace Compound, covering almost the entire build area, with beds, furnishings and food/water for 38 settlers before I'd even hit "yellow" on the budget meter!

 

I absolutely SHUDDER to think what downtown Boston is like, I would be afraid to open it in the CK, for fear of running screaming from the room in disgust at Bugthesda's atrociously bad and inefficient map building.