Duskrider Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Sorry dude, but I consider evolution just as much of a religion as anything. You may consider it a religion, but you are wrong. It involves no supernatural elements, has nothing to say about your soul or any afterlife, says nothing about prayer and how to do it/who to do it to, says nothing about morality or how to live your life, and involves no faith. The only way to legitimately call evolution a religion is to make your definition of "religion" so uselessly broad that everything is a religion. And I mean everything... even basic statements like "I am writing something on this forum" or "force = mass * acceleration" would be a religious belief. If you read my posts you will see that I never said the students should not be taught evolution, merely that they should not have it taught as the only valid theory. The only reason I don't want to debate this is because I am smart enough to pick my battles. Evolution is taught as the only valid theory because it is the only valid theory. Maybe if you weren't homeschooled, you would understand what is required for something to be a scientific theory, and why none of the supposed "alternatives" come anywhere near this status. The only "alternatives" to evolution are from theology, and theology has no place in science classes. If the parents are acting as a subsitute for the school, they must be held to the same standards as schools, and that means teaching evolution as the only legitimate theory. Any homeschooling system where parents are able to avoid this responsibility is a complete failure and should result in the children being removed from their parents and given to someone who will raise them properly. That kind of failed system should be treated no differently than parents that simply keep their kids at home and never teach them anything. In any case, we are getting off topic. The questions is, Is homeschooling a valid option? Yes. Even if you think standardized tests suck, and I agree with you there, homeschoolers consistently do better in college than public schoolers. It's entirely on-topic, because evolution is a nice neat example of the failures of homeschooling to be held to the same standards as normal schools. Evolution is the only acceptable theory, and understanding it is necessary to get even the most basic understanding of modern biology. Additionally, teaching any other "alternative" presents fundamentally flawed definitions of "theory", the scientific method, and various other concepts critical to understanding modern science in general. Therefore any "education" that does not properly cover evolution is a failure. Now, with that in mind, consider the two alternatives: Normal schools are held accountable to very strict standards. Failure to meet them (for example, by refusing to properly teach evolution) results in either the school's license being revoked, or the individual teacher being fired, whichever is appropriate. Even if a teacher's students manage to pass the standardized tests, they can still be fired for refusing to teach the expected information. Homeschooling parents are NOT held to the same standards. Parents are free to teach their children whatever they want, as long as they can pass the standardized tests (a very easy task). There is no accountability, if the parents screw things up, the children just end up with a failed "education" and lack of qualifications for the real world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddycashmercury Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 I am done with this debate. Call me a coward, chicken, stupid, whatever the heck you feel like, but I'm done. You've got to pick your battles. The end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duskrider Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 I am done with this debate. Call me a coward, chicken, stupid, whatever the heck you feel like, but I'm done. You've got to pick your battles. The end. Concession accepted. Thank you for admitting that you have no actual facts on your side, and are just preaching your personal opinion. I hope this is also your concession that homeschooling in general is a fundamentally broken concept, and should not be allowed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddycashmercury Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 Did I say I conceded? Nope. I just said I am done with this particular debate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duskrider Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Did I say I conceded? Nope. I just said I am done with this particular debate. You don't need to say the word "conceded", your actions speak louder than any words. We have two possible options for why you would post this: 1) You know you are wrong, but won't admit it, and realize that if you keep posting you are only going to embarass yourself more and more. 2) You know you are wrong on the factual questions, and have only theology. Since preaching at me is against forum rules, you have no points left to make, and have to remove yourself from the debate. And given that this is a discussion of homeschooling, where the parents act as a substitute for an entirely secular state, this is also a concession that I am right. If you actually had any legitimate points left to make rather than conceding, you would make them. Since you do not, the conclusion is obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freddycashmercury Posted February 19, 2008 Author Share Posted February 19, 2008 Or I could be bored. I'm a bit annoying that way. If you really want to continue this debate, got to this forum. It's (convienently) a Homeschool Debate forum, chock full of educated homeschoolers. It's mainly for younger homeschoolers who participate in NCFCA, but I am sure you could join. If your "facts" are as solid as you say they are, you should have no problem debating there. Religion is allowed, and almost encouraged there. See you there... maybe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramul Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 The only "alternatives" to evolution are from theology, and theology has no place in science classes.What about Lysenkoism? It could be argued that it's not associated with theology... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duskrider Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 The only "alternatives" to evolution are from theology, and theology has no place in science classes.What about Lysenkoism? It could be argued that it's not associated with theology... It would be a laughable fraud, if not for the fact that so many people died as a result of that idiocy. The only business it has in science classes is as an example of pesudoscience and why you should avoid it. Kind of the same role that creationism should have, really. But the issue isn't really "are we allowed to teach these theories as examples of obsolete mistakes", it's that people try to teach bad science as if it were actually true. I have no problem with these "alternatives" being mentioned in a historical context, complete with explanations of why they are completely wrong. The problem is homeschoolers are not held accountable to that critical last part, and are free to teach any flawed "alternative" as equal in truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddah Posted February 19, 2008 Share Posted February 19, 2008 Now that this had denigrated into a religious debate/flame fest/screaming match; I shall exercise my duties and close it.. Religious discussions are forbidden on this forum and I tire of the endless prattle of opposing views.. This should serve as a word of advice, keep your beliefs and tenets off these forums, continue and the results may be painful. Buddah Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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